Why no one noticed Sound Devices USBPre 2 here?

I know I am loosing the time of some here!!! Thought that the discussion was about using " quite affordable (if we look from solution of particular problem side) preamp that can be also used as USB interface" as quoted above and exploring the different usb interface would be something viable for most here. One criteria being that they bring quality pre amps. I don' t know if some have read some post above but for example the mackie blackjack seems to have very good preamps.
DrDave said:
Yup.

Hey, if you just want two channels, what about the Mackie Blackjack? Cirrus Logic Converters, dynamite specs, self powered, tiny, portable, built like a tank. True hardware monitoring for zero latency, so cool for video. And $200, so cheap. And it puts out true 48 volt phantom power which is a must unless you run mics with a DC DC Converter like the Schoeps, they don't care. My Sennheisers need the full P48.
You can see the Rightmark numbers here
http://www.eqmag.com/article/mackie-onyx-blackjack/September-2010/120761
But the self noise figures are suspiciously high--that could be due to a hybrid AD-preamp design. On paper they look a bit noisier. I'll see it soon.
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The emu 0404 also has a lot of very good reviews concerning it pre amps. I do understand that they have many disadvantages compared to some other solution. But should it be Black and white as on one side the SD usbpre 2 and on the other the zoom h4n. So nothing in between should be discussed. I am a noob in sound (I am a professional photographer), I am trying to learn from the forums. In fact I generally work in group (artist) on projects but my friend who do sound are on the music side. They don' t know anything about capturing sound for film etc... I am not the run and gun type at all, everything will be planned and trialled before. So am I so stupid that for my style of work, a laptop or digital recorder and a good usb interface is not good at all?
 
For music you better look at proper dedicated recorder.
From cheap and portable Tascam DP-008 to Zoom R24.

If you need good and cheap solution for film - go and buy Fostex FR2LE.
You can find is on ebay sometimes only for $300-350.
 
Danielvilliers said:
I know I am loosing the time of some here!!! Thought that the discussion was about using " quite affordable (if we look from solution of particular problem side) preamp that can be also used as USB interface" as quoted above and exploring the different usb interface would be something viable for most here. One criteria being that they bring quality pre amps. I don' t know if some have read some post above but for example the mackie blackjack seems to have very good preamps.


The emu 0404 also has a lot of very good reviews concerning it pre amps. I do understand that they have many disadvantages compared to some other solution. But should it be Black and white as on one side the SD usbpre 2 and on the other the zoom h4n. So nothing in between should be discussed. I am a noob in sound (I am a professional photographer), I am trying to learn from the forums. In fact I generally work in group (artist) on projects but my friend who do sound are on the music side. They don' t know anything about capturing sound for film etc... I am not the run and gun type at all, everything will be planned and trialled before. So am I so stupid that for my style of work, a laptop or digital recorder and a good usb interface is not good at all?
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What do you need it for?
 
I need a good low cost solution to record sound for my short movie project. I had the same idea than the original post, that is, use a pc interface like the Sound devices usb pre and a laptop or a more portable solution like one of digital recorders. Searching along I found a slew of solution from $ 100 to many thousand of dollars. In between those I found something like the Makie blackjack at $ 200 with very good preamps etc... I was suggesting if solution like the Makie, or many others in place of the Usb pre because they are cheaper and seems o have preamps that are much better than a zoom h4n for example.

I know that it might seem a little more from $ 200 to $ 650 but I am a professional photographer using Nikon equipment, who at the start of this year invested about $ 2500 in Canon equipment because Nikon was so far behind. Today I got my Libec tripod and a Rode Nt3 for indoor and voice overs from a friend who went to singapore, more than $ 1000. I have a gini rig for about $ 400. Beside having for more than $ 4000 of Bowens studio equipment I will have to invest in some permanent fluorescent system for my lighting. I intend to buy a GH2 in the next two month (will have to try and sell a Canon 7d in new condition). If I was not living in a tropical Island I was seriously considering buying a Panasonic Af-100, but realistically where I live I can' t think of getting it for another year.

In the end all this investment tend to feel quite heavy financially and I have to think about the investment in some of my creative projects. I am not going to kit out a whole rig to film my dogs. The Af-100 also changes a lot the way you see your investment in gear. The initial investment will be big but many things are already included.
I hope that you understand my point now. For all
 
If you want a simple solution, then you need to look at the portable recorders. I think these are well suited to filming with DSLR. The Fostex that Vitally pointed out is as far as I would want to go in size, if I was solo shooting. You could wear this in a hip belt or shoulder strap.
When you add a field mixer/laptop it starts to complicate the set up, though it's more versatile. One great example of where a mixer/audio interface/laptop would work well, is recording a live performance. I think I would prefer the flexibility of something like the Motu for this ( but I'm a fan of their gear ). But unless you are very confident running DAW software or ideally you can hire a good sound guy, then the portable recorders are probably the simpler option, with the AF100, being even simpler.
 
If you really want to know which one is best, you get them all in a room and try them out. That's what I do, and I find that my taste in preamps and converters isn't the same as everyone else's, which is totally the way it should be. And after all, even if we are using it for music, there's a million different kinds of music. It may work great on guitar, and be bad on violin or percussion. But at least, after the comparison, I know for myself which one I prefer. And when I tested the Fostex against my really expensive gear, I said, wow, there is a small difference, but not a big difference. Good, solid pres without plastic undertones. Some of the pres I tested are really quiet, but they have a coloration--sometimes metallic, sometimes plasticky, sometimes covered, bright, and so on-- that I don't like. But that is taste. I've always like the Grace pres and the Mytek converters. But I'll use my RME most of the time for the built-in digicheck, rock solid drivers, totalmix interface, and so on. There's a trade off. But the stuff is so amazingly cheap compared to years ago....
 
Danielvilliers said:
I am not the run and gun type at all, everything will be planned and trialled before. So am I so stupid that for my style of work, a laptop or digital recorder and a good usb interface is not good at all?
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By going with a laptop dependent solution, you are married to the planned shoot. By going with a portable digital recorder, you can do planned shoots just fine, as well as having options for working in other ways.
 
Sam Mallery said:
By going with a laptop dependent solution, you are married to the planned shoot. By going with a portable digital recorder, you can do planned shoots just fine, as well as having options for working in other ways.
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That's so true--and every now and then, the OS of a laptop will crash, rare, but it does happen. With the Tascam 680 you get the preamps, the recorder, the mixer, backup, multiple limiter options and so on, in one box. But the laptop has advantages as well, you can run a room simulator in real time, for example.
 
Perhaps my english is not good, I am going to rephrase it using an example. If tomorrow someone ask you that he has only $ 300 to record sound for his Dslr and that he want to have good quality from his Xlr microphone (Rode NT3). He is not in run and gun type of shooting. Would you recommend him the Zoom h4n/Tascam Dr100 or a Mackie blackjack and a small laptop. I repeat, there is not running around etc... Most of it will quite static interior shoot (some he will borrow from a friend a sennheiser G3 lav mic).

I don't want to sound condescending in any way to all that posting here in any way, I am just in search of some info.
 
Daniel, like I said earlier, if you aren't experienced in setting up and running a DAW, then you are in my humble opinion, setting yourself up for problems while you are shooting. If you have someone who is confident in doing this for you, then you would certainly have a much more flexible and probably better quality solution. If not, then get yourself a Tascam DR100 or similar.
 
Danielvilliers said:
Perhaps my english is not good, I am going to rephrase it using an example. If tomorrow someone ask you that he has only $ 300 to record sound for his Dslr and that he want to have good quality from his Xlr microphone (Rode NT3). He is not in run and gun type of shooting. Would you recommend him the Zoom h4n/Tascam Dr100 or a Mackie blackjack and a small laptop. I repeat, there is not running around etc... Most of it will quite static interior shoot (some he will borrow from a friend a sennheiser G3 lav mic).

I don't want to sound condescending in any way to all that posting here in any way, I am just in search of some info.
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If you're not filming outdoors, then the Zoom or small Tascam will be fine. Audio quality is more than sufficient. Only if you need top notch quality, say for music, then i'd use a laptop with an audio interface. If you shoot outdoors or need your recorder every day, then you need a sturdy recorder, like Sound Devices (not the USBPre which is an audio interface)
 
actually, we are noticing the SD USBPre2 because for those of us running the DR-680, it's actually the perfect frontend for channels 7&8; and the unit's clocking options have even been modified specifically to fit this bill (from feedback by 680 users)...
 
I love Sound Devices products and sound... it is second to none... but.... I really don't think most directors can tell the difference from my zoom h4n with modded preamps and my $2000 Sound Devices 702.

I try to go direct into preamp/recorder and NOT use mixers. I find that gives the best quality and in indie dslr shoots you dont need 5 channels of audio anyway if you have any salt with a good boom.
 
ajcourtney said:
actually, we are noticing the SD USBPre2 because for those of us running the DR-680, it's actually the perfect frontend for channels 7&8; and the unit's clocking options have even been modified specifically to fit this bill (from feedback by 680 users)...
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Yes, my point not to use an audio interface like the USBPre2 should be read as "not using a laptop", because i think for outdoor use laptops aren't reliable enough. The fact that you use the USBPre2 with a recorder, seems like a good solution.
 
^^^^wasn't directed @ you, jm....I'll also echo Blackout's comment to add that IMO mixers are now completely obsolete. There is no reason to use them when you have an incredibly portable 8-channel option like the DR-680 w/the SD USBPre2. Leave the mixing to the stressfree post studio and focus on getting the absolute best sound on location. Personally, I've been waiting 15 years for the DR-680 and we are all very happy it has not disappointed (save for some QC issues which are practically unavoidable in today's world at the 680's price point).
 
Aaron I was looking into getting that box (Tascam dr-680) but very disappointed that there are no knobs for fine tuning levels of all 6 inputs... how does it work.. you have to go into menus? That seems very annoying... how do you adjust things on the fly if one of your inputs gets too hot or something like that?

How are it's preamps?
 
ajcourtney said:
IMO mixers are now completely obsolete. There is no reason to use them when you have an incredibly portable 8-channel option like the DR-680 w/the SD USBPre2. Leave the mixing to the stressfree post studio and focus on getting the absolute best sound on location.
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Maybe for a specific working style on a specific kind of shoot with a specific post production pipeline in place. For everything else the tone, metering, flexible monitoring, routing, and multiple output capabilities a good mixer affords you are always going to be useful, and often will be critically important.
 
Blackout said:
Aaron I was looking into getting that box (Tascam dr-680) but very disappointed that there are no knobs for fine tuning levels of all 6 inputs... how does it work.. you have to go into menus? That seems very annoying... how do you adjust things on the fly if one of your inputs gets too hot or something like that?

How are it's preamps?
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The pre's are really, really good - arguably just as good as the SD pre's based upon both the #'s and some anecdotal testing over at taperssection (I'm coming from multitrack event filming, not PBS nature shoots). We were wondering if Tascam used the same mic pre's as those in our DM3200/DM4800. We also have a couple of Yammie 01V's and the 680's pres are much better. Yes, you have to go into one menu, but it's relatively simple - hit the Rec Trim button and then select the channel(s) you want to change by pressing the round button beneath each channel # and turn the front-mounted knob. Very quick and very painless. And if you do pick one up, don't freak out during tracking when you monitor via cans because the headphone amp sucks. But when you drop the tracks into your NLE, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.
 
I haven't tested the pres, but based on the initial reports, I would be surprised if the preamps were not fine for live work. I'm sure it will be at AES next week. The box has now been out long enough that a big problem would have surfaced. You can't really tell about the pres unless you do an AB, but if they were cheesy, you would have had some reports from those you live for gear by now. Plus several ppl have said it has real phantom power, which most machines don't. As for mixers being obsolete, I always think after the recording I'll run it through the analog mixer, for that analog sound, for the final mastering, and I never do. So I guess they are kinda on the way out, even if I need knobs and faders I usually hook up a controller to my DAW. I sure wouldn't BUY a mixer.
 
Regarding my mixer comments, not sure I made myself clear. For location sound, as we all know, once you submix tracks, you are married to that mix, good or bad, forever (yes, creative use of multiband dynamics and EQ can fix things to a certain degree, but it's never going to be as good or EASY as if you could just pull a fader down). And that will do nothing but LIMIT your choices in post production. My point was now there is no reason to do this because we finally have a highly portable 8 channel multitracker that should give you more than enough individual tracks for just about any location shoot (obviously not talking about tracking a live concert here where you roll out your REAL remote rig).

As far as our workflow goes, we hate mixing ITB (mouse jockeying). So we have taken a hybrid approach by using NLE's for things they do best (manipulating tracks with audio envelopes, "physical" manipulation of the wave itself, etc.). We then send those tracks out of the NLE into our Tascam DM-3200, which gives us access to outboard analog gear as well as a physical mixing surface, and then print a stereo or 5.1 mix back to the NLE. IMO, this is clearly the best way to work. I would never work without a physical mixing console in the studio.
 
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