Cary Knoop
Veteran
Indeed, and chances are it will disappear as quickly as it appeared.
Panasonic S1H Announcement Tuesday, August 27th
- Thread starter TheDingo
- Start date
Hard to say. There is certainly a full frame craze, not sure if it will last. I assume Panasonic is still planning for a GH6 though.
NorBro
Major Contributor
There has been a full-frame craze in photography for 15+ years.
Nothing new...it's just that it finally made its way to video. Video has always chased photography.
And even so, Sony users have been shooting full-frame 4K video since 2014.
It's really nothing new, people.
Nothing new...it's just that it finally made its way to video. Video has always chased photography.
And even so, Sony users have been shooting full-frame 4K video since 2014.
It's really nothing new, people.
Cary Knoop
Veteran
Then why stop there, who cares about full or even medium frame, let's get a large format "portable" video camera, must be even better.....
NorBro
Major Contributor
Maybe one day...but there are too many issues right now.
Besides hardware, they would be too much money, not enough lenses, specs for video are not there yet, focusing would/could be a problem.
FF video was the future a long time ago. As mentioned above, video chased photography, always. I know in hindsight that's easy to say, but it really was. Especially with these cameras that provide FF, S35 and S16 modes for everyone. Or new cameras like from Z CAM that provide large sensors with MFT mounts (and may/should have S16 modes).
A S1H, which isn't terribly bigger than a GH5/S could have everything you're asking for with a MFT mount (if Panasonic chose to sell it with one).
Then you can go into the S16 mode and shoot MFT all day long. And for those times you need S35 or FF, you can do that too.
And the bigger sensors should provide us better specs; resolutions, framerates, DR, colors.
IMO, it's not exactly just about shooting full-frame; it's also about building a camera with highly capable modern-day full-frame sensors with options.
Cary Knoop
Veteran
Wait till you have to handheld this with a decent range full frame zoom lens for a few hours.....
Cary Knoop
Veteran
But who would fork out $4000+ for that?
And this is why I see the S1H as an alternative to the GH5 or GH6 cameras. I'm not planning on dumping my MFT gear when I buy the S1H. It's an alternative that I can use when I need better low-light or want to produce higher IQ.
rob norton
Veteran
I think it may be a bit of trend right now for netflix shows to feature super shallow DOF but that's more a stylistic choice than being an unavoidable issue with the format. So I can see the extreme shallow DOF trend coming and going but FF video is going nowhere. Like norbro said it'll be whatever large sensor, along with any smaller accompanying sensor "modes".
I think shallow DOF got a slightly bad wrap from the 5d ii with so many amateurs having such easy access to shallow depth of field. I'm not saying this in a bad or elitist way - I thought it was cool too. I know there were s35 adapters before this but it really took off with the canon. At the same time vimeo exploded so there was a perfect storm of people putting out lots of their own content. At the large TV show/feature level, while they're playing with depth of field and maybe overdoing it, it's not like they're struggling to find focus unlike many 5d ii vimeo videos. Remember how many videos featured a shot that was blurry with a face/object coming into focus?
Along with amazing AF developments I definitely think we're at a point of no return.
I think shallow DOF got a slightly bad wrap from the 5d ii with so many amateurs having such easy access to shallow depth of field. I'm not saying this in a bad or elitist way - I thought it was cool too. I know there were s35 adapters before this but it really took off with the canon. At the same time vimeo exploded so there was a perfect storm of people putting out lots of their own content. At the large TV show/feature level, while they're playing with depth of field and maybe overdoing it, it's not like they're struggling to find focus unlike many 5d ii vimeo videos. Remember how many videos featured a shot that was blurry with a face/object coming into focus?
Along with amazing AF developments I definitely think we're at a point of no return.
Of course, I am guesstimating. But I was in the electronic retail for a long time and everything I read about the photo-video retail seems to comply with what I recall from my years in the business.
So, in BMD's case, I figure their cost is around $500 for Pocket4K and around $1,000 for Pocket6K. If you compare BMD with the Z Cams, it's pretty close, depending on the feature set. Their relative margins must be similar, both give away some grading, editing packages.
As to sensor size, films have been made on Panavision and Todd AO 70mm systems since the 1950's. 35mm SLR's were created/made popular as consumer cameras by Leica in the 1930's but the photo pros were using the medium format Rolleiflex and its iterations. Landscape and architecture pros were also busy with the large format (i.e., Ansel Adams)
Edit : this was done on manual lenses. Now, both Sony and Canon offer excellent AF with native glass, while Panasonic and Nikon are trying to follow suit.
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puredrifting
Major Contributor
You say this kiddingly, but I could see this actually happening. It seems as if the manufacturers will do anything to not have to actually innovate. Larger sensors and increasing resolution have been a very convenient way to avoid innovation for years now.
Unlike most users, I see resolution wars and FF sensors as a cop out. But the market definitely doesn't. That's why the C500 MKII and the FX9 HAD to have FF sensors and 6K and I have no doubt that if they could have, Canon and Sony would have made them 8K or even 12K
resolution. Think if the C500 MKII would have had FF but the FX9 would have retained a S35 sensor, the marekt would have instantly rendered the FX9 as an abject failure. The brainwashing is complete.
It's funny but it seems as if the market for digital cinema cameras has become VERY Lemming-like over the past few years. I see very little healthy cynicism or skepticism about WHY the manufacturers shove things down users throats instead of listening to what
users want and need to do their jobs more effectively. it seems as if the average customer just buys into whatever nonsense the manufacturers are selling.
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C-AF Comparison Between Sony A7III and Panasonic S1
C-AF Comparison Between Sony A7III and Panasonic S1
Sure this is for the S1 camera, but I would expect the S1H to perform the same way once it's firmware is brought up to speed.
C-AF Comparison : Sony A7III vs Panasonic S1
Not in English, but you can see what's going on. Start at the 2:56 mark...
C-AF Comparison Between Sony A7III and Panasonic S1
Sure this is for the S1 camera, but I would expect the S1H to perform the same way once it's firmware is brought up to speed.
C-AF Comparison : Sony A7III vs Panasonic S1
Not in English, but you can see what's going on. Start at the 2:56 mark...
NorBro
Major Contributor
I know you most likely think this is good - and thank you for posting it, truly - but this an absolutely PERFECT example of why the Panasonic AF is inferior.
Just look at the background in every single shot. It pulses continuously. (Look at the ZOOM letters...growing and shrinking.)
Panasonic C-AF is far from perfect, but it's not as bad as people are making it out to be, and most of the pulsing can be reduced or eliminated by lowering the AF sensitivity with the camera settings. I have seen other S1 C-AF tests where the background did nothing at all, it just appeared static.
I haven't kept track of every S1 review video I've seen, but I do remember watching at least one where they turned down the AF sensitivity on the camera and it became a whole other animal when it came to the lack of C-AF pulsing. ( I can't remember if this slowed down the C-AF focusing speed or not. It might have. )