Panasonic Announces New HPX-170

hungrych

hungrych

Well-known member
http://www.freshdv.com/2008/04/panasonic-announces-new-hpx-170.html

Continuing with Panasonics announcements from their press conference the newly announced HPX-170. I’ll reserve any thoughts on these cameras until I can get my hands on them tomorrow, but my initial response is that this camera will not be the HVX200a or HVX200 replacement.

ag-hpx170-in-hand.jpg


Press Release:
LAS VEGAS, NV (April 13, 2008) – Panasonic unveiled here at NAB the AG-HPX170, a fully solid-state P2 HD handheld camcorder. A full production quality tool, the solid-state handheld camcorder enables high definition and standard definition recording, the widest zoom lens in its class, and a HD-SDI interface for connection to baseband production and distribution infrastructure, all in a lightweight 4.2-pound body.
Fully solid-state, the two-slot HPX170 is a 1080p capable camcorder that offers the compelling advantages of P2 technology including: no moving parts unlike tape, hard disk drive, or disc-based systems; instant random access to recorded HD or SD content; a faster IT compatible file-based workflow; and the ability to operate in harsh environments with resistance to temperature extremes, shock and vibration.
Building on the success of the AG-HVX200, the HPX170 is equipped with new advanced 1/3-inch 16:9 3-CCDs and a high-performance digital signal processor with 14-bit A/D conversion and 19-bit processing to deliver broadcast-quality, independent frame recordings. The HPX170 offers a 13X Leica Dicomar zoom lens with a 28mm wide-angle setting (the widest in its class) and a cam-driven manual zoom for smooth, easy and precise operation. For added flexibility, the camera provides auto or manual focus and iris.
The multi-format camera records in 20 HD and SD formats; in a variety of 1080i and 720p formats in DVCPRO HD, in 480i in DVCPRO50 and DVCPRO, and in 480i in DV. It’s switchable between 16:9/4:3 aspect ratios. The HPX170 offers a 20-step frame rate selection in 720p mode for variable-speed shooting in the 12fps to 60fps range to acquire fast- or slow-motion in-camera effects. For added creative flexibility, professionals can select from a variety of advanced gamma functions and settings including a CineGammaTM mode.
With its two P2 card slots, users can record up to 64 continuous minutes of the highest quality DVCPRO HD recording using currently available 32GB P2 cards. Record times will double with the release of Panasonic’s 64GB P2 card in the fall. Other user-friendly recording modes include hot swapping for non-stop recording, loop record, pre-record, interval and one-shot recording. A time/date stamp function makes it ideal for use in law enforcement environments.
The HPX170 is equipped with an HD/SD-SDI output standard for live feed productions as well as for editing and monitoring. It also has IEEE 1394 and USB 2.0 interfaces for fast P2 content transfer into NLE systems, and offers a composite output, component output (mini D-terminal) and a time-code setting via IEEE 1394. The camera also features a built-in stereo microphone and two-channel XLR audio input terminals supporting 48V phantom power supply with a selectable mic/line; and manual audio level volume (two-channel). Other convenient operational features include clip preview on the camera’s 3.5” color LCD monitor; instant recording startup, scene files, assignable user buttons, focus assist and a camera remote function.
The AG-HPX170 will be available in fall 2008. It will be covered by Panasonic’s five-year limited P2 HD warranty*.
About P2 HD
P2 HD all solid-state products offer high-definition recording without the mechanical wear and environmental limitations of tape, hard disk, and optical disc based systems. P2 HD ensures the highest
reliability, especially in challenging conditions of extreme temperature range, shock, and vibration. P2 HD products provide a significant reduction in maintenance costs, longer useful product life, and immediate access to recorded video (no need to digitize, ingest or create proxy video files) and metadata. P2 HD provides the reliability of solid-state production; the immediate connectivity to existing IT infrastructures; the speed, ease of use and portability of P2 cards; and interoperability with leading NLE systems.
About Panasonic Broadcast
Panasonic Broadcast & Television Systems Co. is a leading supplier of broadcast and professional video products and systems. Panasonic Broadcast is a unit company of Panasonic Corporation of North
America. The company is the North American headquarters of Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Ltd. (NYSE: MC) of Japan, and the hub of its U.S. marketing, sales, service and R&D operations. For more information on Panasonic Broadcast products, access the company’s web site at www.panasonic.com/broadcast.
*To lower total ownership costs, Panasonic offers a five-year limited warranty (Panasonic Broadcast’s normal 1-year basic warranty plus an extended warranty for years two through five upon product registration).
 
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Interesting. Feature wise it sounds exactly like an HVX, although there is no noticeable new feature to be found except for the HD-SDI port. If this is not a replacement how are they going to distinguish this product from the HVX? Hopefully this won't be a case of the Canon A1/G1 style of marketing.
 
No tape mech. So for those strictly working with P2 without the need for a tape ever i would consider it an HVX replacement.
 
What is the price? Hearing about 1/3 inch chip cameras just seem so plain now. Hopefully this is Priced to compete with the Canon A1.
 
tmnt said:
errr... I don't get it. So it's a HVX with HD-SDI?
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Mostly, yes. But it's smaller, lighter, and adds HD-SDI, a waveform monitor, increased sensitivity, lower noise, another ND filter position, a wider-angle lens, and a few other things. I'll know more tomorrow. Right now it's a tapeless HVX with a lot of nice little improvements (like, its firewire port is six-pin instead of 4-pin).
 
Huy Vu said:
Interesting. Feature wise it sounds exactly like an HVX, although there is no noticeable new feature to be found except for the HD-SDI port. If this is not a replacement how are they going to distinguish this product from the HVX? Hopefully this won't be a case of the Canon A1/G1 style of marketing.
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The HVX is bigger and fatter and has tape, the 170 is smaller and thinner and lighter and has no tape, and has a few other new features (at least, ones that I could see on the outside. There may be more lurking under the hood, but the one I saw wasn't a functional model).
 
Nik Manning said:
What is the price?
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Wasn't mentioned. I would anticipate it being in the same ballpark as the 200, but maybe a little lower because it has a smaller model number.

Hearing about 1/3 inch chip cameras just seem so plain now. Hopefully this is Priced to compete with the Canon A1.
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Why not the XLH1S? That's a 1/3" camera at $9,000. This unit has HD-SDI, which means they're aiming at a higher market than the Canon A1; more like the Canon G1.
 
Barry_Green said:
Wasn't mentioned. I would anticipate it being in the same ballpark as the 200, but maybe a little lower because it has a smaller model number.
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It can't be that much lower, seeing as how the HMC-150's MSRP will be around $4,500 (which is $500-$1,000 more than most predictions here).
 
Initial imopressions from the press:

Aestheticaly Looks like the HMC-150, but recording to P2.

Performance wise sounds like the same as the HVX, but with the HD-SDI option.

My guess is that the HMC, HVX and this HPX 170 share the same 1/3 CCD block. However, this can only be proven with hands-on experience.

Heard the CCD's are now 1280x720 native pixel shifted. We need Barry, and Adam Witt to do some hands on on these!

Personal opinion following the competition announcements: disappointed.

EDIT- And the 5 slot p2 to Express card adapter for 2000 dollars? Come on!
 
SPZ said:
Heard the CCD's are now 1280x720 native pixel shifted. We need Barry, and Adam Witt to do some hands on on these!
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That'd sweet, but I've always laboured under the impression that higher pixel counts mean lower individual pixel sensor sizes, which leads to greater smearing, lower sensitivity, and lower latitude.
 
Tzedekh said:
It can't be that much lower, seeing as how the HMC-150's MSRP will be around $4,500 (which is $500-$1,000 more than most predictions here).
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Well, you gotta learn to read between the words. When the HVX200 was announced, Panasonic said it would be "less than $10,000" -- it ended up being $5995. When the HD100 was introduced, JVC said it would be "less than $10,000" -- it ended up being $6295.

All they've said is "less than $4500". I doubt it will be $4495! I'm betting on $3995 with a street price of $3495. But if the dollar continues to plunge against the Yen, then maybe it will be $4500 by then. I think they gave vague pricing primarily to protect themselves from further erosion of the exchange rate. But, we'll see in September/October/November, whenever they come out.
 
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poweredbyjolt said:
Does anyone else think these new panny's look cheap? I look at it and I just think they missed the mark.
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I dunno, I saw the models and I thought they looked slick. Sort of a step back towards the more-mechanical hard edge of the DVX100, less of the bulbous puffiness of the HVX200.
 
SPZ said:
Personal opinion following the competition announcements: disappointed.
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Disappointed that the competition announced a $13,000 product, and Panasonic announced a $5800 product and a $4500 product? Well, if you want to compare a $13,000 EX3 against a $4500 HMC150 and think they should be the same, then yes I could see why someone would be disappointed. But for 1/3 the price, I think they look pretty cool.

Apparently Panasonic doesn't intend to "answer" the EX3 with anything other than the existing 2/3" HPX500. As far as answering the EX1, the 170 may be what we get. I'd have to test 'em side by side, but they're claiming increased sensitivity, decreased noise, and lower smear: all of which directly competes against the EX1's advantages. So all you're really left with, image-wise, is a sharper rolling-shutter imager vs. a softer no-rolling-shutter imager (and, oh yeah, it'll probably be about $2,000 less.)

The Japanese companies seem to really hate to go head-to-head anywhere. The more I learn about them, the more convinced I become that they parcel the market up amongst themselves. Each apparently gets to stake out some territory. Everyone seems content to let Sony have the 1/2" arena all to themselves; Panasonic has claimed the low-cost 1/3" market and the low-cost 2/3". Canon seems to limit themselves to HDV tape, and JVC gets the 720P market.

EDIT- And the 5 slot p2 to Express card adapter for 2000 dollars? Come on!
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Yeah, I was really hoping for a $500 single-slot device, but that didn't happen.
 
Barry_Green said:
The HVX is bigger and fatter and has tape, the 170 is smaller and thinner and lighter and has no tape, and has a few other new features (at least, ones that I could see on the outside. There may be more lurking under the hood, but the one I saw wasn't a functional model).
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True, but will that be enough difference for the consumer? If there isn't one huge selling point that differentiate the two cameras, people will always go for the newer version assuming that it's better. On the other hand, if this is an A1/G1 situation, where the 170 is basically a higher priced version of the "basic" HVX model, then I'm willing to bet that it's not gonna do well. Very few people wanted the pay an extra $2000 for the G1's jackpack, and I doubt they would want to pay just for waveform monitor.
 
Barry_Green said:
Well, you gotta learn to read between the words. When the HVX200 was announced, Panasonic said it would be "less than $10,000" -- it ended up being $5995. When the HD100 was introduced, JVC said it would be "less than $10,000" -- it ended up being $6295.

All they've said is "less than $4500". I doubt it will be $4495! I'm betting on $3995 with a street price of $3495. But if the dollar continues to plunge against the Yen, then maybe it will be $4500 by then.
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Maybe, but "less than $4,500" is a lot more specific than "less than $10,000" -- why not "less than $5,000" or "less than $4,000"? And regarding the dollar's decline relative to the yen, Panasonic could charge $4,500, but then it would be in danger of alienating the huge U.S. market. Of course, we haven't heard the MSRP of the HVX200A. If Panasonic raises the price much above $6,000 when the reported improvements have been underwhelming (not even an LCD flip), then maybe it will go for $4,500 on the 150.
 
For people who don’t usually lift weights, the HPX170 could be an excellent choice compared to the EX1 unless their used to carrying a stabilizer. The weight advantage of the HPX170 is definitely something to consider.
 
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