Rodney Charters ASC on HDSLR's, and more
- Thread starter LuckyStudio 13
- Start date
Chris Santucci
Veteran
Exactly. Whatever he or anyone else says isn't going to change the reality that DP's are shooting mucho projects with these cameras (yes, over film and over Red and over everything else) - because - "... it's perfectly good enough - not just as a compromise..."
Debating about it isn't going to change that. Will that ever change? Who cares?
.
Jason Ramsey
Admin
It's being used in "mucho projects" not only as a result of it being a capable tool in capable hands, but b/c those capable hands are choosing the appropriate tool for for a given task. Each "task" will yield different answers. Cameras like the 7D are incredibly appropriate for some situations, and also incredibly capable... That's never been an issue in contention by any reasonable person.
I don't see how that conclusion could be drawn from this video in the first place...
Everything has compromises... along every step of the creative process.
Rodney's sage words on many tools available to today's filmmakers are measured and informative. The spirited debate we see here (and in other forums), where RED has indeed been compared to the GH1, is akin to conversations I remember from the earliest days of DVXUser. Then, it was 16mm film versus the new DVX100!
I had no advance knowledge of the DVX100, but immediately knew something had shifted when I worked with a brand new one on the short film, Lost & Found in late 2002. The 100 might not have had the resolution, but Panasonic nailed other qualities intrinsic to film to such an extent that many started to completely second-guess how they were acquiring their footage.
One documentary director literally abandoned his S-16mm production after his first day with me and my HVX200. Not only did he never look back - he went and bought his own HVX within weeks of our shoot. Almost anecdotally, November and other feature films were lensed on the DVX100. But at the end of the day, they were really just experiments. That's where we are with the current generation of DSLRs.
The HDDSLRS are another step forward, but they're far from perfect. A lot can and has been said about their shortcomings. What is exciting is that Canon and Panasonic and perhaps even Nikon are listening to this community - and each new generation of cameras will be better geared toward the needs of filmmakers. Heck, even Sony consumer seems bent on getting a seat at this table.
As the manifestation of Francis Coppola's prediction that a "...fat girl in Ohio is going to be the new Mozart - you know - and make a beautiful film with her little father's camera..." continues forward, I hope people who come to DVXUser for information will find a collaborative place for honest discussion.
There's been a lot of heat around the DSLR threads and it's changed the tone on the boards a bit. Passion is good. We're all creative people or we wouldn't be here. But better conversations are going to take place if we all think of the cameras as tools and nothing more. And yeah, I've been as excited about that new 21 ounce straight-claw hammer with hickory handle as the next guy, but it's better if I don't bash people over the head with it to convince them of its virtues.
ATL Media Group
Veteran
So, in other words.... "Stop picking out a hammer and hit the nail already!"
:happy:
Ian-T
Veteran
Yeah he did a good job. This is not the first time he’s interviewed Mr. Charters. But this time around he seemed more comfortable and asked the right questions.
This is a must see. There's part one and two totaling over 40 minutes of info from professionals that have the most extensive experience with this camera in the trenches.
Shane Hurlbut, ASC & Bandito Bro's interview about the 5DII (A Disruptive Technology)
http://www.freshdv.com/2010/05/conversations-bandito-hurlbut.html
The thread is here:
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=211458
I'm not sure why a 40 minute interview with DP Shane Hurlbut ASC (The DP that has the most experience with the 5D) wasn't made a sticky since this little 5min? interview with Rodney Charters was. I assume the mods missed it but here it is.
Shane Hurlbut, ASC & Bandito Bro's interview about the 5DII (A Disruptive Technology)
http://www.freshdv.com/2010/05/conversations-bandito-hurlbut.html
The thread is here:
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=211458
I'm not sure why a 40 minute interview with DP Shane Hurlbut ASC (The DP that has the most experience with the 5D) wasn't made a sticky since this little 5min? interview with Rodney Charters was. I assume the mods missed it but here it is.
One point which I think has been missed here and even by Rodney Charters is that even though the 5D levels the playing field from a technological point of view, it is not just the fact that a DP lights a scene which distinguishes a pro from an amateur.
Too much emphasis on equipment, technology and our tools in these forums tends to create craftsman, but not necessarily artists or professionals with a distinct point of view. We are more than our tools. More than just camera operators. If we fail to make that distinction, how can we possibly expect our clients to?
Everyone can snap a technically decent photo these days with a $2500 camera body (as Charters says), but you still know a Helmut Newton picture when you see it for instance. I am quite sure that whatever film or format or technical tool he used he would make pictures which were distinctly his own. That is why he was hired for his jobs, not because he often shot with a certain type of camera.
Bruce Weber shoots with traditional film and in 6x7 format, for stylistic, not technical reasons. With 5 assistants (I know I used to be one) believe me he can do whatever he wants, when he wants.
Christopher Doyle to use another example, is not a film stock, a lighting setup or a particular camera either. He is more than just a craftsman who is able to fulfill a variety of different technical needs depending on the project. He is far more than just a man with some great tools. He has a style which is based on how he looks at the world and which is very distinct, which has been developed over a long period of time and which is his own.
So what is the difference between a Pro and an amateur in this arena where the playing field is being leveled as Charters says?
What makes it pro is that an experienced image-maker has a style and a point of view which is akin to a personal vocabularly. We all learn to speak at a very early age, but it takes a very long time, a lot of dedication, a unique outlook and indeed some talent to make a worthy poem.
Too much emphasis on equipment, technology and our tools in these forums tends to create craftsman, but not necessarily artists or professionals with a distinct point of view. We are more than our tools. More than just camera operators. If we fail to make that distinction, how can we possibly expect our clients to?
Everyone can snap a technically decent photo these days with a $2500 camera body (as Charters says), but you still know a Helmut Newton picture when you see it for instance. I am quite sure that whatever film or format or technical tool he used he would make pictures which were distinctly his own. That is why he was hired for his jobs, not because he often shot with a certain type of camera.
Bruce Weber shoots with traditional film and in 6x7 format, for stylistic, not technical reasons. With 5 assistants (I know I used to be one) believe me he can do whatever he wants, when he wants.
Christopher Doyle to use another example, is not a film stock, a lighting setup or a particular camera either. He is more than just a craftsman who is able to fulfill a variety of different technical needs depending on the project. He is far more than just a man with some great tools. He has a style which is based on how he looks at the world and which is very distinct, which has been developed over a long period of time and which is his own.
So what is the difference between a Pro and an amateur in this arena where the playing field is being leveled as Charters says?
What makes it pro is that an experienced image-maker has a style and a point of view which is akin to a personal vocabularly. We all learn to speak at a very early age, but it takes a very long time, a lot of dedication, a unique outlook and indeed some talent to make a worthy poem.
Last edited:
Great find, man. Thanks for posting it. Interesting, Hurlbut mentioned that "men of Valor" was budgeted at 88 million but because of the 5D platform, they turned it in for 11 million. That's the power of this platform. It turns out a filmic image and the ability to shoot a sequence that would have taken eight days with 35mm film cameras in one day with the 5D. This camera speaks the language that any Hollywood producer understands.
note: I went to the doctor and he diagnosed me with Hurlbut syndrome. Symptoms: Optimistic with an over abundance of "can do" attitude.
It will not be very long before this isn't a pleasant surprise for a producer, but rather an expectation.
I have already seen this happen in photography.
The consequences for us on the less auspicious scale are going to be dramatic as well. Don't be surprised if the same job you did 3 years ago will be held out to you with 1/4 the budget and the instructions to use these cameras as well.
"Conversations" with Charters
"Conversations" with Charters
Thanks for the linkage and the kind words. Interesting...the next installment of our FreshDV Conversations with Filmmakers series is from an 1.5hr sit down interview with Charters. Look for that in a few weeks.
"Conversations" with Charters
Thanks for the linkage and the kind words. Interesting...the next installment of our FreshDV Conversations with Filmmakers series is from an 1.5hr sit down interview with Charters. Look for that in a few weeks.
Matt Gottshalk
Resident Preditor
Otis Grapsas
Carbonite Member
This guy is a Canon salesman in my book.
I disagree very strongly with that statement. If you spend just a few minutes chatting about DSLRs with Rodney, it's easy to see that he understands the technology for what it is...warts and all.
Otis Grapsas
Carbonite Member
I don't understand how someone can think so highly of a Canon dSLR and disregard the top of the line Sony in that fashion.
A salesman will tell you that you can make a feature film with this cam and it will look great on an Imax screen. This guy has done that and has the experience to make that claim. Most salesman don't.
This "guy" (Hurlbut) as you choose to refer to this man that has the right to put ASC after his name is giving Canon his input to make a camera that is even better for his uses than the 5DII, and that will ripple down to us all. He wouldn't be using this technology if it didn't perform for his clients. So, I'm not sure what your point is by trying to insult him by calling him a salesman.
As they say: "You can always spot the pioneers. They're the ones with all the arrows in their back."
No problem. I'm looking forward to the Charters interview, but he has pretty limited experience with the 5DII compared to some others. You might want to consider Gale Tattersall who was the DP on the House episode. He seems to be the reigning king of the DSLR at the moment with Hurlbut coming up with "Men of Valor" in the fall.
I think it comes down to skin tone reproduction from what I can gleen from the statements of some of these DPs. Hurlbut also mentions the 5DII as having unbeatable skin tones and just doesn't look digital. He also slams Genesis and Phantom in this regard and says they don't hold a candle to the 5DII. Dangerous rhetoric I know.
