GH5 How interested are you in a GH6 anymore?

I'm not sure if one can up-res 80 into 160 or not. I saw a tutorial on Gigapixel - I think it was Gigapixel - up-res of an old VHS video into 720p and it worked reasonably well. I also saw an up-res of an old VHS tape into 4K and it looked kind of fake. But that may be an intermittent step as technology improves.

This was the first vid.


PS. Off a different video, 720p is recommended as the lowest res video to be pushed into 4K. So, it's roughly an 8-timer. At this point.
 
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I tried it and it works well but really slow . On my Threadripper 1920 and 1080Ti it was processing VHS to HD progressive at about 0.1 frames a second !. I do not think the present version fully takes advantage of the hardware encoders etc in the M1 Mac's and that may be a reason for me to get a Mac after all these years of PC. The output had of course a watermark for the trial but the quality was really good and well worth recovering old family videos. Strangely it does not recognize m2ts from HDV or of course Bluray but will happily encode DVD files.

I am certainly looking forward to 22 Feb to see exactly what the GH6 has in store for us. I took advantage of Atomos offer and got Assimilate Play Pro to convert ProRes RAW files and it works well for my GH5S. Just hoping that the GH6 has RAW as well as simultaneously recording internal. That would seal it for me I think.
 
I was talking more for photos and not so much video. I don't really need beyond 4k video the R6 can already handle. This is more of an alternative for the 20 MP photos to make them 80 MP.

The higher digital processing has to go the worse it will look. a 2x increase of 20 MP is pretty easy to do and its 80 MP which is massive. Also the more detail you can start with the better, 720p to 4k is a huge jump and not a ton of pixels to start with.

Where I see an advantage to a tool like this is only jumping up 2x to have a little extra room to reframe and crop as needed and lose lose a ton of detail. Plus I don't always need 80 MP. I only have to use this tool when I do need a bit more detail. 99% of the time 20MP is more than enough for photos.

Another area I can see the benefit of a tool like this is noise reduction. Removing noise tends to also remove fine detail. Being able to get some of that detail back and scale back down can help reduce noise and still keep some level of fine detail.

Its also a good tool when one does need to shoot APSC on a FF camera. In my case on the R6 thats even lower than UHD resolution so even a 1.5x boost could help a lot.

For video its a nice but insanely slow method to help slow motion limited to HD upscale to 4k. If I had to choose between HD at 120p and 4k at 60p with optical flow the HD upscaled with these tools might be better. At least the results would be consistent with less chance of random artifacts. I would never consider using it on an entire project but in those cases where we have no choice but to shoot lower resolution.

This is an interesting solution as well to convert 4k video to 8k video. Not sure why anyone would need to but its there. 5.7k video on a GH6 on the other hand would upscale with this to 8k very well. I would bet not many would be able to tell the difference between that and 8k from the Canon R5. It is insanely slow however so one would be nuts to do it.
 
Yes I do not think the tool is sensible to convert 2 hours of video at the moment. It does work though. However it will be interesting to see how the technology can be improved in the future. I for one would love to deinterlace and cleanup hours of old family videos.
 
Ron Evans said:
Yes I do not think the tool is sensible to convert 2 hours of video at the moment. It does work though. However it will be interesting to see how the technology can be improved in the future. I for one would love to deinterlace and cleanup hours of old family videos.
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Same here. I explored using it to up convert my own wedding video from 720x576 25p 4x3 to 4k so I crop and scale down to 16x9 HD. worked pretty good. Then I got divorced so screw that. lol
 
Whats interesting about the APSC crop mode on the R6 is upscaled 2x with Gigapixel is pretty much right back to the 32 MP I had on the Canon M6 mk2. So I more or less have the same kind of APSC 32 MP camera again. I don't plan on doing that a lot for photos but its there as an option. I think it would be better to just shoot FF 20 MP, scale 2x and then crop but sometimes a APSC lens may have to be used. I still need to replace a Tamron 17-50 f2.8 APSC with a Tamron 24-70 f2.8 FF. Now at least I could kind of use the 17-50 for photos.

The Canon R6 APSC crop mode uses 3420 pixels to upscale to 3840 which results in slightly softer video. With the video application I could upscale to 8k to get a bit more detailed 4k.

This tool for video could mean the difference between 1:1 4k video and over sampled 4k video. Essentially providing enough added detail to mimic the extra detail gained from over sampling. Could be nice for 1:1 cinema cameras like the P4k which should upscale very well to 8k video. That would be a nice 8k delivery or a very nice over sampled 4k delivery. A lot of processing just of that but yeah if it gets faster this could be very interesting.
 
rumors from 43rumors

A source told me this about the soon to be announced new GH6:
  • rolling shutter is eliminated
  • Not sure if they also eliminated mechanical shutter but there is a chance for it.
  • And last but not least a massive improvement in AF. It may called DFD AI. They claim that tracking is 5 times better than in GH5.
 
There will be rolling-shutter artefacts unless the sensor has a global shutter, which it won’t have because image quality takes a big hit with a global shutter.

The camera is shaping up to be interesting. I think it will support Raw output despite the high pixel count. However, using Raw from these cameras, even my GH5S, is not trivial. You can’t use many native Micro Four Thirds lenses because, like full-frame mirrorless lenses, they use software correction for distortion (and some other aberrations that are less of a show-stopper, like lateral chromatic). So with Raw you’re having to correct massive distortion in post. Even if you have a workflow that can do that, it affects the framing. Then of course there’s the usual noise reduction to perform, monstrous file sizes, etc.

Raw could still be interesting with some of the cine-labelled glass with a Micro Four Thirds mount.

I’m still unsure what the max frame rate with full-width all-pixel readout will be. If they can pull off 120p that would be quite something. An α7S III for far less and with more video features and assist tools … but minus the phase-detect AF, it seems. Hmm.
 
Thomas Smet said:
When did we hear similar low light to the GH5S? I personally see that as physically impossible but hey what do I know. The law of physics are really working against that one. We also have not heard if it will have external raw support.
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we didn’t hear that - we haven’t heard hardly anything. It’s just my expectation. The new OM camera has a 2 stop improvement with their new sensor tech, supposedly. So if the GH6 can achieve something similar that would put it in the same ballpark as the GH5S which was 2 stops better than the GH5. As for raw, that’s also on the new OM, supposedly, and I’d be surprised if they didn’t try to offer this to keep competing against other market offerings.

just my personal speculation.
 
well, could have greater light-gathering potential thanks to quad bayer implementation. and part of the low-light chops of low-light cameras is just where they put the 2nd native iso. a7siii is noisier than a7iv at iso 3200-6400 but less noisy above that because a7siii has 2nd native iso at 12800 and I think the a7iv has it at 3200
 
The GH5S has ProRes RAW and BRAW support so I am not sure why they would bring out a new top of the GH line without RAW support. Also most of the rest of their high end line up do have RAW support. Would be another difference to the GH5M2 too. Of interest to me is if the sensor is larger than normal 4/3 to get the same multi aspect functions as the GH5S.
 
Ron Evans said:
The GH5S has ProRes RAW and BRAW support so I am not sure why they would bring out a new top of the GH line without RAW support. Also most of the rest of their high end line up do have RAW support. Would be another difference to the GH5M2 too. Of interest to me is if the sensor is larger than normal 4/3 to get the same multi aspect functions as the GH5S.
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High end in terms of FF cameras yes. For m43 so far only the 1:1 4k sensor cameras have added ProRes Raw. Many of us assumed the GH5 II would have had ProRes Raw with its newer processing power but alas it did not happen and doesn't seem to be happening. Thats of course no guarantee that will be true of the GH6. Just stating that so far no higher resolutions stills sensor m43 camera has had external ProRes Raw support.

I hope for the sake of the camera it does have it. I'm also wondering just how useful it will be. Raw on the GH5S is also pushing it at higher ISO levels much like the P4k. You pretty much have to use noise reduction in post unless you can get by shooting raw only at the optimal ISO. Then again thats kind of true of any raw camera including the Canon R5. Then again I feel the same way about log and it almost always needs some post NR.

Thats why I like the prospect of shooting HDR PQ on the Canon R6. I get the color and DR benefits all in a standard looking profile with much lower noise. There are many situations where I just don't want to mess with raw or log anymore and thats where HDR now comes in for me.
 
I think they were careful with the GH5 ii not to cannibalize the future GH6, while offering some essential updates to keep it relevant in coming years. I wouldn’t look to the lack of raw on the GH5 ii as a sign the GH6 won’t have it. If anything it’s likely more a sign that it will have it, given that it’s technically possible and they opted to withhold it - for what I presume to be differentiation reasons.

After all, Panasonic has to play that game - what the GH6 lacks in sensor size it will make up for in higher end options elsewhere.

Now the one thing I’ve always hoped they would do I unfortunately think is unlikely at this point, that is, built in ND filters. But I’m hoping they’ll have the insight to this time crank that LCD up to 11 so it’s a truly useable display, thus allowing the GH6 to really operate without the need for an external screen and thus play to its small, nimble, and light strengths.
 
43 rumors said,

The autofocus will be improved by quite a bit, but I can now confirm with 100% certainty that the GH6 will not use a phase detection system. Let’s hope Panasonic engineers found some “trick” that can really fix their flawed af system…

A source told me this about the soon to be announced new GH6:
  • rolling shutter is eliminated
  • Not sure if they also eliminated mechanical shutter but there is a chance for it.
  • And last but not least a massive improvement in AF. It may called DFD AI. They claim that tracking is 5 times better than in GH5.
  • no phase detection AF.
So maybe the DFD AI will be better?
 
Two years ago, maybe even a year ago, I would say absolutely not - but I can see Canon and Sony allowing it now since it's MFT and most have moved onto 8K and full-frame.

I hope its AF is great.
 
My opinion - which is based on a hunch and the appreciation of the cartel - was that pulsing was not an auto focus problem but a deliberate cripple hammer in software of the cameras. To wit, Fuji XT-3.

In any case, Panasonic was "allocated" only contrast detect and Nikon only phase detect by the powers-that-be. Olympus had both but still struggled with the continuous AF. Nikon still has only phase detect but Z9 has a quality AF due to a more powerful processing.
 
DLD said:
My opinion - which is based on a hunch and the appreciation of the cartel - was that pulsing was not an auto focus problem but a deliberate cripple hammer in software of the cameras. To wit, Fuji XT-3.

In any case, Panasonic was "allocated" only contrast detect and Nikon only phase detect by the powers-that-be. Olympus had both but still struggled with the continuous AF. Nikon still has only phase detect but Z9 has a quality AF due to a more powerful processing.
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The pulsing isn't a cripple rather its just how contrast detect works for photography.These cameras were originally designed for photography long before video. In photography it's more important the camera quickly acquires focus not how smoothly it does. Who cares if the camera is pulsing in between pictures as it shifts the focus in and out to make a comparison to see if the subject is still in focus?

Both Canon and Sony use a similar and superior method that proves no one is preventing anyone from improving the AF, just a matter of Panasonic's hubris, laziness, incompetence, cheapness, (use whatever word works for you) for not changing their AF to what is the accepted best method. This would require them to admit they're wrong then spend the time and money to change it.
 
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Peter C. said:
The pulsing isn't a cripple rather its just how contrast detect works for photography.These cameras were originally designed for photography long before video. In photography it's more important the camera quickly acquires focus not how smoothly it does. Who cares if the camera is pulsing in between pictures as it shifts the focus in and out to make a comparison to see if the subject is still in focus?

Both Canon and Sony use a similar and superior method that proves no one is preventing anyone from improving the AF, just a matter of Panasonic's hubris, laziness, incompetence, cheapness, (use whatever word works for you) for not changing their AF to what is the accepted best method. This would require them to admit they're wrong then spend the time and money to change it.
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Good point about the photography. Hopefully the AF is fixed or is a lot better. In some situations continues AF can be turned off, or even manual focus. I want to see the whole package on the gh6 before I decided.
 
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