Chadfish
Veteran
Marketing my boy.... Marketing.
EX1 compare to GY-HM700U
- Thread starter Lor
- Start date
Marketing my boy.... Marketing.
GuyB
Well-known member
Complete rubbish.
Barry_Green
Moderator
And yet compellingly accurate. The EX1 is the most ergonomically difficult handheld camera that has ever been designed. Can you name one that's worse?
alaskacameradude
Veteran
I think maybe we should distinguish between fact and opinion here. There are
a lot of people with the same opinion as you Barry.....but not sure
that that makes it a fact. I personally do not have any problems handholding
it.....seems pretty similar to a PD-150 or DVX100 to me. Pretty much all
handheld cameras suck cause they put the strain on your wrists instead of
having it be on your shoulder. But my opinion is that it is not any harder
than any other mid sized handheld video camera......but you know what they
say....to each his own!
Barry_Green
Moderator
Well, I agree that the "opinion" segment is when I said that the handheld was "horrendous".
But the fact part is in the question -- is there any handheld camera that is worse than the EX1? I can't think of one. So, yes, to each his own, and maybe I could have said "because perhaps they prefer the HM700's form factor for handheld work over the EX1's" and that would have been less confrontational.
But -- I spoke it as I feel it. I think they're the worst for handheld that I've ever used, I would be very interested in knowing if there was anything that was actually more uncomfortable for handheld work.
But the fact part is in the question -- is there any handheld camera that is worse than the EX1? I can't think of one. So, yes, to each his own, and maybe I could have said "because perhaps they prefer the HM700's form factor for handheld work over the EX1's" and that would have been less confrontational.
But -- I spoke it as I feel it. I think they're the worst for handheld that I've ever used, I would be very interested in knowing if there was anything that was actually more uncomfortable for handheld work.
alaskacameradude
Veteran
Ya, the HM700, as a shoulder mount, would seem to be 'more comfortable' for long
periods of shooting 'while not on a tripod'. I would totally agree, that 'in my opinion'
shoulder mounted cameras are much easier for long periods of 'run and gun/no
tripod' shooting.
As for the 'worst for handheld'.....that's the part that I find opinions all over the
map. For example, in this thread from another forum...
http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/142/868127#868127
There is a comment about 6 DP's who all feel the EX-1 has 'better ergonomics'
than the Panasonic HVX200.
When I talk to a variety of people who use all sorts of cameras, they have
opinions that fall all over the map with regard to which handheld is the
'least sucky'. That was all I was saying. That being said, it IS cool to be
able to have a small handheld HD camera that gives you the quality that
ANY of these cameras will give you, for getting into tight spaces and new
and interesting points of view. The setup I have now for video production
would have probably cost in the hundreds of thousands of dollars not too
many years ago.
A friend of mine used to have a theory. He called it 'camera karma'. He could tell within
about a minute of picking up a new camera if it 'fit' with him or not. I think there is a lot
to that.....it's kind of an individual thing with no right or wrong answer.
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GuyB
Well-known member
Unlike some people I wouldn't pass judgement on the ergonomics of cameras I don't shoot regularly with. The question is irrelevant anyway, you said the "The Sonys are horrendous", which as I said, is complete rubbish. Having shot with an EX1 for 2 years now I find it quite comfortable to shoot with. It may not be a light camera but I happily accept that and have no problem with that for the quality of the lens which comprises most of its weight.
Clearly to make such a judgement you have been shooting with an EX1 for some time. How long would that be???
Barry_Green
Moderator
Long enough to determine that I thought it was horrendous to use hand-held.
Or am I not allowed to have an opinion on such a subject, without you cyber-stalking and "rubbishing" anything I say?
GuyB
Well-known member
Which is how long? I'm thinking here probably not more than a day....
Everyone is entitled to their opinion and I don't rubbish 'anything' you say, think about how much you say and what I respond too please before once again, you make outrageous and all encompassing unjustified and highly exaggerated claims.
If I see a blatantly incorrect or exagerated statement by anyone I will post a response, it's got nothing to do with who is posting it. If it happens to be you a lot perhaps you should consider why...
Barry_Green
Moderator
I used it for about four days before deciding that I would be plenty content to never see it again.
Besides, it doesn't take long to make up your mind on its ergonomic unsuitability. It took Adam Wilt around one day's usage before he declared it the least handholdable camera to use that he'd used, outdistancing the prior crown-holder, the HVX200... This quote is from his review in DV Magazine:
In the summary at the end of his review, he actually said "It’s painful to handhold". Painful. That was exactly my assessment as well. Of course, I assume now you'll accuse Adam Wilt of making outrageous, all-encompassing, unjustified and highly exaggerated claims" too?
I can back up anything I say, Guy. Opinion is opinion, which should be allowed, but if you want any backing for any factual statement I've ever made, I can provide it.
Really? Because that's *exactly* the way I feel about a lot of the stuff you post...
Tell you what: why don't you just put me on your "ignore" list and we'll all get along just so much better.
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That's why they have the top handle, great to use when shooting from the hip, flip up the eye viewfinder all the way and use it for a fore arm brace to steady the shot even more.
Barry_Green
Moderator
Excellent suggestion. Yes, let's.
I owned an EX1 and I have to say (in fact I have have said this many times before) that ergonomically, the EX1 is pretty bad in opinion. I have used the Z1, and I think the Z1 is much better if I'm going to be hand held. I have never shoot or own an HD camera or film camera before so I like almost everything about the EX1 except the hand held issue. It's like holding a dumbbell with the left side weighing 4 pounds and the right side 2 pounds. It's that imbalance. I would never shoot hand held for more than 10 minutes...perhaps because I'm a pretty small guy but I think that's one of the reasons why Sony does not make the EX3 the same as EX1.
Just my two cents.
Just my two cents.
GuyB
Well-known member
your telling me....
(that could be taken the wrong way depending on how it is read, I mean I agree with you)
Chadfish
Veteran
I have often wondered about the WristSHot from Hoodman. It may be cool for the EX1.
http://hoodmanusa.com/prodinfo.asp?number=H-WS1
.
Robert Ruffo
Well-known member
I agree the Ex1 is not suitable for handholding WITHOUT ACCESSORIES - but these accessories are cheap - DVrig HD is about $500, and there are many other alternatives - so for a still very low total price, you have an optimized shoulder cam with GREAT pic quality, that can record on SD cards (using a $35 accessory from MX and others) . Who cares about ergonomics when they are so cheap and easy to fix?
A friend of mine fixed his EX3 by rigging 15 lb excersize weights to rails.
Besides, some of us NEVER use shoulder shooting. I never do. Steadicam, jib, dolly and tripod only, for 100% of what we do, and we do docos, albeit high budget docos.
A friend of mine fixed his EX3 by rigging 15 lb excersize weights to rails.
Besides, some of us NEVER use shoulder shooting. I never do. Steadicam, jib, dolly and tripod only, for 100% of what we do, and we do docos, albeit high budget docos.
I'll agree with what one other poster said. If you need a camera with interchangable lens, spend the extra bucks and go with an EX3. If you can't afford it, chances are you can't afford additional lenses (Unless you already have some).
I have the HD100 and still like it, but will not be getting the HM700.
When I found out they don't offer 10bit out of the hd/sdi that pretty much killed the deal for me.
Obviously for some people that doesn't matter, but for my goals it did.
That being said, the ergonomics and the ability to shoot directly to quicktime are definite pluses for many. Don't underestimate that. Their latest firmware updates resolved many of the noise issues too.
But, IMHO, the camera is about 1K USD overpriced for the current market.
Emphasize, just my opinion.
I have the HD100 and still like it, but will not be getting the HM700.
When I found out they don't offer 10bit out of the hd/sdi that pretty much killed the deal for me.
Obviously for some people that doesn't matter, but for my goals it did.
That being said, the ergonomics and the ability to shoot directly to quicktime are definite pluses for many. Don't underestimate that. Their latest firmware updates resolved many of the noise issues too.
But, IMHO, the camera is about 1K USD overpriced for the current market.
Emphasize, just my opinion.