I wonder if the other existing ones like the 12-35 and 100-300 can support it with a firmware update?
GH4 Panasonic GH5 coming in 2017
- Thread starter Dan Keeble
- Start date
I shoot a lot "family" or "recording memories" stuff or hiking, skiing, sporting videos. I set up exposure usually with auto using A or S and auto iso. Panasonic auto exposure gives almost always very good brightness and I can fine adjust it with EV comp. When concentrating subject or the situation is difficult the auto exposure is the best way to get right brightness. Panasonic auto exposure works slowly and it makes seldom rapid changes in exposure when there is sudden changes in light. I can also use AE-lock in difficult scene.
The most important is to see exposure values when composing or starting the clip. With auto exposure it is much faster and for me more accurate to dial proper values than using all three value combinations with manual. It is also a good way to always minimize iso and noise and prevent clipped highlights. I want to see that aperture is not going too small or shutter speed too high or too low. Just like with photos. I can react dialing values when light changes dramatically if I can see what the cameras automatic value does. For example with auto iso I can dial shutter speed lower or image darker if the auto iso wants to go too high. Dialing exposure with auto is smoother than dialing with manual.
GH5 is a consumer camera and I think many users are not professionals after all. I wonder why Panasonic wants to make my kind of shooting more difficult. It would make no harm to others if they must see exposure values. 4k/6k photo video and smartphone app shows exposure info already very well. Why this info must be removed from camera screen in video mode?
Would it be nice to see the actual auto iso value camera uses? Starting from some iso and going to some other iso? Not guessing. Not helping much if you are already at iso200 indoors and then going outdoors.
I just don't understand your work flow. It's like you want manual control of the auto modes. Just seems completely foreign and contradictory to me. Like, I can't for the life of me understand why you wouldn't just do manual exposure since that seems like what you want to do. I don't even disagree that the numbers should be there, but your reasoning and explanation just doesn't make sense to me.
Also, a regular consumer is going to use auto and not care what the other numbers are. They won't want to see the number cause they don't care.
I take photos usually with A-mode. I set aperture and let the camera decide image brightness with some shutter speed and maybe auto iso. It is very fast and easy. I must dial just one wheel and I still have good control of all values and I can react for many situations.
Video is just moving photo. I can use A-mode outdoors very easily and reliable. The video image is mostly perfect. I dont use ND filter and I dont care much about 180 degree rule. With GH5 and 4k 60P the shutter speed is even more free of such rules. When using manual exposure in rapid and difficult situations it demands very much concentration and thinking and it may be difficult to see expo meter in difficult angles or blinding sun light or when concentrating in many other things. I can use manual exposure and I know all the theory but I want to concentrate on other things because I have got very good results with my shooting style. It is just annoying guessing exposure values the camera is using.
Am I the only one in the world between a "regular user" and a professional?
I thought I had seen some info from a video about this that stated the old Lumix 12-35mm wouldn't work with dual-IS, however after searching I could not find this video for reference.
I did find this: http://nofilmschool.com/2017/01/exclusive-filmmaker-luke-neumann-shooting-panasonic-gh5
Scroll down to the comments and Luke Neumann says that the old Lumix 12-35mm and 35-100mm lenses ARE capable of dual-IS.
Good news!
Batutta
Major Contributor
You might be the only one posting to this forum. You seem to be coming to the GH4 more from the stills side of things. This forum consists of mainly of video shooters, amateur and professional. We all understand your concern by now, but yours is not a typical work mode around here which is why no one else is bothered by the lack of this feature, or cares really if it's implemented.
GH5 5.2k video (6k photo). It is HEVC Main10 10bit 4:2:0 mp4 video about 190Mbs. 5184 × 3456 / 929.031MB HEVC file downloadable.
Full video exif in text file.
https://vimeo.com/198883121
Full video exif in text file.
https://vimeo.com/198883121
Matt Gottshalk
Resident Preditor
I can't comment on that but no one I know that charges for their work uses auto anything.
You are in the extreme minority in my opinion and I think it is rather obtuse to ask for features from a manufacturer that .0001 of it's target market will use.
It's not that 1 in 10,000 want to use auto exposure, it's that 1 in 10,000 want to use auto exposure but also see in real time the parameters the camera is automatically adjusting. That is the weirdly specific thing you are asking for, when the vast majority of people using an auto exposure mode in video are content to let the camera automatically adjust without seeing the aperture or shutter speed or iso. It seems like an exceedingly unique request.
I am coming from a video camera side. I too like to see what the camera is doing. My Sony's show whether the parameter is in auto or manual and its value . I like that for if I have control of one of the values I can change if the auto value are moving to a region I would prefer to be different. No it is not the same as going full manual as the camera can change and maintain image brightness much quicker than I can for sure and most auto systems are able to control the parameters in finer increments than the manual controls especially gain ( iso ). Fixing shutter speed for required image blur, setting iris for depth of field and letting the camera control gain is typical for me but I do like to know what it is doing even if I have set an upper limit.
edit: Should note I use AE shift on the Sony's to achieve the brightness level in the image I want. Look at zebras to maintain highlight levels and peaking to confirm focus. So I like to see all these when I shoot.
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Thomas Smet
Veteran
Why don't you look at the cold response you have received from this forum as an answer to that question. If others did use the camera the way you do then you would have had more people agree with you.
Besides auto ISO is very different and for decades video cameras had auto gain settings on cameras while still working in manual mode. I personally would never use it but its an option and it was likely created because some people wanted the ISO to adjust according to conditions but would want to still control aperture and shutter on their own.
It is likely the many consumers who don't want to use manual exposure don't give a toot about the aperture numbers or don't want to understand what they even mean. They just want to point, hit the red button and record. You are in an odd unique position where you want auto exposure but then want to use your own odd way of knowing what that exposure is and using an odd choice of tools to adjust that exposure in a forced way. That is just not how the camera is really designed to shoot video. Sure you can do it but honestly you will not get a lot of sympathy from the rest of us if you choose not to use it the correct way.
Plenty of us shoot live family/sports/vacation stuff with the GH4 using manual exposure. It isn't exactly hard to do and within a short amount of time you can get used to using the camera the proper way.
Yes there was a firmware update for the 12-35mm lens about the time the G85 came out, but this is DUAL IS 1 and not DUAL IS 2. ( no idea what the difference is, but I assume that DI2 performs better than DI1 )
While I am sure there will be a large consumer user base for the GH5, I can't see many of them shooting 10-bit 4:2:2 5K Anamorphic V-log at 400 Mbps.
I wonder why most users feel it is not good to see what exposure camera uses. Preferred options seems to be full manual or full blind auto.
If I had to venture a guess, I would imagine that Panasonic probably made an educated guess (design decision) that the folks that use the auto modes didn't want to be bothered or confused by extra information on the screen. Who knows. Ron Evans mentioned above that the Sony cameras do show this information in Auto modes, but then again Sony has a reputation for having a more cumbersome interface on their cameras than Panasonic, so perhaps this goes along with that. Perhaps you could contact Panasonic and ask them to do it based on the fact that Sony does it.
Batutta
Major Contributor
Because we don't want the camera to choose it for us, and we don't want those things changing mid-shot. Unless I'm going for an effect, the shutter is going to stay at 180 degrees, or 1/50, or whatever is double the frame rate to get the most natural motion blur. Now you're down to ISO and shutter. On the GH4, I want the ISO to be as low as possible for maximum quality with the least amount of grain, between 200-800 unless I'm in a real low light situation. Then there's aperture, which, unless I'm shooting on a wide lens, I want as open as possible for cinematic depth of field (f1.4 to 2.8 on the GH4). I definitely don't want this on auto and changing mid shot. That's why I shoot all manual. If I need to cut brightness, I use an ND.
I shoot in the theatre where lighting changes can be very big between scenes. I want to maintain depth of field on the stage and do not want gain to get too much because of grain in the image. Once the show starts I cannot stop and play around with parameters too much. Hence my approach of fixing shutter speed to be the image blur I will accept considering low light I will make this as slow as is reasonable for the particular show. Mostly it is at the bottom 1/60. With a gain limit so the grain does not get too bad automatically on me, I have control of the iris in manual and AE shift slightly negative ( since the camera in the dark environment would like to open up too much). The camera has fine gain control though the indication is the normal steps, I can see if I am approaching the limits that I have set. For instance with the 1/3" sensor sweet spot is around F4. I will not shut down more than F5.6 because the image gets soft and opening up beyond F3.5 is at the limit of ramping on the zoom lens. It is much better to let the camera control gain and then switch in ND and control AE shift resulting in a smoother final video without steps in exposure etc. Seeing what the auto function is selecting gives a heads up as to what may be needed as an intervention by me.
Depends what you are shooting. Closeup of a flower in macro etc for a 4 min video then by all means use full manual to get the shallow depth of field etc that is needed. If you are shooting a dance show with flashing colored LED lights that have a random switching sequence --good luck. Controlling this with some level of automation with control of AE speed etc is really useful if the show is over 2 hours long.
Depends what you are shooting. Closeup of a flower in macro etc for a 4 min video then by all means use full manual to get the shallow depth of field etc that is needed. If you are shooting a dance show with flashing colored LED lights that have a random switching sequence --good luck. Controlling this with some level of automation with control of AE speed etc is really useful if the show is over 2 hours long.