C200: Some good C200 footage appearing now!

Not to be disrespectful - I just don't get it, how can you look at this car footage and see anything different from 5 other current cameras, just looking at the footage there is no way anyone can tell where it came from, especially looking at it on the Tube. Just because its a pretty car does not increase the quality guys, there are too many variables. if you line up the C200, EVA, C300 GH5 or FS7 on this same car there would be a slim chance of "Guessing" who's who.

Don't buy the camera on its merits of Youtube videos, they all look alike, regretfully while the C200 is wonderful new technology, but it comes with baggage that many guys like myself are choking on. The only video review I've seen to show comparison is this one from ProAV

https://youtu.be/5wf_jDFsb-I

Regards - Mike
 
I'm adding a camera to my fleet and would really like it to be the C200 - I'm always shooting moving subjects and this is the only game going with an advanced auto-focus and raw. Owning a GH5 and DVX200 now, its hard for me to grasp the fact that Canon would not at least have a 10 bit format competitive to these cameras.

What Were They Thinkin . . . . .

Regards - Mike
 
Mike Mas said:
.... its hard for me to grasp the fact that Canon would not at least have a 10 bit format competitive to these cameras.

What Were They Thinkin . . . . .
Click to expand...
Well, usually here's what happens. I go on a rant about "what they were thinkin'", then NorBro tells me I am crazy. And, really, each of us is correct in his own way.
 
Mike Mas said:
I'm adding a camera to my fleet and would really like it to be the C200 - I'm always shooting moving subjects and this is the only game going with an advanced auto-focus and raw. Owning a GH5 and DVX200 now, its hard for me to grasp the fact that Canon would not at least have a 10 bit format competitive to these cameras.

What Were They Thinkin . . . . .

Regards - Mike
Click to expand...

Exactly, what were they thinking?

Let me try to decipher it using modern post workflow.

This is Canon EOS C200 Digital Cinema Camera, member of Cinema EOS family, intended for use in film industry by digital filmmakers.

Canon EOS C200 is NOT Digital Video Camera.

Proxy recording to SD card, raw to CFast 2.0 card (not RAW).

SD card straight to offline, ready to cut.

CFast 2.0 card to DIT. (If DIT doesn't have enough downtime, to data wrangler.)
3:2:1 back-up.
Verification through technical and visual checks.
Trancoding to uncompressed Log/linear DPX and scene-linear OpenEXR for color grading, visual effects and finishing.

That's it.

Remember, crucial factor in determining the right camera and workflow is the total volume of data to be generated.

C200 provides much higher standard of quality and greater flexibility in post-production workflow and leaves the interpretation of captured values to a later time.
This allows for a greater amount of choice in how the image is manipulated.

If you can't handle that volume of data, there are other alternatives.
Right solution for small crews / OMB is 10 bit log encoded compressed video codec.

Unfortunately, C200 doesn't offer such a lower quality recording option.

What C200 ofers is internal recording which is a great starting point for a HDR workflow.
 
Last edited:
laverdir said:
Exactly, what were they thinking?

Let me try to decipher it using modern post workflow.

This is Canon EOS C200 Digital Cinema Camera, member of Cinema EOS family, intended for use in film industry by digital filmmakers.

Canon EOS C200 is NOT Digital Video Camera.

Proxy recording to SD card, raw to CFast 2.0 card (not RAW).

SD card straight to offline, ready to cut.

CFast 2.0 card to DIT. (If DIT doesn't have enough downtime, to data wrangler.)
3:2:1 back-up.
Verification through technical and visual checks.
Trancoding to uncompressed Log/linear DPX and scene-linear OpenEXR for color grading, visual effects and finishing.

That's it.

Remember, crucial factor in determining the right camera and workflow is the total volume of data to be generated.

C200 provides much higher standard of quality and greater flexibility in post-production workflow and leaves the interpretation of captured values to a later time.
This allows for a greater amount of choice in how the image is manipulated.

If you can't handle that volume of data, there are other alternatives.
Right solution for small crews / OMB is 10 bit log encoded compressed video codec.

Unfortunately, C200 doesn't offer such a lower quality recording option.

What C200 ofers is internal recording which is a great starting point for an HDR workflow.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the reply - but for most guys who really want the 200, the fact it won't record what most current cameras offer is a set-back. In most cases, the guy who buys the C200 is not going to be a high-end film guy. This camera falls into the high-end professional format and for that reason 4K UHD 30-60 should be a no brainer. Why not have the formats that even their own cheaper cameras offer? Another problems is most guys who buy this camera are editing on the general Mac's and need manageable files for their everyday work flow.

It's my guess they just don't want the C200 to do everything because they have other higher end equipment they need to sell!

Regards - Mike
 
Mike Mas said:
Thanks for the reply - but for most guys who really want the 200, the fact it won't record what most current cameras offer is a set-back. In most cases, the guy who buys the C200 is not going to be a high-end film guy. This camera falls into the high-end professional format and for that reason 4K UHD 30-60 should be a no brainer. Why not have the formats that even their own cheaper cameras offer? Another problems is most guys who buy this camera are editing on the general Mac's and need manageable files for their everyday work flow.

It's my guess they just don't want the C200 to do everything because they have other higher end equipment they need to sell!

Regards - Mike
Click to expand...

It's definitely one of the most troll things Canon has ever done, but it's likely the camera could've just been an 8-bit 4K C100 replacement, the addition of the RAW really turns it into something unique in the space. I personally find the lack of 10-bit thing annoying, because I think that Canon should be doing more to differentiate between camera through hardware rather than software, but Canon always make their calculations exactly right, in a way that annoys users but still rakes in money.
 
If the C300 MKII didn't have it's infernal clamshell monitor and dual "in the way" cables for audio and video, I would have bought one over the C200. But the C200 RAW looks nice and I am shooting two documentaries with the format. I think as the card prices come down (the EgoDisk 256GBs for $299.00 really work well so far) and as the main editing programs come up to speed on editing CRL natively, a lot of the controversy about this camera's format choices will die down. The camera really is most at home shooting RAW and the images look very good. The .MP4s are really just the consolation prize format, handy for certain things but if you care about quality, Cinema RAW Light hits way above it's weight class. If you are mainly a broadcast shooter, C200 is the wrong camera for you, get a C300 MKII.

And yes, Canon definitely knows how to annoy me. Not about the 8-bit 4:2:0, I knew that going in, just about stupid things like no LUT assignable to HDMI output, no HDMI and SDI output at the same time, everytime you switch shooting SD and CFast card, the camera defaulting to 60p, even if you were shooting 23.98 in either format, camera factory default is to send magnify image out through the HDMI, there is a whole list of things that Canon did that are highly annoying and make no sense. But it's still a very usable camera overall.
 
I think I seen on a video somewhere on some software where you can change some of the parameters and downsizes the Canon Raw to other formats, does Canon supply that software?

Would we be able to shoot raw and convert to 4K UHD @60? would anyone have information on that?

I don't recall if there was anyway to get raw from the HDMI or SDI?

Thanks - Mike
 
Mike Mas said:
Thanks for the reply - but for most guys who really want the 200, the fact it won't record what most current cameras offer is a set-back. In most cases, the guy who buys the C200 is not going to be a high-end film guy. This camera falls into the high-end professional format and for that reason 4K UHD 30-60 should be a no brainer. Why not have the formats that even their own cheaper cameras offer? Another problems is most guys who buy this camera are editing on the general Mac's and need manageable files for their everyday work flow.

It's my guess they just don't want the C200 to do everything because they have other higher end equipment they need to sell!

Regards - Mike
Click to expand...
So you finally solved the riddle, good for you!
Thank you all again for derailing a thread about new C200 footage by over an over repeating
the unbearable truth that the C200 is not the camera it could be, if it only was up to you.
Forget about just buying a C300MII if you’re in desperate need of higher Bitrate codec or just
One of the other brands cameras out there.
No! Let’s repeat it one more time: The C200 isn’t the camera it could be.
In fact why not print T-shirt and other merchandise with that exact slogan.
If everyone thinking this would buy a shirt or mug maybe you could just buy a tricked
Out Alexa mini, leave this part of the forum for good and shoot that movie
You’ve been telling that girl at the party about, you know, the one that still
Hasn’t been made cause that freaking C200 just isn’t the camera it could be.
Damnitcanonareyouevenlistening????????
 
puredrifting said:
If the C300 MKII didn't have it's infernal clamshell monitor and dual "in the way" cables for audio and video, I would have bought one over the C200. But the C200 RAW looks nice and I am shooting two documentaries with the format. I think as the card prices come down (the EgoDisk 256GBs for $299.00 really work well so far) and as the main editing programs come up to speed on editing CRL natively, a lot of the controversy about this camera's format choices will die down. The camera really is most at home shooting RAW and the images look very good. The .MP4s are really just the consolation prize format, handy for certain things but if you care about quality, Cinema RAW Light hits way above it's weight class. If you are mainly a broadcast shooter, C200 is the wrong camera for you, get a C300 MKII.

And yes, Canon definitely knows how to annoy me. Not about the 8-bit 4:2:0, I knew that going in, just about stupid things like no LUT assignable to HDMI output, no HDMI and SDI output at the same time, everytime you switch shooting SD and CFast card, the camera defaulting to 60p, even if you were shooting 23.98 in either format, camera factory default is to send magnify image out through the HDMI, there is a whole list of things that Canon did that are highly annoying and make no sense. But it's still a very usable camera overall.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the reply - but so is the GH5 for $2,500 with a lens and the end product is practically the same! LOL
 
Spartacus said:
So you finally solved the riddle, good for you!
Thank you all again for derailing a thread about new C200 footage by over an over repeating
the unbearable truth that the C200 is not the camera it could be, if it only was up to you.
Forget about just buying a C300MII if you’re in desperate need of higher Bitrate codec or just
One of the other brands cameras out there.
No! Let’s repeat it one more time: The C200 isn’t the camera it could be.
In fact why not print T-shirt and other merchandise with that exact slogan.
If everyone thinking this would buy a shirt or mug maybe you could just buy a tricked
Out Alexa mini, leave this part of the forum for good and shoot that movie
You’ve been telling that girl at the party about, you know, the one that still
Hasn’t been made cause that freaking C200 just isn’t the camera it could be.
Damnitcanonareyouevenlistening????????
Click to expand...

Spartacus while your at it, getting T shirts and all, could you cram another Cfast slot in my C200 if I buy one?
 
Spartacus said:
So you finally solved the riddle, good for you!
Thank you all again for derailing a thread about new C200 footage by over an over repeating
the unbearable truth that the C200 is not the camera it could be, if it only was up to you.
Forget about just buying a C300MII if you’re in desperate need of higher Bitrate codec or just
One of the other brands cameras out there.
No! Let’s repeat it one more time: The C200 isn’t the camera it could be.
In fact why not print T-shirt and other merchandise with that exact slogan.
If everyone thinking this would buy a shirt or mug maybe you could just buy a tricked
Out Alexa mini, leave this part of the forum for good and shoot that movie
You’ve been telling that girl at the party about, you know, the one that still
Hasn’t been made cause that freaking C200 just isn’t the camera it could be.
Damnitcanonareyouevenlistening????????
Click to expand...

Loved this.
 
Mike Mas said:
Thanks for the reply - but so is the GH5 for $2,500 with a lens and the end product is practically the same! LOL
Click to expand...

Yes, of course, Panasonic GH5. I would say maybe even better results.

But why stop there? I get practically the same result from my 3 year old 4k phone.

And you know what? Few days ago, I just fired up my Panasonic NV-M25. Practically the same results.

And you'll never now! This must be your lucky day! I can sell it to you, with original case for just $2000.
Mint condition, Panasonic color science, just the battery is dead. EVF included.
Media is really, really cheep (if you can find them).
To use you words, practically Varicam.

You just saved $5,500!
 
DLD said:
Well, usually here's what happens. I go on a rant about "what they were thinkin'", then NorBro tells me I am crazy. And, really, each of us is correct in his own way.
Click to expand...

haha, we're both a little coo-coo.

I told you to make the 'DLDcam'...I'd preorder it before the C200 or EVA1, ha.
 
NorBro said:
... I told you to make the 'DLDcam'...I'd preorder it before the C200 or EVA1, ha.
Click to expand...

I think C400 (NAB'18 or CineGear'18?) will be the DLDCam that people will be trading their Red Ravens and Scarlet W's for.

Not to mention Alexa's, Amira's, Dragon's, Monstro's, Helium's, Varicam's, Varicam LT's, F-5/55/65's, Venice, FS-7, Apertus Axiom, Terra Cine and Ultra Panavision 70 Film Raw.
 
I applaud you for saying exactly what I wanted to say but hate getting into internet arguments. I dont get why people feel the need to get on a forum and bash a camera that isnt "perfect". It doesn't matter what the camera offers and how it shoots, its what you're shooting and how its put together that matters. We all have seen some good footage from smartphones to high end cinema cameras but its the story that makes this our passion to create. All im saying before people jump on this and derail it anymore, just go out and shoot and worry less about the specs there is no perfect camera and you should utilize what you have.

Spartacus said:
So you finally solved the riddle, good for you!
Thank you all again for derailing a thread about new C200 footage by over an over repeating
the unbearable truth that the C200 is not the camera it could be, if it only was up to you.
Forget about just buying a C300MII if you’re in desperate need of higher Bitrate codec or just
One of the other brands cameras out there.
No! Let’s repeat it one more time: The C200 isn’t the camera it could be.
In fact why not print T-shirt and other merchandise with that exact slogan.
If everyone thinking this would buy a shirt or mug maybe you could just buy a tricked
Out Alexa mini, leave this part of the forum for good and shoot that movie
You’ve been telling that girl at the party about, you know, the one that still
Hasn’t been made cause that freaking C200 just isn’t the camera it could be.
Damnitcanonareyouevenlistening????????
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
Hey Folks,
Just so you know, the C400 is literally your DREAM camera.
It's coming out soon, so don't buy anything else.
I would also get rid of your current cameras and girlfriends as well.
No point in having anything less than perfect.
 
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