Sell it all or wait

[visugeek]

A bird in the hand.

 

[filmmaker's gang]

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[mhood]

A 7D is $1700 US...

 

[mickjones]

I think Lucian nailed it with his comment about Jannard's rant after the 7D was announced. Although there are many obvious differences in the cameras and their capabilities (and price), the fact is that price wise, scarlet was aiming at the budget end of the market (Z1/HVX type of price range) and the 7D has fulfilled many people's needs who otherwise would have bought a scarlet, simply because IT was the cheapest cam with those certain capabilities.

Basically it's killed a lot of the lens adapter+prosumer camcorder market. The 7D has dented that in a big way... at a fraction of the cost and a fraction of the hassles that come with it. Obviously the purchase is dependent on the type of production you are doing... but for me The 7D setup is $9,000 less than HVX-Letus setup. I'm glad I can still use all my other gear with the 7D, base plate, rails, matte box, Zeiss lenses etc and I am sooo far in front in terms of $$$ outlaid. And to be honest, the image out of the 7D kills the letus/HVX for what I want it for.

 

[jfro]

Originally asked in first post?

"I ask this because of my concerns with the 7D's Rolling shutter, and Aliasing. I imagine any fast paced action sequences are almost impossible, or any shots from a moving vehicle recording landscapes also are useless. So what to do."


I think you will find that with the 7D, the good overrules the bad and most things can be worked around and/or minimized.

Here's a motocross clip shot by a pro still photographer which might interest you.

http://vimeo.com/6860546

I have a 7D, 5D MKii and Gh1 and I"m keeping all 3. Not sure if I'm going to be successful mixing all 3, but am guessing in some instances I will. It's a learning process and I'm willing to forgo my old video equipment and 35mm adapters.

 

[reem12]

I would but 2 more of these cams and i would still come out cheaper than a scarlett with the ad ons.

 

[Duke M.]

They are entirely different animals with different strengths and weaknesses.

At this moment you can't buy a Scarlet, and there is the chance they won't make the cheaper versions of the Scarlet, or if they do it won't be for quite some time.

I'd buy the 7D now, use it, and you can pick up something else later. If you buy a Scarlet later it will complement the 7D not take away from it.

 

[Taylor Rudd]

The bigger question at hand is, what things do you shoot J. Odoms? Or rather, what do you plan on shooting?

It sounds like you're in no rush (and that the 7D was a bit of an impulse buy). Either you already have a rig you shoot with, you shoot with rentals/somebody else's gear, or you're just getting into production as a hobbyist/student/start-up amateur or professional.

If you can afford to wait (for a year or more), then do it. If you have things that need to be shot now, buy the tool that best fits your needs now.

 

[Barry_Green]

Do you foresee this happening as a firmware update for the 7D, or will it possibly be in a new camera system altogether?

In no possible way would it be a firmware update. We are talking about new hardware necessary, a proper downscaling chip.

For those who want the DSLR to perform the way they wish, today's products are not what you want. Canon's said they "get it", they understand very much what we want, and they will be building something to meet that demand; obviously Panasonic gets it too; we don't know whether Nikon does or not. If you want a Canon, the Canon you want is probably the 1D Mark IV next year sometime, it should have proper downscaling hardware in it.

 

[Barry_Green]

People are acting like Scarlet will rival RED ONE, I doubt that, unlike Canon and Nikon, they have to protect their high end line.

There's no reason the Scarlet couldn't rival the Red One. The trade-in program "protects" red one owners by giving them a path to the higher end product.

Product lines get introduced that cannibalize the prior product all the time. It's called progress. If the Scarlet doesn't rival the red one, I'd say they did something pretty wrong.

There has to be significant daylight between Epic and Scarlet in terms of IQ.

Well, yes, there I'd agree -- they'd better offer something substantially better with the Epic if they want to justify the increased price.

 

[Lucian]

There's no reason the Scarlet couldn't rival the Red One.

Common sense is the reason. A R1 is still a $25,000 camera that producers a killer, film comparable image. I don't believe for a second that the same company will release something nearly as good, as good, or BETTER for $3,000. I've never seen a quantum leap like that in price/performance metrics. Red isn't going to shoot themselves in the foot by releasing a $3,000 camera that's better than their flagship model which will be with us for a long time no doubt.

 

[Chance White]

Sell your 7D to me. You know the Scarlet is going to be so AMAZING. Srsly. K thx.

 

[J. Odoms]

Sell your 7D to me. You know the Scarlet is going to be so AMAZING. Srsly. K thx.

LOL, no thanks man, and I think I'll keep it.

Thanks so much guys for all of your contributions to this thread. It's funny because the two most selected choices were actually one-in-the-same, and closets to my thoughts.

I think instead of spending that extra $1K on new primes I think I'll place a hold on my Scarlet instead, and rent primes as projects become available.

Now I know I'm simply speculating that Red will even take place holders, and that it'd even be a Grand to do so, but I'm attempting to gamble on the latest tech.

By the way that Motocross video synched it for me, and the footage was AWESOME. Completely reminds me why I fell in love with this camera to begin with.

Thanks Everyone for your help.

 

[commanderspike]

I'm going to have to disagree with you there. As a few here (most notably Kholi, I think) have noted, one of the biggest things standing in the way of traditional-form camcorders with APS-C chips is the non-existence of fully-servo-driven AF lenses that are sufficiently fast (both in terms of aperture and focusing speed). Those are the kind of lenses that broadcast professionals expect, not still photo lenses. Remember that Panasonic reportedly spent several months optimizing the GH1 kit lens for video use, and it's still not a real "video lens." So I can't imagine that designing such lenses would be as easy as sticking an APS-C sensor inside of a traditional camcorder body.

Interesting point, making a video lens to cover such large sensors is never going to be easy.

Panasonic left out a powered zoom for example. It was gonna make the lens massive. The lens was already too big for the objectives of Micro 4/3rds so Panasonic had to compromise.

I've realised with the 5D that getting a full frame lens to compete with the GH1's kit lens is very expensive, if not impossible.

The ideal camera will be the GH2. Faster hardware and improvements in the CMOS chip sensitivity will result in a much nicer image, free of the compression the GH1 suffers from. I hope their market research lets them make it

In 6 months time, I expect the 7D owners will be kicking themselves and thinking 'why didn't I wait'? Unless that is you produce amazing footage with it until then, which I am sure you all will, and which I am sure is worth more than the camera to you.

 

[Isaac_Brody]

In 6 months time, I expect the 7D owners will be kicking themselves and thinking 'why didn't I wait'? Unless that is you produce amazing footage with it until then, which I am sure you all will, and which I am sure is worth more than the camera to you.

Or perhaps we'll be busy shooting with our cameras instead of wasting our time on comparison threads and buyers remorse.

There is always something better around the corner. I've said this before and it bears repeating. Don't invest your emotional well being or ego into your gear. Especially when the tech is changing so quickly. It used to be that a camcorder came out and you got a year or two of use and bragging rights out of it before something new came along. It wasn't so bad because people would make back their investment several times through work. Now it's a case of you buy a camera and a part of you feels like it's obsolete when the next best thing comes out.

 

[Rory_B]

In 6 months time, I expect the 7D owners will be kicking themselves and thinking 'why didn't I wait'?

If everyone waited for the next best thing, nobody would ever film anything.

 

[Perry Wilson]

Makin some bucks with the 7D then... S35 Scarlet (quarter 4 2018) lol

 

[Kegan]

In 6 months time, I expect you to eat your words. Maybe you suddenly think you're going to become a pro with a Scarlet? I kind of like people like you however. The more people like that, the less competition there is for me.

Keep waitin', I'll keep shootin'.

Kegan

* - and yes, I see that you have a GH1 and you probably shoot, blah blah blah...however, you seem to think that preaching to 7D buyers that they're wasting their money makes so much sense. What's the difference if someone bought a GH1? Are you going to be kicking yourself for not waiting?

 

[Barry_Green]

Common sense is the reason. A R1 is still a $25,000 camera that producers a killer, film comparable image. I don't believe for a second that the same company will release something nearly as good, as good, or BETTER for $3,000.

$3,000 isn't a Scarlet, that's a ... Pink... or something. Puce. Maybe orange. It's not even scarlet. The 2/3" is -- well, we'll see when the new announcements are made at the end of this month but I wouldn't be surprised at all to hear that the 2/3" model has been dropped.

The video SLRs have changed people's expectations. When a GH1 at $1500 has a sensor 4x as large as a 2/3" chip, how happy will you be to pay two or three times as much to get a sensor 1/4 the size? Bah, I say. Bah. 2/3" Scarlet made a lot of sense two years ago when it was announced, but now? 2/3" is soooo passe. I mean, are you really seriously going to want to bolt a Letus or M2 on the front of your Scarlet just to get the same DOF that GH1 and 7D users are getting from their under-$2,000 cameras?

To me the Scarlet starts at the S35 size.

And yes, I have no reason to think that an S35 Scarlet *wouldn't* perform as good as, or better than, a Red One. Its sensor is just as big, its resolution is higher, and it's the later-generation Mysterium-X, which Jim has said repeatedly is a significant jump in performance over the original Mysterium.

I've never seen a quantum leap like that in price/performance metrics. Red isn't going to shoot themselves in the foot by releasing a $3,000 camera that's better than their flagship model which will be with us for a long time no doubt.

Well, the Red One isn't their flagship model, it's their only model. And it's not going to be the flagship the second the Epic is released. There's a reason they're offering the Epic-X upgrade program after all. Obsolescence may be obsolete, but probably not with the Red One, I think every One owner is going to be strongly encouraged to get on the DSMC bandwagon. I don't think Red views the Red One as the future, that's the past and the present but not the future; they're engineering everything around the modular DSMC concept. I think Jim's already gone on record saying something like "any Red One owner who hasn't ordered an Epic-X is going to be kicking themselves" or something like that.

 

[Tim Joy]

If you take care of your gear, it has a very good resale value. Look at the prices for used cameras, and there are plenty of buyers out there in ebay-land. . I owned a D90 for 6 months and sold it for about $150 less than I paid. That's a steal for a 6 month rental. Buy, sell, buy, sell. It's fun, like christmas every 6 months and you'll always have the latest and greatest while you go out and shoot, practice, and make some $ for the next one.