What's your "standard" shutter speed for 24P?

A

adanac

Carbonite Member
Is there a "standard" shutter speed when shooting 24P? I've heard 50 is a great starting point and that one strays from there for effect.
 
With DSLRs, shoot 1/50 or 1/60. These emulate the 180 degree shutter of film cameras. Shooting faster takes more rigid pictures with little motion blur, giving a surreal effect, and is often used if the intent is to run the video through Twixtor in After Effects.
 
Absolutely don't shoot 1/50 unless you know exactly what you're doing and what lighting conditions you're shooting under. Use 1/60 as your standard speed. 1/50 causes unwelcome artifacting in the image when shooting under fluorescents, sodium vapor, mercury vapor, HMI, and some LED lighting (when using a dimmer). If you don't know precisely exactly what the lighting conditions are, you could end up with rolling bands in your footage. Is it worth the risk for an extra 1/12th second? I say better safe than sorry, at least until you are absolutely certain about what type of lights you're shooting under.

Boycott 1/50th, use 1/60th.

Except in PAL land, of course, where 1/50th is appropriate in all scenarios.
 
Haha,

Right as I hit "Post," I was thinking, "Barry is probably going to drop in and scream 1/60 at the top of his lungs." :D

I've personally never had any banding when shooting 1/50 at 24p (on the 7D), and I've shot in all kinds of available light, including typical office-style fluorescents. But, I would imagine Barry has shot a little more than I have.

Barry, what are the potential drawbacks to a shutter speed that is 1/12th of a second faster? Would people appear more rigid like a stop-motion animation? Granted, 1/50 isn't even a true 180-degree shutter..
 
Out of curiosity, if you're going to use Twixtor for slo-mo, what's a good shutter speed to use? I know it probably depends on what kind of scene you're shooting, but let's say... a fight scene?
 
For Twixtor or timeWarp (in AE)... the fastest speed you can get by with. Since the software is interpolating a lot of info - I mean a lot - blurs just confuse the heck out of it. It's not unusual to have a great shot going, and then one quick swipe of a hand just turns into a bizarre mess of alien body parts. It's weird and absolutely unfixable in worst case scenarios.
 
Barry_Green said:
Absolutely don't shoot 1/50 unless you know exactly what you're doing and what lighting conditions you're shooting under. Use 1/60 as your standard speed. 1/50 causes unwelcome artifacting in the image when shooting under fluorescents, sodium vapor, mercury vapor, HMI, and some LED lighting (when using a dimmer). If you don't know precisely exactly what the lighting conditions are, you could end up with rolling bands in your footage. Is it worth the risk for an extra 1/12th second? I say better safe than sorry, at least until you are absolutely certain about what type of lights you're shooting under.

Boycott 1/50th, use 1/60th.

Except in PAL land, of course, where 1/50th is appropriate in all scenarios.
Click to expand...

i use 1/50 only under halogens, which are my main lights, but very rarely and only in 24P mode. i think, in total, i have shot in 24P maybe 5 times. otherwise im shooting usually 1/60 or 1/120 unless im in PAL-istan.

the best way to learn is to try it out and see which suits the look you want/need.
 
This seems like sound advice to me but it gets me thinking. I mix on a reality show and we have shot for a year and half at 1/48 on our 2 HDX900's with no issues. We've shot in a wide variety of lighting conditions that we can't control with no problems I've heard of. I'll ask our DP if he's changing shutter speeds.


Barry_Green said:
Absolutely don't shoot 1/50 unless you know exactly what you're doing and what lighting conditions you're shooting under. Use 1/60 as your standard speed. 1/50 causes unwelcome artifacting in the image when shooting under fluorescents, sodium vapor, mercury vapor, HMI, and some LED lighting (when using a dimmer). If you don't know precisely exactly what the lighting conditions are, you could end up with rolling bands in your footage. Is it worth the risk for an extra 1/12th second? I say better safe than sorry, at least until you are absolutely certain about what type of lights you're shooting under.

Boycott 1/50th, use 1/60th.

Except in PAL land, of course, where 1/50th is appropriate in all scenarios.
Click to expand...
 
I shoot so much at night, I usually end up w/ 1/30 shutter speed. Otherwise 1/50...

Of course, now that Barry's raised the issue, I have to re-look at it. But I though the 1/50th speed best emulates the "film look" most of us covet.
 
jdv said:
But I though the 1/50th speed best emulates the "film look" most of us covet.
Click to expand...
Everyone thinks that. And, in broad daylight, it may even be true. But the difference between 1/50 and 1/60 is pretty darn minimal. Whereas the difference between 1/50 and 1/60, under magnetic HMIs or fluos, is the difference between "usable footage" and "screwed pooch".

Ain't worth the risk, says I.
 
Done and done - thanks for the advice Barry.

PS - I love it when you "slum" with us over here in DSLR land!

;)
 
jdv said:
PS - I love it when you "slum" with us over here in DSLR land!
Click to expand...
Hey, there is nothing "slum" about the DSLR folks. This place is for the users, the creators, the folks trying to get better at what they do. Doesn't matter to me if they use a DSLR or an Alexa or anything in-between. My far and away favorite film of Thrillfest was shot on a DSLR. So hey -- whether I may prefer a different tool to do the job, the important thing to me is the person doing the job. If I have anything to offer, I'm glad to try.

:thumbsup:
 
1/60 is due to the Frequency of Light or electricity in the US.. which is 60 hertz.. any divisible of 60 is ok. 60-120-180-and so on.. But in Day light 1/50 to me is Fine
 
speedjunkie said:
1/60 is due to the Frequency of Light or electricity in the US.. which is 60 hertz.. any divisible of 60 is ok. 60-120-180-and so on.. But in Day light 1/50 to me is Fine
Click to expand...

i take it that if i'm shooting in a country with 50 hz electricity i should go 1/50 instead?
 
Barry_Green said:
Definitely. Unless you're shooting 720/60p or 1080/60i; in those cases 1/50 is a disaster and you'd be better off with 1/100.
Click to expand...

got it. are these rolling bands artifacts visible on the LCD as i shoot, or do they only appear in the recording?
 
Barry_Green said:
Definitely. Unless you're shooting 720/60p or 1080/60i; in those cases 1/50 is a disaster and you'd be better off with 1/100.
Click to expand...

he cant shoot 720/60P or 1080/60i at 1/50; he would have to be shooting 720/50P or 1080/50i for 1/50. I think glv needs to know his minimum shutter speed is his framerate with the HDSLR.
 
glv said:
got it. are these rolling bands artifacts visible on the LCD as i shoot, or do they only appear in the recording?
Click to expand...

Depends on how far off from 1/60th you are. With 1/50th they will be very subtle, maybe not noticeable unless you're looking for them. The way to know whether they're going to be there or not, is to crank it up to 1/250th or so. If you see bands at 1/250th, then you know you would also get bands at 1/50th.
 
Holy cow, I've been using 1/50th all this time. What about when we're using tungsten lights? Do they fall into those lights, that are bad with 1/50th? I will take the advice of using 1/60th to be on the safe side.
 
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