The New F

Status
Not open for further replies.
Top of my list is 4k internal recording. Icing on the cake would be RAW internal but unfortunately that would quite well displace the F65 so I don't see that happening.

Unfortunately since I want 4k the F5 makes RED a better solution for me. But the F3 / F5 kills in run and gun and low light.
 
Oddly enough DR is the first thing that I would give to Sony right now. That and very acceptable low to no light performance.

Color, motion, detail, features. Almost in that order, those be the questions.
 
I'm in love with SLOGged F3 as is (when recorded to 10-bit ProRes/DNxHD at least). So if they can offer an equivalent level of DR, image quality and low-light performance with the added benefits of high frame rates, internal 10-bit recording, and practical ergonomics - you're all of a sudden playing well into Alexa territory (and presently, for motion picture imaging, that's the place I want to be).
 
I think it comes down to how people think DR affects the image vs. how RAW and 4k affect the image. Coming from grading both 35mm transfers and digital...I know DR is huge and actually completely changes the way you think about shooting log gammas raw or non raw, it shows you how DR is king and 4k and raw really should be secondary to this.

But again its not like the f3 isnt very good in the DR department...ots pretty awesome. Nonetheless, looking forward to our new F! If it can indeed make a sandwich than I say forget the DR...
 
No need to circle the wagons boys and girls...il love my f3 and the DR it has. :love4: It's in the top 3 as far as DR. Just think it would be cream of the crop if the new F had Alexa or film like DR, even without the 4k and Raw.
 
Richard Allen Crook said:
I've been following this looooong thread and am surprised nobody has mentioned dynamic range hopes for improvements. To me, it's alot about the dynamic range. It's the magic that makes film look filmic. Raw don't mean a thing if it ain't got that sting (DR). Fourkay shmorkay. Show me a 35mm sensor in a video cam body that can do Alexa DR and ill show you the magic. Why aren't you all concerned with DR? Wouldn't it be incredible to get Alexa DR or better? Of you get that...the resolution and Mbps seems so minute. At least that my opinion.
Click to expand...

You are absolutely correct but, sadly, the industry now is mesmerized by numbers (Ks) following the lead of consumer products.
The young generation that energizes these forums has no patience to understand the true making of a great image and just goes for the easiest route- Mpix (or Ks to sound more pro) that are and have been all over specs for consumer products. The manufacturers just give them what they want and, incidentally is the cheapest spec to deliver- pixel count.
Thankfully there is one spec that always evades these cheap tricks- the beautiful image.
Remember- it's all about the final product anyway....
 
Just a friendly reminder to everyone, Alexa is really a 3K camera, and its mostly used on features and some TV as such. Arri RAW is recorded at 3K to Codex recorder and thats then brought down to 2K in post.

Reason I bring this up, because everyone keeps calling Alexa as a 2K camera, but its honestly not. Its a 3K camera for RAW, 2K camera for the internal recordings. Thats the reason why Alexa is so bang on good when you see it for "Skyfall" or the other big movies shooting with it that you'll see on the big screen. You're seeing a 14bit 3K RAW recording brought to a 2K DCP for projection.
 
Yeah, all that XAVCHD codec/iFrame SxS RAW stuff came from one post on Reduser.

I suppose it could be true but the guy dropped it so nonchalantly I'm going to take it with a very small grain of salt for now.
 
Viddovation said:
I realize this sort of thinking won't fly with the RED crowd, but I think owning a camera that does excellent 1080p, including compressed flavors like 35Mbps and 50Mbps for fast turnaround, but is capable of 4k with recorder actually works out quite well for owner operators who still mostly work in 1080p. The way I see it, I can own the camera, and rent a 4k recorder when clients need it. By the time I have enough clients clamouring for 4k to buy a recorder, both unit and media prices will likely have dropped, and may face marketplace competition.

Future proof wouldn't be accurate, but forward thinking, that would be.
Click to expand...

That's a pretty sensible way of looking at things Viddovation. Hope I can use my existing SxS 1 cards with the new F's.
Honestly, with my F3+KiPro combo I don't feel like my camera has been obsoleted.
 
morgan_moore said:
Well that would make sense if all clients 1080 or 4k didnt need deserve decent colour.. raw (at least for tricky shots)

Id much prefer raw 1080 onboard

and 4k/high speed offboard

S
Click to expand...

If they keep S-Log with the 1080 option, I think you'll still get an impressive color palette.
 
Richard Allen Crook said:
I've been following this looooong thread and am surprised nobody has mentioned dynamic range hopes for improvements. To me, it's alot about the dynamic range. It's the magic that makes film look filmic. Raw don't mean a thing if it ain't got that sting (DR). Fourkay shmorkay. Show me a 35mm sensor in a video cam body that can do Alexa DR and ill show you the magic. Why aren't you all concerned with DR? Wouldn't it be incredible to get Alexa DR or better? Of you get that...the resolution and Mbps seems so minute. At least that my opinion.
Click to expand...

That's a good point but it needs to work hand in hand with improved S/N ratio. I love my F3, but like every video camera I've used, its weak point is under lit mid-tones. Look at those walls that are three to four stops under and you'll see what I mean. Or gain up 6db to capture a nighttime cityscape and check those black levels.
 
FilmDude said:
Just a friendly reminder to everyone, Alexa is really a 3K camera, and its mostly used on features and some TV as such. Arri RAW is recorded at 3K to Codex recorder and thats then brought down to 2K in post.

Reason I bring this up, because everyone keeps calling Alexa as a 2K camera, but its honestly not. Its a 3K camera for RAW, 2K camera for the internal recordings. Thats the reason why Alexa is so bang on good when you see it for "Skyfall" or the other big movies shooting with it that you'll see on the big screen. You're seeing a 14bit 3K RAW recording brought to a 2K DCP for projection.
Click to expand...

Not to split hairs, but it's a 3.5k sensor (http://arri.com/camera/digital_cameras/learn/alexa_faq.html) that down samples to 2k. The reason for pointing out the minor detail is to note that images from the Alexa have been upres'ed in post to 4K and screened in IMAX theaters with favorable results.
 
From Twitter - Sony Pro Europe ‏@sonyproeurope The Future, Ahead of Schedule. #TheNewF October 30, 2012 “Much more than a camera”
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm beginning to think the sandwich maker accessory was not a joke, after all.
 
East Coast part of the announcement might get a little messed up due to Sandy. I am scheduled to be part of the Facebook chat coming live from Sony in Park Ridge (NJ) but at this point weather is not going to cooperate. Jon Fauer is supposed to be introducing and it remains to be seen whether any of us can get to Park Ridge.

I should hopefully have all of the final info from Sony before Tues in order to have an article ready to post the moment embargo is lifted.

Ned
 
Jay Birch said:
From Twitter - Sony Pro Europe ‏@sonyproeurope The Future, Ahead of Schedule. #TheNewF October 30, 2012 “Much more than a camera”
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm beginning to think the sandwich maker accessory was not a joke, after all.
Click to expand...

That could mean it's also a 4k recorder. One can hope...
 
Dennis,

I honestly don't know when product will be available for pre-order. My guess is that pre-orders should open as soon as there is product announcement, meaning you can order on Tuesday. Unless, of course, you live in NE US or parts of Canada affected by the hurricane. I expect to lose power Monday afternoon and with luck have it restored by Friday. You will have some rain in Toronto but most likely not what we will see in the NYC area.

Ned
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top