Super PC!

ronedee

ronedee

Active member
Hey guys! I have this young Geek building me a Super PC! The spec's are below. Let me know what you think, and if you see any improvements or upgrades (Besides getting a Mac! haha) that you think would benefit the build. And what about an OS? The Geek says WD7 is in Beta and working very nicely w/ his 3D SW. But also, suggested XP Pro 64.

And "IF" you had this setup, what would be your go to NLE choice in native AVCHD?


Processor: (2) Intel Xeon E5410 Quad Core 2.33GHz 1333MHz FSB 8-Cores in total

Motherboard: Supermicro X7DCA-L Serverboard - 2x Xeon 5400/5200 Intel 5100 Chipset 1333/1066MHz - 6x DDR2 667/533 Reg. ECC- Audio/VGA

Case: Thermaltake Lanbox VF1000BWS (Modified to fit the serverboard) w/ 4 variable speed fans.

Hard Drive: Seagate 500GB Barracuda 7200.11 SATA Hard Drive 3Gb/s, & 4 slots for 3 more!

CD/ DVD: Super Writemaster CD/DVD RW with SpeedPlus

Memory: 4GB (2G x 2) 240 Pin DDR2 667 Reg. ECC RAM, 6 slots for a total upgrade of 48GB! And if desired, this setup will run that fastest ram out there!

Power Supply: Aluminum Coolmax 750W, w/ dedicated cooling fan.

Video: ATI Radeon X1650 Pro Series PCI Express 512MB Graphics Card, w/ 2 DVI outs.

Most everything is "plug-in" modular and serviceable by mio!

* All this w/OS of my choice for $2000 delivered!

Thanks again, for your advice!
 
You might consider replacing the ATI card with an NVidia gtx285. While Premiere CS4 doesn't directly support CUDA on this card, AE does for some filters, along with photoshop CS4. Also, there are some interesting utilities (e.g., BadaBoom!) that will work with CUDA cards. The GTX285 can be had in the low $300 range, if you look around ...

This is assuming that you go in the Premiere direction. My assumption is that the next version of Premiere (CS5, yet un-announced) will add more CUDA support, rather than limiting it to the NVidia Quadro cards. I am assuming that this limitation is more of a marketing one, rather than technical.
 
jpmulligan said:
You might consider replacing the ATI card with an NVidia gtx285. While Premiere CS4 doesn't directly support CUDA on this card, AE does for some filters, along with photoshop CS4. Also, there are some interesting utilities (e.g., BadaBoom!) that will work with CUDA cards. The GTX285 can be had in the low $300 range, if you look around ...

This is assuming that you go in the Premiere direction. My assumption is that the next version of Premiere (CS5, yet un-announced) will add more CUDA support, rather than limiting it to the NVidia Quadro cards. I am assuming that this limitation is more of a marketing one, rather than technical.
Click to expand...

Thanks alot! Yeah, I wasn't sure about the card! Neither was he (Geek). But this is the nice thing about the build....all changeable, and I'm getting the experienced advice from you guys!!

I actually have CS4, and was going to install it first on this PC.
 
I am not sure why you are skipping on hard disks.
If you are that serious, invest in a RAID 0+1 or 5 setup. At least you will have speed and redundancy.

My suggestion is to go with the Intel solid state disks; have 2 in raid 0 for your main configuration, and stack a lot of 1TB's for storage, backup. Try the Samsungs F1R they are fast as hell; or go Hitachi, or WD high end.

The biggest bottle neck when adding a clip to a timeline IMHO is the hard disk. So yeah, spend like crazy on storage, you won't regret it.
 
edy4eva said:
I am not sure why you are skipping on hard disks.
If you are that serious, invest in a RAID 0+1 or 5 setup. At least you will have speed and redundancy.

My suggestion is to go with the Intel solid state disks; have 2 in raid 0 for your main configuration, and stack a lot of 1TB's for storage, backup. Try the Samsungs F1R they are fast as hell; or go Hitachi, or WD high end.

The biggest bottle neck when adding a clip to a timeline IMHO is the hard disk. So yeah, spend like crazy on storage, you won't regret it.
Click to expand...
----------------

I do have a Hitachi 1TB coming now, to test it out! I told the Geek to keep it simple on the ram and HD's until I got the PC. I figured a RAID would be the way to go! Thanks!!
 
edy4eva said:
My suggestion is to go with the Intel solid state disks; have 2 in raid 0 for your main configuration, and stack a lot of 1TB's for storage, backup.
Click to expand...
Agreed regarding the SSD, however i am not sure that the raid 0 configuration will add much speed ...
 
jpmulligan said:
Agreed regarding the SSD, however i am not sure that the raid 0 configuration will add much speed ...
Click to expand...
-------------------

I was going to contact Supermicro (board manf.) for configuring the raid. The guy building my PC said they were very helpful in that area. Thanks for your input!
 
In my experience, the Xeon cost factor does not pay off for the performance it delivers.
I would go with an intel Core i7 920 processor 2.66 gig processor.
For around $300, and build around that.

For around $1650, gateway (I know, not known for being the best) makes a killer
computer for ALL EDITING.
It's called a Gateway FX6800-09

That will do what you want it to do.
The i7 processor really does make AVCHD smooth as butter.
The Nvidia GTX 280 is the best video card for AVCHD under $600
The 6 gigs of DDR 3 ram, are more than you get with others.
1 terabite of 7200 speed hard drive is the dream machine drive.
and the SD card reader for your cards.


That would be my dream system that I know will do the job asked for nearly $400 less.
 
Green Hornet said:
In my experience, the Xeon cost factor does not pay off for the performance it delivers.
I would go with an intel Core i7 920 processor 2.66 gig processor.
For around $300, and build around that.
Click to expand...

smart advice... you absolutely do not need or want to pay the premium for a server motherboard setup.

don't use 500 gig drives, use those hitachi 1 gigs instead... skip the raid, you are editing avchd, right? which has the same bitrate as dv avi files... cpu horsepower is what counts for decoding avchd, so spend the money there.

64-bit o.s. is mandatory, cuda can't hurt, but only if you have software that supports it.

case-wise, i'd stick with the old p180, it's cheaper, especially on sale, and it has big slow-turning fans on top, with a totally seperate chamber for the p.s. and some of the hdds... the hot air and noise is seperated from the motherboard area... one of the best cases ever designed:
http://www.antec.com/usa/productDetails.php?lan=us&id=81800

i was a pc network admin for 10 years, so i'm a bit of pc geek myself :-)

and oh yeah, a big power supply with modular cabling, and i'm kind of partial to pioneer dvd drives.
 
Last edited:
Green Hornet said:
In my experience, the Xeon cost factor does not pay off for the performance it delivers.
I would go with an intel Core i7 920 processor 2.66 gig processor.
For around $300, and build around that.
Click to expand...
I tried making that point in a thread about mac pros... but they have to justify their $3-5000 expense. The law of diminishing returns comes into play at that level... and most software out there still has limitations with AVCHD anyway, the fastest computer on earth wont fix that. I put together an i7 for under a grand (which can prob be done for a chunk less now). It does eat AVCHD for breakfast, but still haven't nailed down a perfect software workflow quite yet.

It is true that AVCHD bandwidth wouldn't have problems on the slowest drive today. On the other hand, disk drives are the biggest bottleneck of a computer, so you will notice a difference... just might not be necessary. At the very least, keep OS and data separate, you can easily upgrade data drives at any time.
 
Green Hornet said:
In my experience, the Xeon cost factor does not pay off for the performance it delivers.
I would go with an intel Core i7 920 processor 2.66 gig processor.
For around $300, and build around that.

For around $1650, gateway (I know, not known for being the best) makes a killer
computer for ALL EDITING.
It's called a Gateway FX6800-09

That will do what you want it to do.
The i7 processor really does make AVCHD smooth as butter.
The Nvidia GTX 280 is the best video card for AVCHD under $600
The 6 gigs of DDR 3 ram, are more than you get with others.
1 terabite of 7200 speed hard drive is the dream machine drive.
and the SD card reader for your cards.


That would be my dream system that I know will do the job asked for nearly $400 less.
Click to expand...
-------------------------------

Thanks Hornet! The processors are already installed on the board on this PC. I was wondering how the i7's would stack and found that there were 3 ver. of the i7 processor. Serching the web I found very little benchmark testing comparisons. But the Xeon' were not bad, or far behind the i7's in testing.

Do you really feel that the i7's would boost the production over say, the HD, OS, or ram selection?

From what I've been reading, the processors "nowadays" are pretty much all good! And the biggest factors are the OS and hard drives for getting the pedal to the metal.

Actually, my head is spinning a little with all the info I've been trying to digest! Whewwww!! LOL
 
OSV said:
smart advice... you absolutely do not need or want to pay the premium for a server motherboard setup.

don't use 500 gig drives, use those hitachi 1 gigs instead... skip the raid, you are editing avchd, right? which has the same bitrate as dv avi files... cpu horsepower is what counts for decoding avchd, so spend the money there.

64-bit o.s. is mandatory, cuda can't hurt, but only if you have software that supports it.

case-wise, i'd stick with the old p180, it's cheaper, especially on sale, and it has big slow-turning fans on top, with a totally seperate chamber for the p.s. and some of the hdds... the hot air and noise is seperated from the motherboard area... one of the best cases ever designed:
http://www.antec.com/usa/productDetails.php?lan=us&id=81800

i was a pc network admin for 10 years, so i'm a bit of pc geek myself :-)

and oh yeah, a big power supply with modular cabling, and i'm kind of partial to pioneer dvd drives.
Click to expand...
--------------------------------

LOL! Looks like my Mac case!!

The motherboard is a server from Supermicro, and is supposedly one of the best on the market! I was leaning towards the Hitachi 500GB for the 1st drive, and (2) Hitachi 1 TB's for the other 2. The SSD drives are waaaaaay out of my league!!

From what I read, a RAID in 1 with 2 drives, doesn't backup, but opens the bandwith real wide. I thought that, or a RAID "5" with 3 drives would be the way to go for editing? But I'm listening!!

On the OS, I have a choice of XP 64, Vista 64, or Windows 7 beta in 64. What do you think?
 
mcsmooth said:
I tried making that point in a thread about mac pros... but they have to justify their $3-5000 expense. The law of diminishing returns comes into play at that level... and most software out there still has limitations with AVCHD anyway, the fastest computer on earth wont fix that. I put together an i7 for under a grand (which can prob be done for a chunk less now). It does eat AVCHD for breakfast, but still haven't nailed down a perfect software workflow quite yet.

It is true that AVCHD bandwidth wouldn't have problems on the slowest drive today. On the other hand, disk drives are the biggest bottleneck of a computer, so you will notice a difference... just might not be necessary. At the very least, keep OS and data separate, you can easily upgrade data drives at any time.
Click to expand...
----------------------------------------

How are your data drives setup? What OS are you using? What NLE are you using, or used? Do you work off your cards at all? Are you using a RAID configuration?

Sorry about all the questions, but you sound like you've been through it all! I'm trying to avoid any mistakes at my foundation! Thanks, Ron
 
ronedee said:
The SSD drives are waaaaaay out of my league!!

From what I read, a RAID in 1 with 2 drives, doesn't backup, but opens the bandwith real wide. I thought that, or a RAID "5" with 3 drives would be the way to go for editing? But I'm listening!!
Click to expand...
The good SSDs are still a bit too pricey. Velociraptors have become much more affordable if you want a fast drive now. I think I'll wait for SSDs to drop a little, love the idea of a silent drive. I would only use either of those drives as OS drives, they are small and excel at random access. A $100 1TB drive can beat them in sustained transfer (which you need for video).

You are thinking of RAID 0. It can theoretically be about twice as fast and is easy to set up, but you more likely to lose all data on BOTH drives. Consistent backup is absolutely necessary for that type of setup. Raid 5 with 3 or more drives will get you some extra storage, redundancy (and speed depending on the disk operation), very common for editing. No RAID is safe from data loss though. Like any type of storage, plan to keep a backup of anything you intend to keep.
 
ronedee said:
How are your data drives setup? What OS are you using? What NLE are you using, or used? Do you work off your cards at all? Are you using a RAID configuration?

Sorry about all the questions, but you sound like you've been through it all! I'm trying to avoid any mistakes at my foundation! Thanks, Ron
Click to expand...
You can change your data storage set up at any time, so I would put less emphasis on that now. I was going to simply use a 1TB drive for data to start, but had 2 spare 500s I put in RAID 0. It is pretty quick, but the 1TB drives are so fast now that it probably isn't that big of a difference. I figure I'll toss 3 or 4 1TBs into a RAID 5 down the road when needed. Hoping there are bigger single drives to backup to then, haha.

I'm still in a trial phase for software. Put xp32, vista64 and win7 all on. I've been really reluctant to go to vista, but it is sounding like it is finally becoming the way to go in most cases, esp if you want to use more than 3GB of RAM. I find that hardware has a bigger limitation on 64 bit than software. If your stuff doesn't have 64 bit drivers, there is a good chance you are out of luck. Software is finally starting to be offered in 64 bit versions, but 32 is still the norm and works fine on a 64 bit OS in most cases. I'm sticking with XP for audio, but I have yet to have any video issues with vista64.

Win7 is a free beta, bad idea to consider it your main OS... its just a trial. It was quite frustrating starting with 7 and then going back to vista though. Its pretty much the same OS, but they fixed so many of the annoying aspects of Vista. I just removed win7 to free up space since Vista eats up 15GB??? Come on!

I've primarily been a long time premiere user. I've tried a few others and am considering one of the intermediate codecs, but it seems like they all have their flaws at the moment. Seems pointless to get a powerful machine then not edit native. I have noticed that the non-PH modes actually work with most software pretty well... I just hardly ever shoot in that mode! I can edit right off the card to check something, but usually offload the entire card at once for backup. Then drives are much faster when scrubbing. AVCHD runs at 24mbps or lower, but you have to remember that with a long GOP codec the decoder may have to decode a series of frames just to display 1, so this taxes the cpu AND the disk if you are skipping around in a file. Card playback lags a lot more.
 
ronedee said:
-------------------------------

Thanks Hornet! The processors are already installed on the board on this PC. I was wondering how the i7's would stack and found that there were 3 ver. of the i7 processor. Serching the web I found very little benchmark testing comparisons. But the Xeon' were not bad, or far behind the i7's in testing.

Do you really feel that the i7's would boost the production over say, the HD, OS, or ram selection?

From what I've been reading, the processors "nowadays" are pretty much all good! And the biggest factors are the OS and hard drives for getting the pedal to the metal.

Actually, my head is spinning a little with all the info I've been trying to digest! Whewwww!! LOL
Click to expand...


It is my view that an i7 processor with full amount of ram, and an Nvidia 285 card is the best system money can buy before the curve of spending much more money and getting little noticable return for the dollar.
 
mcsmooth said:
Software is finally starting to be offered in 64 bit versions, but 32 is still the norm and works fine on a 64 bit OS in most cases. I'm sticking with XP for audio, but I have yet to have any video issues with vista64..
Click to expand...

This is a point that shouldn't be underestimated. While Vista has had a bad rap, I have actually been very pleased with it - I have been using Vista 64 Ultimate since it was released and have had no issues with it whatsoever. I think MS has done a poor job with the PR aspects of Vista, not necessarily the technical ones.

As mcsmooth pointed out, pretty much all 32 bit software runs quite fine on it, thank you, and more to the point, with 64 bit you can have much more ram available that can be allocated to many 32 bit programs. Under old XP or 32 bit Vista, there is a 4GB ram limit which in fact is usually more like 2.5 - 3.0 GB of usable ram, since the I/O and other system functions chew up nearly a gig of the available address space.

At this point, I wouldn't even consider going back to 32 bit OS or any version of XP.
 
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