Lets compare clips to be realistic.

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....like Scarlet Johanson ?

Up untill a few months a go the 7d did not exist and we have gotten more test footage out of and a real release for the 7d. So again Scarlet who ......
 
jamesmallonuk said:
You know when a new camera like this comes out people lose perspective. I really want a cheap DSLR to work as a filmaking tool I really do, and wonder if it will be Nikon who produces something that really looks like a serious tool. Of course we have heard all the arguments that a tool is just part of the work and with these digital VDSLR they can in the right hands be a filmaking tool.

But I would argue that I haven't seen one single clip of any DSLR that if I turn my technical brain off can be convinced it is anything more than good video. Red footage when properly graded and shot can truely allow you to believe you are watching a movie. So in conclusion I've yet to see something that will change my mind. Sure tha VDSLR's could be a great tool for certain tasks but if anyone here is an 'indie filmaker' they should wait for the scarlett and not waste their money. I think the Canons are way too contrasty for one thing.

So I challenge anyone to post DSLR work that can convince were are watching a movie. Here's a clip form the RED to get the ball rolling its by far the best I've seen but it furthurs my point. And yes lighting etc makes the difference but lets have some DSLR footage that is as convincing.

http://www.thedoorpost.com/hope/La Premiere/
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What r u talking about dude!? The red is a big beast that costs many times more than the 7D... stop comparing... Wait for the scarlet? Why not jus say "indie filmmakers should wait for an arbitrary camera that may come out in the future." Such funny mindset.
 
Scarlet is horrible ergonomically. At least the current model. It's huge and awkward. That fact really surprised me when I held one. Huge is obviously incredibly relative.

Also - don't underestimate what canon's picture style editor can do in terms of taking the cameras image to the next level. There are weird visual issues with all presets in the 5d, but infinite options using software canon bundles with that camera and is also including with the 7d.
 
bwwd said:
And for me this is the best footage from DSLR,i really have a hard time to believe its D90:
http://vimeo.com/3246212
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it looks great but scaling it down effectively hides the most obvious problems with the d90 image, we know the colors, the latitude and the bokeh is amazing, while it's impossible to tell the sharpness, richness in detail and compression artifacts at this res. i see nothing in that clip that would make me doubt its origin. what do you mean?
 
Its very well shot with proper equipment and smooth movement ,i know its SD quality but leave the HD sharpness and tell me where i can find similar clip from any DSLR ? I keep looking but i didnt found any clips shot like that .
Im still not 100% sure that its d90 cause compared to other d90 tests/videos it stands out so much.But if it is d90 then it proves that in the right hands DSLR footage can look incredible,especially after watching hundreds of overexposed jello tests.
 
Actually I have no problem with the form factor of DSLR's, the new Scarlett 2/3 looks just like a DSLR if it is configured in this form. The scarlett at least the fixed lens is comparable in price to the DSLR's or only marginally more. I just think while the image will be great from the 7D I don't think it is a good investment for an indie filmaker who really dreams of getting his work up on a big screen. Like I said I think Nikon has a more filmic option and if they can get rid of jello and be full HD then it could be a serious contender. But It wont be long for the Scarlett possibly by christmas I would guess so why not wait?
 
jamesmallonuk said:
I just think while the image will be great from the 7D I don't think it is a good investment for an indie filmaker who really dreams of getting his work up on a big screen.
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This is the asinine part of the whole premise. How many films actually get theatrical distribution? EVEN THE ONES SHOT ON FILM!!!! If anyone, as an up and coming filmmaker, is self-deluded enough to work under this premise... I don't know what to say, it's ridiculous and obtuse.
 
At least we know what we are getting with vdslr. Outside of an articulating screen, they will remain a dslr in form and hybrid function. I agree they are harder to use than a video camera (HPX 170, etc), but people will continue to make accessories that make it usable. The price, performance, size (no more lugging a Brevis adapter w/lenses around the world) and the fact that I can use it as a stills camera. I'm never going back and the 7D will be it for me - until the 5D Mark3 :grin:
 
Johnny Cola said:
This is the asinine part of the whole premise. How many films actually get theatrical distribution? EVEN THE ONES SHOT ON FILM!!!! If anyone, as an up and coming filmmaker, is self-deluded enough to work under this premise... I don't know what to say, it's ridiculous and obtuse.
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Well at least taken seriously, The whole point with the digital revolution that RED is part a professional short could be made for 10,000 dollars when a few years back you would be looking at 5-10 times that for film. I think your missing the point of what is going on and what is being put into your sweaty hands.

Saying that if you see yourself as a documentary filmaker or just a video production hobbist sure get a 7D and start shooting the kids at at home.

By the way big screen dosen't have to mean theatrical release it means being projected on a screen for others to see like an indie film festival!
 
bwwd said:
tell me where i can find similar clip from any DSLR ? I keep looking but i didnt found any clips shot like that
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i'm not sure what you mean. what exactly is it you see in this clip that you haven't seen in other professionally shot clips, like the trailer i posted earlier in this thread for example, or model/photographer, or some of the many 5d and d90 music videos out there?
 
jamesmallonuk said:
Well at least taken seriously, The whole point with the digital revolution that RED is part a professional short could be made for 10,000 dollars when a few years back you would be looking at 5-10 times that for film. I think your missing the point of what is going on and what is being put into your sweaty hands.

Saying that if you see yourself as a documentary filmaker or just a video production hobbist sure get a 7D and start shooting the kids at at home.

By the way big screen dosen't have to mean theatrical release it means being projected on a screen for others to see like an indie film festival!
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Well the "dream" of seeing it on the big screen is more than indie projections. Honestly if that was the dream, well hell, I'd like to invite everyone to my brother in-law's house. He projects on a 12x8 wall in what used to be his family room. I'm sure he'll let you live the dream!

EDIT: Referring to your last post before this of " ...the 7D I don't think it is a good investment for an indie filmaker who really dreams of getting his work up on a big screen" Keep it in context dude
 
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Hmmm, I must be in a bad mood today, so... here goes...

Look, the standard-def DVX has made plenty of big-screen films, theatrically-released pictures like "November", "Lonesom Jim", "Murderball", "9 Songs", "Mad Hot Ballroom", "The Aristocrats", and probably many more. Including Academy Award nominees like "Iraq In Fragments" and (again) "Murderball". And Sundance Cinematography award winners Murderball and November.

A standard-def DVX.

A 4:3-native, 360-line DVX. 360 lines of resolution when cropped to 16:9. Good enough for the big screen, good enough to get two oscar noms and to win Sundance's best-cinematography award. Twice. On the big screen.

An HVX200 was used for pickup shots in the theatrical release of Spielberg's "Munich" and Scorsese's "The Departed".

XHA1s and HV20s were used in Crank 2.

To say that you need a Scarlet or a Red One or ... ANYTHING ... to hide behind as an excuse as to why you're not making something for the big screen right now, is simply unsubstantiatable.

NO CAMERA IS GOING TO MAKE ONE BIT OF DIFFERENCE AS TO WHETHER YOU'RE SUCCESSFUL OR NOT.

Mark Pirro made over $500,000 off of his film "A Polish Vampire in Burbank". It was shot on Super 8. Super 8. As in, VHS quality Super 8. And when I say $500,000 I'm talking about 1985 dollars, 24 years ago... assuming 4% inflation, that'd be $1.3 million in today's dollars.

The cameras of today are good enough. An HV40 is good enough, if you've got the story to go with it. Put on a Letus Mini and go shoot. If you're waiting for a 7D or a Nikon something-or-other or a Scarlet or a GHX100 or whatever, then you're just hiding behind an excuse.
 
They did get rid of a lot of it on the D300s it looks like. Waiting for more reviews. But maybe the Nikons at a 720p looks more filmic than the Canon does at 1080? I really like the look of the Nikon. I think the Nikon is a serious contender . Really the DSLR's coming out with HD are all going to be pretty nice. The new D300s might have better auto focus for photography which I like.


jamesmallonuk said:
Actually I have no problem with the form factor of DSLR's, the new Scarlett 2/3 looks just like a DSLR if it is configured in this form. The scarlett at least the fixed lens is comparable in price to the DSLR's or only marginally more. I just think while the image will be great from the 7D I don't think it is a good investment for an indie filmaker who really dreams of getting his work up on a big screen. Like I said I think Nikon has a more filmic option and if they can get rid of jello and be full HD then it could be a serious contender. But It wont be long for the Scarlett possibly by christmas I would guess so why not wait?
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mattsand said:
i'm not sure what you mean. what exactly is it you see in this clip that you haven't seen in other professionally shot clips, like the trailer i posted earlier in this thread for example, or model/photographer, or some of the many 5d and d90 music videos out there?
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Ive seen your clip long time ago,it looks like its mostly handheld and mostly 50mm lens,on this link which i gave i see more lenses,dolly shots ,no jello at all and no white blowouts.Many music videos you say... ive seen some and mostly handheld ,without smooth pans and problems with exposure.
Well i see the difference ,if you dont see it so what can i say ?
 
Barry_Green said:
Hmmm, I must be in a bad mood today, so... here goes...

Look, the standard-def DVX has made plenty of big-screen films, theatrically-released pictures like "November", "Lonesom Jim", "Murderball", "9 Songs", "Mad Hot Ballroom", "The Aristocrats", and probably many more. Including Academy Award nominees like "Iraq In Fragments" and (again) "Murderball". And Sundance Cinematography award winners Murderball and November.

A standard-def DVX.

A 4:3-native, 360-line DVX. 360 lines of resolution when cropped to 16:9. Good enough for the big screen, good enough to get two oscar noms and to win Sundance's best-cinematography award. Twice. On the big screen.

An HVX200 was used for pickup shots in the theatrical release of Spielberg's "Munich" and Scorsese's "The Departed".

XHA1s and HV20s were used in Crank 2.

To say that you need a Scarlet or a Red One or ... ANYTHING ... to hide behind as an excuse as to why you're not making something for the big screen right now, is simply unsubstantiatable.

NO CAMERA IS GOING TO MAKE ONE BIT OF DIFFERENCE AS TO WHETHER YOU'RE SUCCESSFUL OR NOT.

Mark Pirro made over $500,000 off of his film "A Polish Vampire in Burbank". It was shot on Super 8. Super 8. As in, VHS quality Super 8. And when I say $500,000 I'm talking about 1985 dollars, 24 years ago... assuming 4% inflation, that'd be $1.3 million in today's dollars.

The cameras of today are good enough. An HV40 is good enough, if you've got the story to go with it. Put on a Letus Mini and go shoot. If you're waiting for a 7D or a Nikon something-or-other or a Scarlet or a GHX100 or whatever, then you're just hiding behind an excuse.
Click to expand...


Train stops here. In the end, it's whatever you can shoot with that makes you comfortable.
 
bwwd said:
Ive seen your clip long time ago,it looks like its mostly handheld and mostly 50mm lens,on this link which i gave i see more lenses,dolly shots ,no jello at all and no white blowouts.Many music videos you say... ive seen some and mostly handheld ,without smooth pans and problems with exposure.
Well i see the difference ,if you dont see it so what can i say ?
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well, i see *that* difference obviously, but i've no idea what that has to do with the camera; as long as it has a tripod mount you can put it on a dolly. btw my film was shot on a 24, 35, 50, 85, 18-55 and 70-210, all of them in the trailer actually. :-) let me rephrase: what about the image itself makes you doubt that it was shot on a d90, and aside from production value, what's so special about it?
 
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