10bit should be 4 times better in gradations (1024 shades vs 256 shades). Look GH4 e-shutter 10bit RAW photos for gradations. The 10bit 4:2:2 video should be the same in luminance.
GH4 V-log
- Thread starter DeeZiD
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10bit should be 4 times better in gradations (1024 shades vs 256 shades). Look GH4 e-shutter 10bit RAW photos for gradations. The 10bit 4:2:2 video should be the same in luminance.
yes -- but a 10bit (=High 10 extension) H.264 version using the same bandwith would look against expection even worse = show more banding
, because 10bit support of the same quality in H.264 doesn't increase the filesize just by 20%, it doubles the needed bandwidth! so, you can think about a lot of different interesting aspects watching this misleading demonstration...
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Philip Goetz
Well-known member
This thread it titled "GH4 V-log". From what I can tell it is NOT in the December firmware update. Does anyone know where it is on the update road map?
Thanks!
Thanks!
Bern Caughey
Veteran
Don't understand what's misleading about about the banding test.
Seems clear evidence demonstrating a difference between 8-bit H.264 vs 8-bit ProRes vs 10-bit ProRes.
...and compression artifacts of different codecs using different bandwidth settings... a lot of variables, to deduce only one conclusion.
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Bern Caughey
Veteran
Thought that was a given considering we're discussing H.264 internal recording vs ProRes external. Don't think the test glossed over that fact & overall demonstrates exactly what was to be expected.
i don't have an external recorder to reproduce this shogun results in a more realistic way, but i shot some time-laps series today, to analyze the differences between raw-material, GH4-internal movie compressen and the influence of noise reduction and reduced bit-depth-settings on further compressing of pristine sources. this configuration is easily available to every GH4 owner and should reveal an even wider range of comparison/precission than this external recording results.
I'm wondering why there is a question here? Of course more bit depth and chroma samples will be better - less banding. Why would it ever be worse unless someone created a uselessly crappy, thus unsellable product.
Now, ask yourself, how much banding do you actually ever notice, and WHY are you noticing it? Is the content so boring you are noticing the tech? I notice banding while editing, but no one I know anywhere at anytime has EVER mentioned banding in movies, tv shows, or all the material I film.
Not saying it is not important to discuss, but why would better recordings NOT be better? My internal struggle is: is it $2500 better? To me right now it is not, but I don't do commercial work.
Now, ask yourself, how much banding do you actually ever notice, and WHY are you noticing it? Is the content so boring you are noticing the tech? I notice banding while editing, but no one I know anywhere at anytime has EVER mentioned banding in movies, tv shows, or all the material I film.
Not saying it is not important to discuss, but why would better recordings NOT be better? My internal struggle is: is it $2500 better? To me right now it is not, but I don't do commercial work.
attached is a little screenshot to show, what went wrong in stefan chechs demonstration.
both windows show exactly the same 8-bit content and the same y-curve-operation.
on the left side, the internal calculations use 8bit precission, on the right side 16 bit.
that's all for now!
i need a little bit more time to elaborate futher details...
and btw. -- i used RAW time-lapse sequenzes as source material for this actual tests and i was very surprised how muche more detail they reveal in comparsion to all other forms of output on a GH4.
It would be a nice surprise if V-log was included in the January firmware update, but I suspect it's mainly going to be a Shogun HDMI-trigger compatibility update, and that the V-log update will come later.
Ted Ramasola
Veteran
Panasonic could also pull something from its sleeve when they see the impact the shogun has on the A7s. Its probably why they're delaying it. If they see a market shift due to the 4K capability given to the A7s, they might try to put something out more than just HDMI triggering compatibility.
Lets hope they include V-log or something improved when they do release it come January.
Lets hope they include V-log or something improved when they do release it come January.
scenedirector
Well-known member
That's what I'm hoping for. Since the Shogun release, the A7s footage seems to be coming out in droves. With V-LOG coming out that 10Bit 4:2:2 stream, whew! The GH4 could be a real beast for the cost of a GH4/Shogun set up.
David Del Real
Well-known member
Was just wondering the same thing.
bumkicho
Well-known member
I really hope they add it to GH4. That'll make my decision easy. I don't need A7S for I have a full frame still camera and I don't need to shoot video at iso 12800. I rather have GH4 and in-body 4K, but I am not going to get one until v-log is added.