is this place getting clicky?

N

n1c02

Well-known member
I dont mean so sound rude or unappreciative of this forum. because I have learned alot from this forum and the people on it. I have read and read the posts, stickies, ect for years and finally joined almost 4 years ago.. in no way am I at any level of expertise to give advice to anyone, but I would if I thought It were something that I learned and know that would benefit someone else.. That is what I thought this forum was all about. learning, talking giving and taking advice.

I have done this before... asked a question about something that in general, probably COULD be found by doing a search. but... sometimes even doing a search, it's nice to ask a question and want more of a personalised answer as to waht you are doing or trying to do.
I dont consider myself a "NEWB" but i also dont consider myself someone who could fill most of the older people on this forums shoes. But with that being said I see alot of times someone will ask a question or post something and I see some attacking with .. nothing more than .. if you dont have the money to buy the best then dont do it, if you cant hire someone dont do it.. remember not everyone here has always been a seasoned cinematographer, director, ect... everyone started somewhere. but seems I have been watching lately, that if you arent "up to par", then its almost that you shouldnt speak. Im not trying to flame, be rude, or anything else otherwise, I come to this forum on a daily basis looking too see what others are doing, new ideas, how to's, whats for sale, and yes even DIY.. I spend more time here looking over posts than I do facebook.

I guess I love seeing and hearing what others have accomplished, but its a real downer when you come here and see negativity all the time and in some ways discouraged not to ask.. I know I know.. "SEARCH" but as Ive said sometimes maybe the person asking is looking for something jsut a bit off of what was posted a year ago, or maybe couldnt find it. I know some of you will jsut tell me to shut up or move on, but DVXUSER is a great place to learn and share forum, not just a static info site.. lets all interact..and see everyone as filmmakers... whether is be a newb or seasoned, we are all here to discuss the the same thing right?...

Terry
 
Just to add to that a little ... there's something funky about the search function here. On Google and on other forums I frequent I have a high rate of successful searches, so I don't think I'm being necessarily a complete idiot about it. But here, not so much .... I search for old threads that I've read, using search terms I'm sure are in those threads, but never find them (except sometimes by going back out to a generic Google search). YMMV.
 
n1c02 said:
I dont mean so sound rude or unappreciative of this forum. because I have learned alot from this forum and the people on it. I have read and read the posts, stickies, ect for years and finally joined almost 4 years ago.. in no way am I at any level of expertise to give advice to anyone, but I would if I thought It were something that I learned and know that would benefit someone else.. That is what I thought this forum was all about. learning, talking giving and taking advice.

I have done this before... asked a question about something that in general, probably COULD be found by doing a search. but... sometimes even doing a search, it's nice to ask a question and want more of a personalised answer as to waht you are doing or trying to do.
I dont consider myself a "NEWB" but i also dont consider myself someone who could fill most of the older people on this forums shoes. But with that being said I see alot of times someone will ask a question or post something and I see some attacking with .. nothing more than .. if you dont have the money to buy the best then dont do it, if you cant hire someone dont do it.. remember not everyone here has always been a seasoned cinematographer, director, ect... everyone started somewhere. but seems I have been watching lately, that if you arent "up to par", then its almost that you shouldnt speak. Im not trying to flame, be rude, or anything else otherwise, I come to this forum on a daily basis looking too see what others are doing, new ideas, how to's, whats for sale, and yes even DIY.. I spend more time here looking over posts than I do facebook.

I guess I love seeing and hearing what others have accomplished, but its a real downer when you come here and see negativity all the time and in some ways discouraged not to ask.. I know I know.. "SEARCH" but as Ive said sometimes maybe the person asking is looking for something jsut a bit off of what was posted a year ago, or maybe couldnt find it. I know some of you will jsut tell me to shut up or move on, but DVXUSER is a great place to learn and share forum, not just a static info site.. lets all interact..and see everyone as filmmakers... whether is be a newb or seasoned, we are all here to discuss the the same thing right?...

Terry
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n1co2, I thought about this long and hard before answering you.

This is something I have been thinking about quite a bit now. DVXUser, in my opinion, does not have clique's per se. But we seem to have a disconnect between those who do what they do for a living day in and day out, and those that are not in that position. I don't like that. But lets equate the scenario to any field YOU are experienced in and everyone else is asking questions you think are "simple" and should already be "known" and asked quite a lot. How have you answered them? Granted, using the "search" function would answer many a question, but some people want a direct interaction, and that is the purpose of a forum.

To me DVXUser is a melting pot of everyone that comes to the site with every level of experience in the field they are interested in.

That does not excuse any sense of elitism, but you have to understand that in any society, strata tend to develop. And occasionally there is a sense of classism. But dont let that get you down. There are many seasoned members that understand everyone starts somewhere. When those with high levels of experience give an opinion, it's not meant as an insult, rather a quick way to impart the cumulation of that experience. Occasionally it does come off as snobbishness, though usually that is accounted for in the lack of expression/emotion in simple text. To a lot of pro's time is money, and the quicker we can help impart knowledge, the better. And another aspect to this is the thickness of your skin. Those that work regularly in the industry develop a rhino-like skin. We tend to forget that those outside that level of work have not had to develop a threshold for criticism given in a manner many would consider demeaning. For us, that way of communicating has become everyday talk when we deal with those in the same field. It's not personal, but comes from the fact on a film set, you either perform or you are gone. Making friends on set reminds me of the stories about war: "You never make close buddies on the battlefield, because tomorrow they may die." You get the idea.

But for working pro's, harsh criticism and talk is a fact of life. You either listen to it and take what you need to from it, or you are unemployed. Thick skin comes fast. Again, it's not an excuse, but just an explanation.

Don't let any perceived insult get you down. It could be just a miscommunication. Reach out to that member and ask further.

Look, I cannot and will not speak for everyone here, but I do try to impart what I have learned, with a touch of humor, as that is my teaching style. But I also learn a lot from even those considered "new" because they may have experienced something I haven't.
 
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Getting clicky...... (it's clique btw)...... :huh:

Getting???? :lipsrseal

You are new aren't you... :shocked:

preston_lacy5.jpg
 
Doc Bernard, I agree completly... with every group either society or internet has its differances and opinions.. I for one have never been insulted. If I post something I feel that I put it "out there" so i have to take good or bad critisism... I dont ahve an issue with that.. but like I said I have read this forum for a long time and have noticed a change ..like I said I love to see and watch, hear what others are doing.. and most of the time they are polite "as can be" i know this is a area that I feel gets a little too elite at times.. I for one dont have alot of money but.... if I feel the need for something then i do whatever I can to try and get what is needed.. I dont pretend to be any better at what I am trying to do than I am.. but when me or someone asks a specific question for ex someone posts.. dont have much money,, want to get the best sound that I can "afford"....I will see posts in the area of if you dont have such and such .. pretty much give up.. .. i have got alot of good reception here on the boards so im not talking about me in general.. just what I see sometimes.. not always.. I dont have any doubt that alot come here for help, bragging rights, ect,, but all in all we are all an amateur compared to the next guy above us.. so when we answer someone, try and remember that the guy you are answering is looking up to you for advice, help, critisism, whatever it might be.. Hollywood I know isnt an easy or always polite game, but we are all in the same game here on DVXUSER...
 
I get you. Like I said, there are those here that understand completely where you are coming from, despite the level we are at now. Keep the faith, friend. It's not all rattlesnakes and broken glass. Some of us are willing to assist and understand the budgetary restrictions some may have.
 
Piggy-backing on what Doc said, thick skin is definitely a major factor.

On one of my very first shoots, I met a professional grip who sounded like he was raised by sailors in prison. But part of that was from working on TV shows and commercials every day, where everything has to move fast and move right. He was gruff, but that's just how a lot of people who do this professionally are.

I grew accustomed to it over time, but now I have to be very careful because the etiquette expected at my day job is far different from the norm of a film set. I create videos for an airline, which means shooting a lot of talking heads on the green screen, except the talking head could be a Vice President of the company. I've spouted off things - that would otherwise be perfectly acceptable on a film set - that have come very close to getting me in trouble because I sounded rude or even insulting, when it was just a matter of moving things quickly.

On a forum like DVXUser, you remove the context, body language, and inflection, and text starts to sound really gruff, too. Even a simple smiley can "sound" sarcastic.

Like Doc said, if you feel someone intentionally insulted you, talk to them. I've done it here, and it works.
 
n1c02 said:
but when me or someone asks a specific question for ex someone posts.. dont have much money,, want to get the best sound that I can "afford"....I will see posts in the area of if you dont have such and such .. pretty much give up..
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For all of those posts that have merit, there are plenty of repetitive ones like, "I need a fast zoom lens for under $200," or "What's the best lens for a music video?"

I think those muddy the waters and may sour some people's willingness to reply helpfully at any rate.
 
Jordan Scott Price said:
For all of those posts that have merit, there are plenty of repetitive ones like, "I need a fast zoom lens for under $200," or "What's the best lens for a music video?"

I think those muddy the waters and may sour some people's willingness to reply helpfully at any rate.
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+1

This also contributes to the difficulty in using the search, as results get cluttered by conversations that are spread out over 50 posts.

I'm not sure that the disconnect is as big as it's made out to be. It's certainly there in places, but there's plenty of advice for folks on a budget. There's also some honest feedback on a minimum level of expectation depending on the need (take cheap wireless mic systems, for example). And as has been mentioned, plain text does not transmit emotion at all... it's easy for any of this to sound harsh. Emoticons, I believe, often do more harm than good in that respect.
 
I didnt want ot get anything started jsut the fact that I see harsher, more rude, comments and posts now than I used to.. maybe people getting tired of the "newb" scene and all the new ones coming asking.....and I understand that.. but i feel that if this were out in the real world say on a set... the new guys huddle together(wanting to learn waht those other guys are doing) and then the knowledged guys( most cringing that the new guys dont come over and start asking them questions... )....... jsut my take.. nothing personal... but i read what I read... not saying it will change , the bigger the guy gets and his knowledge base grows so does his ego ... so.....i just hate seeing it here...
 
Use a spell checker for god sake if you want to be taken even slightly seriously, and learn punctuation.

The basics don't even rate anymore, but everyone wants to be "important".

Sorry n1c02, but filmmaking is an industry, if you can't form sentences correctly (you may scoff) how are you going to write a proposal or a budget?
 
Pookie said:
Use a spell checker for god sake if you want to be taken even slightly seriously, and learn punctuation.

The basics don't even rate anymore, but everyone wants to be "important".

Sorry n1c02, but filmmaking is an industry, if you can't form sentences correctly (you may scoff) how are you going to write a proposal or a budget?
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As much as I am a grammarian, wordsmith, and nitpicker, and I carefully re-read and edit repeatedly my replies...

...this is an internet forum.
 
Doc Bernard said:
Take a leadership role and be the impetus for change. be the change you envision.
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One of the best ways to help keep this place on track... when you see some one attacking another member, abusing a newbie, or otherwise dropping the proverbial turd into the punch bowl... report it to the mods.
 
Jordan Scott Price said:
As much as I am a grammarian, wordsmith, and nitpicker, and I carefully re-read and edit repeatedly my replies...

...this is an internet forum.
Click to expand...

I agree wholeheartedly, but if the basics cannot be accomplished, no matter where, how many [other] shortcuts are, and will be taken?

Our friend wants only encouraging, meaningful comments made to questions posted, but meaningful to who?

Every answer teaches you something, even if you don't like it... at least that's the way I was taught...

If you can't handle and learn from mistakes and criticism, I guess the only career left is politics.... :beer:
 
Alex H. said:
One of the best ways to help keep this place on track... when you see some one attacking another member, abusing a newbie, or otherwise dropping the proverbial turd into the punch bowl... report it to the mods.
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When in doubt.... squeal. Not the most forward thinking advice there Alex.
 
Pookie said:
When in doubt.... squeal. Not the most forward thinking advice there Alex.
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More like Neighborhood Crime Watch...

Squealing implies a rat or a NARC - that the squealer was in on it. Alex was talking about someone being witness to abuse, which is not the same at all.
 
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