The New F

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Barry_Green said:
Y'know, Sony isn't THAT big anymore. They've hemorrhaged and lost a lot over the years, their TV business basically disappeared, and now they're down to about a $11.9 billion market cap. Sure, that sounds large, but consider their arch-rival Panasonic is now bigger than them ($14.4 billion) and that Apple, the company that out-Sony'd Sony, is a $567 billion company! Yes, Apple is valued by the market at over 40 times what Sony is.

Apple's earning $45/share, and Sony's losing almost six dollars per share (and since their valuation is only $11.85/share, losing half that value per year isn't a good long-term trend).

Now consider that the vast majority of Sony's revenues come from non-broadcast, non-video-oriented things, like the Playstation, and it starts to shape up that as far as their broadcast business goes, it's not really all that big. Consider that the entire Imaging Products & Solutions section of their business did only about 13% of the total sales of Sony overall. And of that 13%, what (probably tiny) portion of that was broadcast? And of that probably tiny portion, what vastly tinier portion was large-sensor camcorders (versus traditional broadcast, and monitors, and media, and decks, and whatever else they sell)?

So are they a big bumbling behemoth who's too big to listen? Not anymore. They were, yes, they were profoundly arrogant and disconnected and overbearing, and they got their *** handed to them in the marketplace. But maybe that finally woke them up, because this sure seems like a New Sony. Now they're turning out really interesting products, at a furious pace.

People know I've been a fan of the Panasonic lineup since 2003, when the DVX100 was first introduced. People don't necessarily know that prior to the DVX, I was a Sony-only guy, but frankly they haven't made a product since 2003 that I thought was interesting enough to buy. The FS700 came close, but I can't stand the form factor, the F3 was pretty close but I hate the XDCAM codec and didn't want to have to go to multiple boxes, etc... But from what I'm hearing grumbled about the new F cameras, I think Sony has decided to bring a gun to the gun fight. At least in the top professional arena, targeting the Canon Cinema series and the Red series.

Too big to listen, and too big to respond? Not necessarily... check out the announcements before writing them off entirely.
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Well during the announcement on Oct 30th, the rice will be in the pudding.
 
Grug said:
I think price/performance-wise the C500 is actually quite unique in the market at the moment, offering the only half-way point between F3/C300/Scarlet price/features and those of Epic/Alexa/F65.
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That's exactly my point. I don't think the C500 or Sony's upcoming competitor to it (just my theory, I admit) are really Epic competitors and I don't think either would affect scare Red into price changes.
 
rx8pilot said:
I am not saying RED is evil or makes bad pictures - I just like the history and methodical approach to building a complete system that Sony has always had. Even if there were less pixels, megabits, or something else - they always seem to work in the worst of circumstances. RED has not yet earned my trust as they have just recently created a system in my opinion.
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Some guys like brunettes, some prefer blondes...

I agree with Barry, Sony haven't produced a real head-turner in years, maybe the New F will be the one or maybe Sony simply have a new PR firm.
 
I agree with Barry, Sony haven't produced a real head-turner in years, maybe the New F will be the one or maybe Sony simply have a new PR firm.
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the FS700 was a real head-turner IMO... Ok, not in terms of minimum broadcast specs, but on the whole its a huge bang for the buck...
 
Liam Hall said:
Nope. I felt the launch of the FS700 was largely uninspiring and the claim made then that Sony was listening to professionals lacked authenticity.
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You're referring to the launch of the product, not the actual product itself, which is what your original post was about.
 
LiamR said:
You're referring to the launch of the product, not the actual product itself, which is what your original post was about.
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I'm referring to both. I don't think the FS700 is a head turner. Not for me at least, I don't like the design or the codec. I can see it's attraction for others though, particularly with the high frame rates.
 
Liam Hall said:
I'm referring to both. I don't think the FS700 is a head turner. Not for me at least, I don't like the design or the codec. I can see it's attraction for others though, particularly with the high frame rates.
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Oh, well my bad for assuming you meant a head-turner for the industry, not for yourself.
 
LiamR said:
Oh, well my bad for assuming you meant a head-turner for the industry, not for yourself.
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I don't speak on behalf of the industry. Everyone here is giving there own opinion. I'm a customer of these companies and I'll give my opinion. Is that OK with you?
 
Press embargo is until 2 am Eastern on 10/30. Sony has scheduled a Facebook chat for 3 pm Eastern hosted by Jon Fauer. I and several other media who were briefed so that we could file our stories have also been invited to chime in.

Of course, by Tuesday I'm going to be without electricity and hopefully still have a roof. I was planning on conserving iPad power and logging on LTE. But $#%(@) Verizon-- if you don't activate LTE for 90 days, the sim fries. Verizon rep said "Just go to the Verizon store on Monday and get a new sim." Yes. In tropical storm force winds I'm going to drive my wife's aging Corolla to Garden State Plaza in Paramus (I'm expecting by mid morning a tree coming down on the garage crushing my BMW). AT&T iPads truly yet you activate and deactivate without the sim frying. Could we please turn anti-corporate wrath to Verizon and give Sony a break?

Seriously, Barry really hit the nail on the head. I was a Panasonic user and then a Sony user again. I interact closely with all the manufacturers because they want product publicized and reviewed. To be fair, other than the occasional lunch, I don't get freebies or discounts. I remember the old Sony and the old Panasonic and now see Sony-Panasonic 2.0. I take that back. I have an 8gb SDHC card from the FS700 I just reviewed. I promise you that my review is not influenced because I forgot to return to Sony a $10 memory card.

I believe we are about to see something from Sony which will provide tremendous market interest which will be good for us. Nothing is perfect and we will all have criticisms. Red's introduction of Scarlet and the pending price drop of Epic is good for us. BM Cinema Camera is good for us.

Whenever I'm able to get on line during what will possibly be a protracted power outage, I will be interested in hearing objective opinions after Tuesday morning-- not fanboy and not cynical.

Awaiting the brunt of Sandy...

Ned
 
nsoltz said:
Press embargo is until 2 am Eastern on 10/30. Sony has scheduled a Facebook chat for 3 pm Eastern hosted by Jon Fauer. I and several other media who were briefed so that we could file our stories have also been invited to chime in.

Of course, by Tuesday I'm going to be without electricity and hopefully still have a roof. I was planning on conserving iPad power and logging on LTE. But $#%(@) Verizon-- if you don't activate LTE for 90 days, the sim fries. Verizon rep said "Just go to the Verizon store on Monday and get a new sim." Yes. In tropical storm force winds I'm going to drive my wife's aging Corolla to Garden State Plaza in Paramus (I'm expecting by mid morning a tree coming down on the garage crushing my BMW). AT&T iPads truly yet you activate and deactivate without the sim frying. Could we please turn anti-corporate wrath to Verizon and give Sony a break?

Seriously, Barry really hit the nail on the head. I was a Panasonic user and then a Sony user again. I interact closely with all the manufacturers because they want product publicized and reviewed. To be fair, other than the occasional lunch, I don't get freebies or discounts. I remember the old Sony and the old Panasonic and now see Sony-Panasonic 2.0. I take that back. I have an 8gb SDHC card from the FS700 I just reviewed. I promise you that my review is not influenced because I forgot to return to Sony a $10 memory card.

I believe we are about to see something from Sony which will provide tremendous market interest which will be good for us. Nothing is perfect and we will all have criticisms. Red's introduction of Scarlet and the pending price drop of Epic is good for us. BM Cinema Camera is good for us.

Whenever I'm able to get on line during what will possibly be a protracted power outage, I will be interested in hearing objective opinions after Tuesday morning-- not fanboy and not cynical.

Awaiting the brunt of Sandy...

Ned
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Watching the weather from afar Ned, ( here in France right now ). I hope that you and yours fare safely through today and the next couple of days. Listening on the web to the reports on NPR it sounds to be a real b*****d......I'm happy not to be in Baltimore today.
Peter
 
Thanks, Peter. Baltimore/Washington will have the combination of the high wnds plus heavy rain. Because of storm path, NYC area will have the storm surge and winds but less rain.
 
Looks like zeiss glass will be in new Sony lenses.....

Also someone mentioned codec, I was at Sony F65 presentation earlier this year and know they are heavily trying to push the SRMaster codec, so I suspect we'll see SRMaster lite 220mbps for the ext. 4k recorder.
 
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