Panasonic Stereo Mic vs Rode Stereo VideoMic

Thanks for the train & bird sounds, Ozpeter! Sounds quite nice to me, meaning quite usable.

Question: Can you recall the approximate distance the mic was from the train tracks? (I'm just trying to get a sense of approx. ambient sound levels vs. recording quality.)

Your written descriptions are very helpful in "calibrating" my ears to what you've recorded. Thank you for that. If I may request, if you are able to provide additional sound clips, please continue describing the overall scene especially approx. distances to sound sources -- and if indoors -- approx. room size & surface materials. This sort of info helps me make rough evaluations of the recording being heard.

As for casual recording of live music, I understand musicians being sometimes quite hesitant about it -- and for good reason. The nice thing about having even just a few seconds worth of such test samples is because, for the most part, a trumpet is a trumpet, a guitar a guitar, and so forth, the world over.

Obviously there are going to be huge variations in sound quality resulting from mic placement, individual instrument & player tonality, etc., but given how few GH1 cams there are -- and how incredibly few GH1 users are able to put together such test sound clips for the rest of us -- such samples are to me at least extremely helpful, and just plain _interesting_.

It was fun listening to that bird on the train recording. It sounded awfully annoyed! :-)
 
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Question: Can you recall the approximate distance the mic was from the train tracks?
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I'm really bad at distance estimation... about 20 - 25 feet? The camera really compresses the train vs the birds (sound like a nasty accident) considerably - if I were making the same recording using uncompressed audio, the birds would be much more background, and the train would make you jump back. But with the addition of video, the ear I think accepts the compression more - it gets kind of diverted, and you 'hear what you see' rather than hearing what you are hearing.

I'll indeed try to post any further interesting / useful examples in due course.
 
Hi Guys

Firstly, thanks so much to everyone here for their opinions on the various microphones available. In the end, I opted for the Sennheiser MKE400 as much because of its neatness and compact size as anything. I haven't been disappointed (especially as I knew to order a 2.5mm-3.5mm adaptor at the same time!).

I had a couple of interviews to shoot for work, and the results from GH1/MKE400 setup blew everyone away. The (iMovie edited) result of one interview is at http://www.vimeo.com/7317644 if anyone's interested. Be gentle with me, it's my first time! I shot from about 1.5 - 2m away from the subject, in aperture-priority at f5.6.
 
Really wish someone could give a side by side comparison of the DMC-MS1, Rode Video Mic and the Sennheiser MKE 400 with a simple contrled room interview. Something much like this http://vimeo.com/groups/gh1/videos/7284924 but instead of DMC-MS1 versus Zoom (which we all know is the better option), just the 3 above listed.

The sound quality of the Rode Video mic is very good considering GH1 limitations (but it's so fu**ing big) and am willing to spend a little extra on the Sennheiser if the quality is equivilant.

If any one has access to these three mics, please try and throw a simple test up.

Thanks!
 
Hi Guys, I just loaded a 20min video on Youtube about Mt Fuji.

Filmed it with Rode Stereo Mic on Gh1.
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I AGREE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5cReCc6lDU

You can also see this other video which can be an example of Gh1 without the mic in Narita airport guide video.
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I AGREE


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-3K6NLBxiYA
 
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Jack Daniel Stanley said:
For what?
And you know recording audio to the GH1 is "just for fun". You cannot disable audio gain without certain accessories so you shouldn't use it for serious narrative or doc work.
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What can you actually do with the GH1 audio? It's just an auto feature? So it's like film then, you must post sync everything?
 
Yup, basically all vDSLRs are like that. There are sound mixers which add a high frequency tone to fool the auto gain but I've never like such solutions as the high end has to be cut-off too much for my taste. Besides for recording really serious production sound a good sound guy is needed anyway and I rather not be tethered to him with audio cords. Especially when using such a small movable camera. FWIW all sounds in 'Sthlm Rim Shots' come from the GH1 built-in mic except for the city ambience sound bed which I recorded at a different place with a Zoom H4n using it's built-in mics.

There's a post-sync software called Plural Eyes that can sync up several tracks from the same occasion automatically within Final Cut Pro.
 
Martti Ekstrand said:
Yup, basically all vDSLRs are like that. There are sound mixers which add a high frequency tone to fool the auto gain but I've never like such solutions as the high end has to be cut-off too much for my taste. Besides for recording really serious production sound a good sound guy is needed anyway and I rather not be tethered to him with audio cords. Especially when using such a small movable camera. FWIW all sounds in 'Sthlm Rim Shots' come from the GH1 built-in mic except for the city ambience sound bed which I recorded at a different place with a Zoom H4n using it's built-in mics.

There's a post-sync software called Plural Eyes that can sync up several tracks from the same occasion automatically within Final Cut Pro.
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So better just have a good digital audio recorder from day one, and get used to a good work flow for audio sync in post. You have to invest in a few mics as it is anyway. If your lucky some of the Gh1 audio will work, but there is nothing better that perfect audio and well worth the effort. In the end it will always take longer with marginal results, trying to fix something gone wrong rather than doing it right from the start.

What is your pick for a portable stereo audio recorder? (on a budget of course)
 
The Zoom H4n is very popular around here. Decently rugged, flexible little thing with 2 built in mics of it's own. I sprung for one, and now I understand why it's highly regarded.
 
saaby said:
The Zoom H4n is very popular around here. Decently rugged, flexible little thing with 2 built in mics of it's own. I sprung for one, and now I understand why it's highly regarded.
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Looks like a stun gun, are the mics angle adjustable for longer shots?
I've got a few old high end Sony studio wire Lavs I'd like to use with XLR. I just looked up at B&H and it does have XLR input, very cool. My Sony lavs are 8 ohm and don't match everything I have plugged them into in the past without a buzz. I do have a variety of Ohm converters I've used to match them up with digital cameras but each new camera is a crap shoot. Just gotta try and hope for the best.
 
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tflak said:
Built-in mics are adjustable from 90-120º.

Links to a promo video and the manual:
http://images.samsontech.com/images/Videos/Product_Videos/zoom/H4_Next_web.mp4
http://s3.amazonaws.com/samsontech/related_docs/H4n-manual.pdf
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So the mics flip around to target the left and right sound source independently? Say in the case of a jet fly by or car a race track the stereo can be much wider as the object enters the frame from one side and exits out the other?
I assume that since it's called "Zoom" that the mics can zoom digitally as well. How much independent control do you have between left and right channels digitally?
 
Zoom is just the brand. The mics don't have any digital zoom. I never really understood what that was supposed to do with a Mic anyway. Depending on the mode you record in, you might not have *any* control over the "L" and "R" mic. Others will have to chime in on some of the other specifics.

I'm using it with an old UHF (But over 700 Mhz? High enough that it doesn't matter) Audio Technica Lav system and the results are fantastic. One of the nice things, and I'm sure other recorders can do similar things, is that it has a threaded base on the bottom, to which you can thread a little plastic shaft that makes it possible to set the thing in a standard Mic stand.

So I have a boom stand I put my recorder on.

I bought it on eBay and it came with a wired remote.

If I'm in a quiet room, I lav my subject and try to put the zoom as close to them as I can, as backup sound, using the remote to turn it on and off.

If I'm in a noisier environment, than I just put the zoom close to me on the stand and press the buttons right on the unit itself.
 
The mics don't do anything but rotate in place which varies the width of the sound field from 90-120º. It's not like they swivel from side to side to target the left or right.

As saaby indicated, control over panning depends on what recording mode you're in. It would be best to check the manual because it can get complicated.
 
Anybody used the Tascam DR-100 Professional Portable Digital Audio Recorder.

At $399 it's about a hundred bucks more than the Zoom H4n , but I have had good service with Tascam audio products. May be worth it in the long run.
 
Ozpeter said:
Here's a link to an mp3 (4.3MB) of the Rode Stereo VideoMic (SVM) connected to the GH1, compared to the GH1 built in mic.

http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/9/22/1451533/Rode GH1 test.mp3

You first hear me talking with the Rode on its 0dB setting, then some room silence, then me talking on the Rode using its -10dB setting (which is what I would recommend), then some more room silence, then more talking using the GH1's own built in mic, plus more room silence.

The sound quality using the Rode SVM is, imho, significantly better than the built in mic, both tonally and in terms of stereo image. Its noise level in conjunction with the GH1 is in line with my expectations, given that when there's silence, the GH1 turns its input up to the max. During the tests there was a small battery clock the other side of the room ticking once a second, and I was unaware of it until listening to the playbacks, where it can be heard quite clearly. The SVM output level is too high unless recording birdsong or the like - its -10dB pad should be switched in. Then its level seems comparable with the built in mic. The built in mic seems to pick up some kind of steady system noise - overall I think I prefer the noise level using the SVM.

The SVM comes with a very effective dead kitten windshield, and has a suspension built in to reduce handling noise. However, it's barely possible to use the viewfinder with the SVM on top of the camera - a side bracket would be necessary if you don't want to use the LCD screen.

I haven't yet tried the SVM on an extension mic cord with the GH1 (which would allow you to locate the mic closer to the sound source) but that's not been a problem with a 20 foot lead on other gear.


There's no substitute for properly aquired sound but if you can't use an independent sound rig, in my view the SVM is significantly better than just using the built in mics. Bear in mind it requires a 3.5mm to 2.5mm adaptor, and one that will physically fit into the small space on the side of the GH1. Also bear in mind that there's no monitoring of sound during recording, so if you forget to turn on the external mic, you'll only get the reminder the camera rather neatly gives you when you first switch it on.

I can't compare the SVM with other similar mics because I don't have them.
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Thank you for your sound clips, Peter! They are very helpful. I've listened to them multiple times on my Sennheiser HD595 headphones and my impressions are yes the SVM has more stereo separation than the camera mics, but the continual hiss from the SVM is unpleasant, even at the -10db setting. When I listen with cheaper headphones, the hiss isn't as pronounced but I also can't hear the bird/clock/car like I can with the HD595. What headphones/speakers are you using to listen to your clips? Do you hear the continual SVM hiss as well?
 
The manufacturer's noise spec for the SVM is "Equivalent Noise: 19 dBA SPL (A - weighted per IEC651)" - I would regard that as around the lowest acceptable noise level for a mic (anything over 20dbA is I think generally considered dubious). But when replaying the samples bear in mind that the clock tick should be close to inaudible - and the built in mics really don't reveal it at all. I tend to use HD580's cans at home.
 
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