A7s sample footage

I'm actually in R11. Just setting project settings to view at data level. XAVC-S all the way. That should show what range is there and useable. I'm not sure if setting to video in the actual clip pool is a good idea, but monitoring at video should be fine.
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I'll try that out too and compare. I've been getting back a bit from the highlights and shadows before I add any curves or LUTs BUT I'm not using an external monitor so the viewer is pretty worthless to do any serious grading with anyway.
 
Kholi said:
Hey can someone confirm something for me?

I'm getting the impression that ISO simply needs to be set for accurate exposure, and that's how you get clean images out of the camera.

For instance, using 3200 ISO in an underexposed setting awould actually give you worse results than using 6400 ISO which would be exposed properly. I'm asking because I kept seeing this when ramping ISO with the wheel, then I switched to AUTO ISO to check it and it seems to hold true.

Would be sick if someone else could check this out.
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This is actually covered in the online manual. They even say to brighten the image is you see too much noise.
http://helpguide.sony.net/ilc/1420/v1/en/contents/TP0000435736.html
"
  • When using S-Log2 gamma, the noise becomes more noticeable compared to when using other gammas. If the noise still is significant even after processing pictures, it may be improved by shooting with a brighter setting. However, the dynamic range becomes narrower accordingly when you shoot with a brighter setting. We recommend checking the picture in advance by test shooting when using S-log2.
I'm finding PP5 to work best for my needs in Cine 1 with Pro color. Seems to be the cleanest to me. You can actually see how clean your profile will be by defocusing the camera and thought the EVF use the magnify feature.
 
dustylense said:
This is actually covered in the online manual. They even say to brighten the image is you see too much noise.
http://helpguide.sony.net/ilc/1420/v1/en/contents/TP0000435736.html
"
  • When using S-Log2 gamma, the noise becomes more noticeable compared to when using other gammas. If the noise still is significant even after processing pictures, it may be improved by shooting with a brighter setting. However, the dynamic range becomes narrower accordingly when you shoot with a brighter setting. We recommend checking the picture in advance by test shooting when using S-log2.
I'm finding PP5 to work best for my needs in Cine 1 with Pro color. Seems to be the cleanest to me. You can actually see how clean your profile will be by defocusing the camera and thought the EVF use the magnify feature.
Click to expand...
If this is the case then I now understand why I'm having so many issues with Slog2. I'm using it like LOG footage should be shot. CRAZY!!! I wish Sony would just let use shoot at 800ish ISO. That sure would help.
 
Ok, koli I thoughtvit was just me but 1/45 does seem to render a closer to filmic motion then 1/50. Your footage has the type of motion I expect when watching cinema. Glad you confirmed what ive been seeing for tha last two years.
 
I like your PP, Kohli. Edit: I like your picture profile, Kohli. :)


General comment/observation regarding SLog2, Kholi, et al. Clearly SLog2 is a great option for high dynamic range shots, such as daytime, retain sky, etc. Controlled lighting, such as interior shot, dynamic range can be made to fit within the Rec.709 range, in some instances. To PP7 or not PP7, that is the question. Nothing new said here.

Dave posted this test and it is interesting to see various SLog2 exposure and noise levels, and an example where ETTR by two stops provides less noise, no obvious negative effect on skin, detail, etc, imo. Clearly not a high dynamic range shot. Two stops over takes middle grey from 32% to 50% range? No highlights (sky or the like) to protect, although you probably don't want to push above 80 IRE because of the SLog2 method of compressing DR. Discussion in Dave's description on the LGG forum. Mostly questions I have that follow. Does Dave's test have any relevance to the SLog2 noise discussion in recent pages herein, and a solution or when to use or not use SLog2, etc? Thanks.

 
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Nice thong on the redhead at the end of the A7 footage, Kholi.

Seriously though, the still above with the sigma is terrific.
 
Kholi said:
It's true, I'm referring to noise on the A7S. FOR ME, it's not responding how I would expect it to. As in if I raise the ISO or Lower it, I'm expecting to see the same amount of noise, but a brighter image.

I'm not. There's literally less noise with the same aperture raising the ISO.
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Yes that's why most cameras are designed with adjustable hardware gain. Every camera with hardware gain works this way. The noise limitation is in the ADC for most of the lower gain settings, so as you increase gain the signal is boosted before ADC and noise level and DR is the same but you get higher exposure. This is why we ETTR using all exposure controls including gain. You will get less noise by increasing your ISO/gain for all settings except maybe the highest ISOs which are often just software boosts.
 
dustylense said:
This is actually covered in the online manual. They even say to brighten the image is you see too much noise.
http://helpguide.sony.net/ilc/1420/v1/en/contents/TP0000435736.html
"
  • When using S-Log2 gamma, the noise becomes more noticeable compared to when using other gammas. If the noise still is significant even after processing pictures, it may be improved by shooting with a brighter setting. However, the dynamic range becomes narrower accordingly when you shoot with a brighter setting. We recommend checking the picture in advance by test shooting when using S-log2.
I'm finding PP5 to work best for my needs in Cine 1 with Pro color. Seems to be the cleanest to me. You can actually see how clean your profile will be by defocusing the camera and thought the EVF use the magnify feature.
Click to expand...

Erik Naso said:
If this is the case then I now understand why I'm having so many issues with Slog2. I'm using it like LOG footage should be shot. CRAZY!!! I wish Sony would just let use shoot at 800ish ISO. That sure would help.
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Yes, this is exactly what I was referring to. This didnt make any sense to me at all, but of course (duh) it's in the manual. I guess it's a double doofy moment, for not looking at the manual before hand.

Very interesting regardless, AUTO ISO seems to be quite a nice tool then.

reem12 said:
Ok, koli I thoughtvit was just me but 1/45 does seem to render a closer to filmic motion then 1/50. Your footage has the type of motion I expect when watching cinema. Glad you confirmed what ive been seeing for tha last two years.
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Nah I've always used 1/45 since the 5D/7D. Looks even better here, to me at least.

Christopher Barry said:
I like your PP, Kohli. Edit: I like your picture profile, Kohli. :)


General comment/observation regarding SLog2, Kholi, et al. Clearly SLog2 is a great option for high dynamic range shots, such as daytime, retain sky, etc. Controlled lighting, such as interior shot, dynamic range can be made to fit within the Rec.709 range, in some instances. To PP7 or not PP7, that is the question. Nothing new said here.

Dave posted this test and it is interesting to see various SLog2 exposure and noise levels, and an example where ETTR by two stops provides less noise, no obvious negative effect on skin, detail, etc, imo. Clearly not a high dynamic range shot. Two stops over takes middle grey from 32% to 50% range? No highlights (sky or the like) to protect, although you probably don't want to push above 80 IRE because of the SLog2 method of compressing DR. Discussion in Dave's description on the LGG forum. Mostly questions I have that follow. Does Dave's test have any relevance to the SLog2 noise discussion in recent pages herein, and a solution or when to use or not use SLog2, etc? Thanks.

Click to expand...

SLog 2 is great, S-Gamut I am not a fan of at all. Dusty's actually using the same Color Matrix, Pro. To me it seemed like the best starting point for my preferences.



wallrc said:
Nice thong on the redhead at the end of the A7 footage, Kholi.

Seriously though, the still above with the sigma is terrific.
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TOTALLY didn't notice.

Do we need to now type PicPro? xDDDDD

I'm about to post my settings, one second checking footage.
 
Lulz. Kholi "stalker fanboy".
So what's with the magenta? Is it IR pollution, the camera, or fashion?
From all the examples I've seen noise isn't a drama up to 20000 ISO (unless you underexpose)
You need to blow the highlights on a high contrast scene to see the highlight aliasing. I'm hoping switching everything off & 1/45 does the trick.
S-Log is the only mode that has that filmic gauze, the cine gammas just look like your average DSLR albeit with more resolution.
 
squig said:
Lulz. Kholi "stalker fanboy".
So what's with the magenta? Is it IR pollution, the camera, or fashion?
From all the examples I've seen noise isn't a drama up to 20000 ISO (unless you underexpose)
You need to blow the highlights on a high contrast scene to see the highlight aliasing. I'm hoping switching everything off & 1/45 does the trick.
S-Log is the only mode that has that filmic gauze, the cine gammas just look like your average DSLR albeit with more resolution.
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There's slight magenta, I pulled it out on the last profile, but ALSO, I prefer starting with a bit more magenta/blue for skin to be honest. Other people can figure out their PicPros and post up, this is just where I like to begin and find it the most workable.

Also, on my Dreamcolor, this isn't very magenta at all, it's literally dead on. And the DC is brand new calibrated from Factory (4hrs on the screen).

That Gauze you speak of... I try to get rid of it. I can't stand it haha.

Highlights: blow them out if you can't keep them all, and also... turn off all the auto lens corrections in menus. I'm not sure if that helped with the 70-200 (I doubt it?) But I turned all of that gack off when I got the cam from Stancali.
 
Hey Erik,

Which PP do you recommend for outdoor shooting? Have you tried any others? The shadows are quite noisy in the jumping scenes :(
 
Erik, I like the footage. What IRND did you use, if any? Might be best to change the Vimeo setting to playback 1080, currently 720p, thus the 720p120 is less spectacular than normal fit into 1080p finish. Vimeo default upload settings should be 1080, imo, I wish Vimeo would change that. Downloading the orginal to look at now, Erik. Good one!
 
ejdge said:
Hey Erik,

Which PP do you recommend for outdoor shooting? Have you tried any others? The shadows are quite noisy in the jumping scenes :(
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They are. 120 fps is 720p and slog was crazy noisy. Took a lot of work to bring it down so it hides it. Also Denoiser had to be used. What a mess! I'm still tweaking but Kohli is baking something mighty tasty and I want a try it!

I'm not impressed with Slog2 and S-Gamut or Cinema.
 
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