C100: I need a New Look for 2017. What's your fave interview lens besides the 70-200?

[markfpv]

When I'm wearing my ascot & beret on set, I always prefer to be called "your excellence". :grin:

 

[puredrifting]

I feel slightly better because I just got booked for next Thursday to film the cast of Hamilton including BTS. But one day a week is not survivable!

So that long post I wrote that got deleted...one main thing, it relates to DBP's age group trying to break in, and there is a great differentiation between those living on their own, in a childless couple or a union with children. Assuming that one is not from wealth or married into it, here's the trajectory I have seen many dozens of times, experienced it myself, and paints one into a corner of having to run faster on the Hamster Wheel of Generating Cash. It always happens in one's late twenties/early thirties. Eric wrote:

as long as one makes enough to live a satisfactory lifestyle financially, while enjoying their job,

The whole deal is, what is satisfactory when you are in your twenties/early thirties, is not going to be enough for when you get older and if you enter a profession where there's no revenue growth, you're screwed IF you get married and have kids. As a DP you then can't buy more and more gear. See below:

• DP minding his business and enjoying life. Not too concerned about The Benjamins. Does low budget indies, freebies, his art. Supplements DP jobs with other work in the Gig Economy. Doesn't stress about his revenue, the future...
• Poof! Meets someone and falls in love!
• Her friends are all getting married. Hmmmm....
• DP now must save and buy ring, instead of gear. Rings are very expensive, more than many lenses!
• DP must now help pay for wedding instead of buying gear.
• DP now part of a couple so must move into larger, nicer place, pay more for housing instead of buying more gear.
• Wife sees all her friends having babies, feels clock ticking.
• Nine months later DP is a daddy. Profits go to Kid #1 rather than buying more gear.
• Decision is made to move to safer place with nice yard, nice schools, DP needs more money. Gear is now on-hold, on a Wish List.
• Wife keeps an eagle eye on DP's gear buying habits. Watches for UPS delivering B&H boxes. Checks recycling bin for folded up B&H boxes. Looks in DP's van for hidden, folded up B&H boxes. Checks DP's credit card statements for known drug, I mean gear, dealers.
• DP learns few wives want just one kid, nine months later Kid #2 arrives. DP begs to stop at two, knowing he needs to buy more gear.
• Decision is made that day care is too expensive for two kids, so wife will stay home, means one less paycheck. Money pressure mounts. DP starts to think maybe he should have picked a "sensible" major?
• Everyone in baby group starts talking about college fund savings. Money for DP's Wish List now goes into college savings fund. Also, that nasty acronym IRA also raises its ugly head, gear money starts to go into that fund.
• DP, who had followed his dream, realizes freelance video DP work is not a steady, profitable income stream for the lifestyle he is now in, compared to the single, childless lifestyle of his late twenties, early thirties. DP realizes at this point why so many other DPs are from wealthy families or married one. Who else could afford this, let alone keep buying more gear?

And that's my story too! But I was really lucky in terms of timing and I was a DP in a twenty-five year window when we worked all the time for top dollar. Just luck, although the official (Google it) definition of Luck is: Preparation Meets Opportunity. Yes, the growth of video production looks like a hockey stick on a chart, but the rates are lower, you now need to keep buying new cameras and the competition is intense, all in favor of a buyer's market. When we would buy the "best" camera, it's popularity could last five years, no competitors, the clients only asked for that model, so it came with a crank to print money! I do see that if one specializes in post, rather than shooting, your body will last longer and it isn't capital intensive. To edit, every few years you need a new computer, buy some software. So if an older DP transitions to editing, that can work. But me...I can not stay in front of a computer all day. I'm too "high energy" as they say. Outdoorish sort of fella.

As to buying more gear, unless it's really needed, gear is not an investment, although we can talk ourselves into thinking it as such. It's an expense, albeit a necessary one. An investment would be to hire an experienced sales person, someone with a track record in production, someone who could do your Constant Contact outreach, attend networking meetings, turn over rocks, in other words: Get New Business. Now that's an investment. Thinking that having a shiny new doodad that clients will salivate over and thus hire you, is a pipe dream.

I love what I do/did, I had an incredible run, the envy of all, although I always played that down as much as possible, especially among friends, neighbors and family, I know people get jealous. People with "regular" jobs don't want to hear about our exotic travels, celebrity shmoozing, etc. But I just don't see how someone in 2017 can start a freelance DP biz and make it through the above phases of life unless they are rich kids, and I do see a LOT of that. Perhaps if there are no children and the wife has a good salary, but kids will zap your cash, your gear money. I lucked out. The internet ruined an awful lot, damn them! We DPs also made a ton selling digital beta stock footage, buy and sell used gear, dub orders!, etc. Lot's of ways to make extra dough. Not now, although I feel if you can latch onto TV clients who have this regular, conveyor belt need for programming, that can be the ticket. I see that in Chicago with peers doing ESPN, Dateline, prime time news feature shows, etc. But it is difficult to grow old in those, the late forties and your body starts saying "Where's the Aleve?"

I suck at math but I am expert at Cameraman Math and I don't see how people can buy all this gear, not being able to upcharge the cheap clients we get nowadays, and stay in business. Beyond me...

That's my nickel's worth!

Mr. Miller

You win the Internet with this one Ned, this is the best truth bomb I have ever seen about how being a working DP typically happens. You have so much wisdom to share, you should go for that business of being a DP website.

 

[indiawilds]

I just say videographer. I know that term is scorned, but it is precise. I find it interesting that videographers dislike the term "videographer", but photographers still use "photographer".

In my childhood days the term "videographer" meant an unkempt, poorly educated fellow in half torn shirts holding a panasonic camera on shoulder and shooting marriage videos. That is probably one of the reasons I hate placing a camera on my shoulder, though the main reason is I have seen people ruining their backs holding heavy cameras. One DP said that he shot for two years with an alexa always on shoulder and he needed surgery. Well that is besides the point discussed here.

The word videographer also meant the people creating shitty stuff with their handicams. To me videographer meant a generally unskilled fellow and I know many other people feel like that. So the reluctance for many people to be branded as videographers. Some feel that if you are branded as a videographer then you won't get high end jobs.

Someone was talking about money. Just now one known fellow told me that a friend who was a really dumb student and is now running a restaurant officially makes 3 million usd per year. In India, that is a high amount. For example a new Partner (profit sharing) in a big 4 consulting firm in India makes about 0.25 million usd per year. Money, status in society and satisfaction are entirely different things. There are a few guys who are passionate about their work and they make good bucks. I feel if a person is passionate and has perseverance and sticks to his passion for a long time, then he/she will indeed be successful.

All of us have different life paths, though we may be "videographers". Each of us have to decide which path to take. Some of you may find this short article about competition and success to be of interest http://www.indiawilds.com/diary/learnings-from-wild-india-competition-success/

 

[Jim Feeley]

I just say videographer. I know that term is scorned, but it is precise. I find it interesting that videographers dislike the term "videographer", but photographers still use "photographer".

A VFX guy I'm acquainted listed his title on his cards and sig lines as "Visual Awesomeologist."
So great!

 

[JPNola]

A VFX guy I'm acquainted listed his title on his cards and sig lines as "Visual Awesomeologist."
So great!

Love that!

I have a client who simply refers to me as "Photographer" and I kinda like that. Video IS photography after all. Why should the Still Phtogs have a monopoly on "Photographer"? Particularly when most of the live on AF & AE and couldn't light their way out of a cave.

 

[Run&Gun]

I just say videographer. I know that term is scorned, but it is precise. I find it interesting that videographers dislike the term "videographer", but photographers still use "photographer".

That term is like nails on a chalkboard to me. Always has been. Photographer, Cameraman, Shooter, Camera Monkey, Asshole, Hey You... All are better than the "v" word.

I had a producer introduce me as videographer today to one of our interviewees and I almost said something, but it was the first time we had worked with her and I didn't want to come across as an a******. But I think I did have a physical reaction when she said it.

I do sorta like the UK "Lighting Cameraman" term, because it is probably the most accurate for what most of us actually do. I'd say most of us aren't what I'd consider true DP's, but clients seem to like calling us that and a LOT of shooters LOVE to call themselves that.

 

[DBP]

I do sorta like the UK "Lighting Cameraman" term, because it is probably the most accurate for what most of us actually do. I'd say most of us aren't what I'd consider true DP's, but clients seem to like calling us that and a LOT of shooters LOVE to call themselves that.

I would definitely cringe if someone ever introduced me as a DP, because setting up corporate lighting does not qualify someone to use that term.

Hell, some people call wedding video folks "wedding cinematographers"

I mean, get the f**k outta here... and I say this is a wedding video guy!

A proper DP does so much beyond turn a camera and a few lights on. It's insulting to the profession.

 

[Eric Coughlin]

Eric, when the Easy Rig was introduced, if you can find the original ads, it was as a "Back Saver". So to this day, when I see one, I think to myself: "He must have a bad back."

"Back Saver" doesn't imply just for bad backs, but also to prevent back problems from occurring to a currently good back. The logic of "He must have a bad back." is like seeing a person wearing a seat belt and thinking, "They must have weak bones." Sure, Superman doesn't need a seat belt, but everyone else does.

I suppose you could argue that some people's backs are so strong that they can withstand 40 years of holding 50 lb camera setups without ever having issues, but I guess the question would be, how would they know their back would never have issues, and why risk it?

And just because it had a tagline in its marketing doesn't mean that's all it is good for. The tagline is still on their site. Also on their site, "The Easyrig gives you the speed and mobility of a handheld camera, while still achieving steady shots from the shoulder, the hip or even at knee level. ...The Easyrig is ideal for news broadcasts, sport events, documentaries, commercials or many other handheld situations where stability is crucial and where the freedom to move is essential."

Another thought...With a heavy shoulder mounted camera, between takes the camera is typically given to the AC, put on a tripod, or on the ground. When the director is ready for another take, says "cameras up," the cameraman sometimes delays the action by 10-20 seconds while they retrieve the camera. With an Easy Rig, the weight is so well distributed that it is common to leave it in place between takes as you only need a break every hour or two instead of every few minutes, so instead of the director waiting on camera, camera is already set. It does take time to take the rig on and off, but I would say the last time I used it, always being ready to go seemed to speed things up over other shoots where I was always shoulder mounted.

I gather you've never used an Easy Rig since you didn't answer saying you had.

That is probably one of the reasons I hate placing a camera on my shoulder, though the main reason is I have seen people ruining their backs holding heavy cameras. One DP said that he shot for two years with an alexa always on shoulder and he needed surgery.

Too bad he didn't use an Easy Rig to avoid surgery.

 

[slidemaster]

Wow this thread really evolved. I had not looked at it for a few days and the subject content went from things to life. Very cool.

 

[Run&Gun]

...
Another thought...With a heavy shoulder mounted camera, between takes the camera is typically given to the AC, put on a tripod, or on the ground. When the director is ready for another take, says "cameras up," the cameraman sometimes delays the action by 10-20 seconds while they retrieve the camera. With an Easy Rig, the weight is so well distributed that it is common to leave it in place between takes as you only need a break every hour or two instead of every few minutes, so instead of the director waiting on camera, camera is already set...

Doesn't matter. Everyone knows you always have to wait on Audio, anyway.

 

[cpreston]

A proper DP does so much beyond turn a camera and a few lights on. It's insulting to the profession.

Actually, from my understanding, a proper DP does neither of those things. Hell, I've met DP's who wouldn't know the first thing to do if you showed them a video camera. That's why I shy away from the term.

Regarding the Easy Rig, if you want something cheaper and better designed that will actually cause most clients to be impressed, I suggest checking out the Ready Rig and Cinemilled Proring designs. I love mine

 

[JPNola]

"Back Saver" doesn't imply just for bad backs, but also to prevent back problems from occurring to a currently good back. The logic of "He must have a bad back." is like seeing a person wearing a seat belt and thinking, "They must have weak bones." Sure, Superman doesn't need a seat belt, but everyone else does.

I suppose you could argue that some people's backs are so strong that they can withstand 40 years of holding 50 lb camera setups without ever having issues, but I guess the question would be, how would they know their back would never have issues, and why risk it?

And just because it had a tagline in its marketing doesn't mean that's all it is good for. The tagline is still on their site. Also on their site, "The Easyrig gives you the speed and mobility of a handheld camera, while still achieving steady shots from the shoulder, the hip or even at knee level. ...The Easyrig is ideal for news broadcasts, sport events, documentaries, commercials or many other handheld situations where stability is crucial and where the freedom to move is essential."

Another thought...With a heavy shoulder mounted camera, between takes the camera is typically given to the AC, put on a tripod, or on the ground. When the director is ready for another take, says "cameras up," the cameraman sometimes delays the action by 10-20 seconds while they retrieve the camera. With an Easy Rig, the weight is so well distributed that it is common to leave it in place between takes as you only need a break every hour or two instead of every few minutes, so instead of the director waiting on camera, camera is already set. It does take time to take the rig on and off, but I would say the last time I used it, always being ready to go seemed to speed things up over other shoots where I was always shoulder mounted.

I gather you've never used an Easy Rig since you didn't answer saying you had.



Too bad he didn't use an Easy Rig to avoid surgery.

The EasyRig seems to be a polarizing thing- either much love or no love at all. Many shooters find the EasyRig restrictive and that was my experience as well. Maybe there is a learning curve that I never got past. Inevitably the users of an EasyRig take it off during breaks in shooting and when it is time to saddle back up to shoot the guys using the EasyRig take longer to be ready than do the guys not using the EasyRig. I was on a reality tv production where one guy was using the EasyRig and often the Director was having to wait for the EasyRig user to suit up. To the point that it became a running joke and he was teased about having to don his "contraption". There were also times where the EasyRig guy kept the rig on but unhooked the camera during a brief break in shooting, and it would take him longer to re-attach the camera than it would take the rest of us to pick up our cameras and shoulder them. Another negative ( man, I'm really beating the ole' EasyRig up, aren't I? ) is that it is hot to wear and becomes soaked in sweat. I once went to use one that another Cam Op had just taken off and offered for me to use and it was gross. Soaked in sweat and stanky. Regardless to say I took a pass on using it.

In defense of the EasyRig- that same guy who was mildly teased about wearing the rig didn't seem to be as tired as the rest of us late in the day. I recall one point in that shoot where I was having to shoot in a contorted position to clear the lens of another camera next to me, my upper body having to lean out to the right over a bar top. The scene kept going on forever- like, 20 minutes with my having to hold a tight frame on the longer end of the lens, my upper body was nearly in muscle spasm, I had to use every bit of my willpower and pain endurance to continue to hold my shot, and I was wishing I had worn the damn EasyRig thingy that I had been offered but declined.

I know you all have been in that situation where you end up in a painful position and you start hating the subjects because they don't stop talking.

On air host: "Well, that about wraps it up and- oh, wait, I have one more question I wanted to ask you."

voice in my head: "oh, you SON of a B!TCH! I hate you with all my soul right now."

 

[alaskacameradude]

I know you all have been in that situation where you end up in a painful position and you start hating the subjects because they don't stop talking.

On air host: "Well, that about wraps it up and- oh, wait, I have one more question I wanted to ask you."

voice in my head: "oh, you SON of a B!TCH! I hate you with all my soul right now."

And it's NEVER really 'one' more question is it? It's like 5 more......with 2 or 3 follow up questions
to each of the 5. Basically they should just tell you 'We only have another half an hour to go here....'

 

[JPNola]

Hell, I've met DP's who wouldn't know the first thing to do if you showed them a video camera.

That^^

Many "Hollywood" DP's came up through the ranks as a Gaffer. They've handled lights more than camera. Some are guys who came up in film and moved from Operator to DP before Digital came around. They haven't lifted more than a light meter or a Director's Finder in decades. Building a camera with all its accessories mounted and navigating the camera menu- that isn't something feature film DPs do or even much know how to do. Operators generally know it despite never having to do it, but not always the DPs.

My rule is that you are only the "DP" if there are Craft Services on set. No Crafty, you're just a Cameraman.

 

[gclark]

nedcam:

You're absolutely right about B2B. I have also found quite a bit of work with universities and schools looking to add online course content. The nice aspect of educational videos is that you tend to do a number of videos rather than one small job. I only try do to B2C if I get to do something funny or if there's creative leeway, otherwise I find myself competing with shooters who will crank out a video for $350 and business owners that don't understand that a minute of edited video does not mean only ten minutes of shooting.

My apprehension with the EasyRig and most new toys is that it's just one more piece of gear to haul. Most of my budgets don't call for larger rigs, but when I have used something like the Alexa, which is a dream when it comes to imagery, the size and weight slows everything down regardless of the support and crew size. I'm with nedcam when it comes to wanting to carry less and less gear. LED lighting has me excited in that there's a promise to make my kit smaller and weigh less, but I've been burned by flickering and to my eye tungsten and KinoFlos still look better. That being said, I'll probably add a few Flex lights or a DedoLight LED soon.

 

[Bern Caughey]

Whenever we're going handheld with Arri(s) I have the AC rent EasyRig(s). Rarely use them, but when we do they're a back saver.

 

[Paul F]

... I want a Tips & Tricks of the Trade forum, so us older farts could do a knowledge dump on the noobs, such as *Never leave a hotel room without taking the shower cap. ..

Here you go. A Tips & Tricks of the Trade Forum set up just for you. Now the link is a bit weird as I am using my wife's server and I did not want to spend money on an URL for something that might not be found to be useful. But I'm willing to set up this site and moderate it if there is interest. I always wanted a local forum to exchange local information. So I have a San Francisco Bay Area forum as a starter for those in the Bay Area that want to exchange local information. If that is something other regions are interested in, let me know and I will add a forum. http://tabbycatmusicarchives.com/FilmMakersForum/index.php


Ned - Needing a New Look - this comes with old age. I'm 63. One thing I've noticed is that you reach a certain age and suddenly you realize you've been there, done that..... many times. You've had every experience, you've seen everything, including looking through the viewfinder and it's the same thing you've seen for decades. It's not just the viewfinder, but most everything in your life is like an old leather chair. You know every crease. So now where do you find that new look? I've been pondering that.

Being Retired - I retired recently. Stepping off from a high paying job with excellent benefits to being totally on your own was a leap of faith. Would my wife and I be able live a satisfying life on less money or would we hate it? Would we run out of money? Would we have to sell our house, move to cheap-town, cheap-state and hate life living on rice and beans? The answer so far is a resounding no. We are living on less than 1/3 of what I made and somehow we are loving it. I'm amazed at how little money it takes to have a satisfactory life. Ok, the qualifiers are that we have a little piece of paradise and no debt. That helps tremendously. And as you suspect, you very much need to stay active.

 

[nedcam]

I try not to visit my favorite sites list unless a couple of days have passed, otherwise wow, it’s a Time Suck. I have too many sites for hobbies, medical conditions, news, Our Biz, investments, etc. So here goes, excuse the typos.

Hi Paul, Yes! Great idea as to the forum, I don’t think I’d have the time or energy to make a Cameraman’s Business Forum, with Tricks of the Trade, Newbies Corner, Retirement, etc. I would have to farm out the IT and coding which would cost me money. I do think the subject matter should be specialized in non-tech topics, there’s plenty of sites for the tech dweebs but in order to survive in the biz you need to develop other skills, such as managing client expectations, finding new clients, hard ball collecting, etc. Plenty of sites already exist for the pixel peepers. What’s missing on the inter web is a place for us video pros who are getting older to compare notes as to: •How can we still make revenue? •How to stop buying doodads and make one’s investments grow? •How do we prepare to fully retire since we were in a project business with nothing to sell? Etc. Perhaps if someone here knows someone high up at Creative Cow we can have a forum called DP Korner, for non-tech topics meaningful to (mainly) shooters.

And due to losing some steady clients over the last two years, I am practicing adjusting to my post-retirement revenue stream, which one is suppose to do anyway a couple of years before retiring. We are starting to ask at restaurants for the “house Chardonnay”. Paul, can I get your real email address? I was hoping to do a “little” work in retirement, mainly deps, to keep my mind sharp and as a Plan B in case we needed more money than predicted, but I’m now shocked to learn that if a DP starts to collect SS before “full retirement age”, and for my birth year that’s 66 years old and for most reading this it will be 67-69, for every two dollars I annually make over $17K I have to give $1 back to SS! Who knew? Eeeesh…That’s like working for half price, right? My Plan A is to do freebie charity work for really small non-profits and an occasional dep for money because they are physically easy.

Hey Eric: I have never used an Easy Rig, saw one in action from afar and my reaction was, “He must have a bad back”, it did not occur to me that they could be used for a creative purpose, only relief, since the height of the camera looks somewhat fixed. But now that I think about it, I have seen them in production stills of reality shows. I have done the Chicago scenes for reality shows plus a lot of sizzle reel trailers to get them off the ground, and an Easy Rig would have been handy, since the shooting is hand held all day. I did not like doing reality shows because once they were green lit the production companies would buy several models of a camera (The Sony EX3 became the favorite because it was lightweight and cheap), and they only wanted to hire me for labor, which is not enough money for a married man with kids, as discussed above. I suppose you can’t blame the prod cos, owning the cameras saves them money, plus they know all the cameras will match.

I used to shoot a lot of charity celebrity golf outings for broadcast, mainly Sox, Cubs, Blackhawks, Bulls stars golfing with our local Titans of Industries and other super rich. Since I was the most seasoned shooter I did the 18th hole, where all the camaraderie and great moments would occur because they were usually drunk by then and the host would be there. These shoots would be hand holding in the hot sun, running around, for a solid non-stop 5 or 6 hours and I now see that an Easy Rig would have been perfect for that type of shoot. But the docs I now mainly do, the clients do not want me to look too interesting, especially if we don’t have permits. I’m often tossed into the passenger seat of a car that’s about to take off, so I like to be nimble and wearing an Easy Rig wouldn't be smart. I often don’t know what will happen next, so being strapped into “a contraption”, most of my shoots won’t lend themselves to it. I do recommend to all getting into yoga as early as possible, keeping the gut off, and doing core strengthening, or else a DP needs to transfer to producing and/or editing all too soon. Seen that a million times. I’m an outlier to have lasted this long and I just eat the knee pain. Also, I have Aleve bottles everywhere and there’s one Vicodin in my First Aid Kit so I can at least complete the shoot day if something bad happened. And it has.

I believe one’s ability to last hand held all day is dependent on one’s posture and weight distribution. I was taught, and have always followed, that when you’re not rolling, but have to have your heavy camera on your shoulder because you may need to roll at any second, common in documentaries, you should always stand at an At Ease posture with your weight evenly distributed on both legs, which is tricky to learn with a heavy thing on just the right shoulder, but a very important habit to develop. None of my shoots have an AC anymore, the best I can hope for is a strong PA or an Intelligent Grip will grab it. Today’s cameras have so many external switches and buttons, if I pass my camera to somebody I am really paranoid that they will accidentally flip something, like my A/B White Balance, Gain, etc., so I try not to pass my rig, I’d rather put it down myself. This is a habit due to many bad experiences. I often will climb a ladder and whomever is passing it up, I watch their hands to make sure they were away from the controls.

As an aside, the golf outings above, I developed a severe distaste with working with celebs, especially the sports figures and double especially the entertainment and music industry variety, because they always treated us shooters with a disdain or “Get out of my face” or putting up with me attitude, like in press junkets, although people on their “way up” are nicer and less jaded than the ones who have been famous awhile. When Michael Jordan was in his ascendancy us crew would always bring one basketball and a Sharpie to get an autograph for our kid, but as the years went on we were told to “mind our place”. Even if the celebs are OK, their entourages, agency people and spouses made me feel like I’m a pest that must be put up with. That’s my take. No way I could fake it in H’wood and I give credit to my LA peers. Hopefully the Hamilton cast will be cool on this Thursday. Doing those golf outings also gave me a disdain for really large charities and to this day I only write checks to micro Mom & Pop charities where I can locally see the results. Too much waste with the big charities.

Hello DBP: Many women, when you first meet them, say they don’t want kids, but end up changing their minds after the tenth baby shower they attend. Seen that a lot.

The term Lighting Cameraman: I had always thought of myself as such, rather than a techy DP, because to me the lighting came first, but the true definition is not what I originally had thought. One of my first grip jobs, as a union fill in, was Brooke Shields first film, Pretty Baby around 1977 or so, was a foreign crew, and what we would call the Lighting Designer, or Head Gaffer, among the Brits is called a Lighting Cameraman. Go figure. I was assigned to the Lighting Cameraman and wanting to be an AC when I grew up, I was ecstatic until I realized I was assigned to the grip truck crew, which as we all know is blue collar drudgery. The one valuable take away for me was what the Lighting Cameraman told me on a break, out of frustration. He said, in his Downton Abbey aristocratic accent, “The difference between an American DP and a British DP is: The British DP will call for the exact, correct lighting instrument for the task at hand, but an American DP will call for a much more powerful instrument and then we have to scrim and flag the Hell out of it way down, thus costing us time.” I never forgot that. ASA, or what we now call ISO, was much, much lower then, so one did have to use more light than now, especially for night exteriors, but you will always see the difference between U.S. and Brit features in those 70s-80s era. I just sold 200 old American Cinematographers on CL to the DP of Chicago Fire, so for several days ahead of the sale I flipped through each one and wow, the fixtures were giant but just as the English Lighting Cameraman said, there was a incredible forrest of nets, flags, cutters, diffusion in front of them.

Guy Clark: Yes I prefer B2B clients because the B2C ones are now so much into social media videos, meaning cheap, short and quick, they usually have developed a way to do them in-house, often by their bloggers and young tech slaves. There is also a rise in the UGC Style (User Generated Content) so they eschew the polished, professional look that we bring, another decline in our revenue potential. They’d prefer the videos look organic to their customer base. And they like to save money by not hiring us anymore.

Well…I don’t know how this thread got so out of hand! This is evidence that there are topic areas that the other forums on DVX doesn’t handle. Too bad the Sony FS5&7 forum guys couldn't partake in this thread, Sony is now where the real action is, right? I do like Creative Cow’s Business & Marketing forum, although it is NOT DP centric. But hey, is there such a thing as a “DP only” career now? I don’t think it’s financially feasible to be "just a DP" outside LA & NYC. Or must we all become Jack-of-All-Trades? That’s what it now seems, but I was trained that you always want to create in the mind of the prospect that you specialize in the one skill they want, so if I need a shooter for B Camera I don’t care to find out that they can easily compete against me as a producer, I have had even close buddies stab me in the back, so you can imagine how I don’t trust strangers. To this day I have three business cards in my wallet: •Director/Cameraman of Corporate, Non-Fiction TV and Documentaries, •Producer of Corporate Videos and •Producer/Videographer of Litigation Support Videos. So I can pivot! I want to be what they are looking for.

Which leads me to my last thing on the list and a piece of marketing advice to the newbs, what to call ourselves, which has been addressed in another thread before. You need to present a different front to different prospects. For example, my wife and I always bought our houses in areas we barely could afford, following the real estate tenet of, “Own the cheapest house on your block to realize the greatest rise in value.” That meant being surrounded by wealthy, highly paid execs in the northern suburbs of Chicago, home of many Fortune 100 companies, especially pharma. When asked by “these types”, who have the country club vibe, I respond that I am a “Producer of corporate videos, specializing in marketing and sales”, I may launch into an elevator speech if the situation lends itself. Sure, I could say something more exotic, but if I see them as a potential client, not necessarily them personally, but as a conduit to “Would you please tell me who at your organization may need to contract out for professional video?”, usually over a drink or BBQ. So…saying you’re a DP, which has a well known, negative porno connotation, would be to shoot yourself in the foot, right? Or go on and on about your exotic gigs in far away lands. I use the term DP here with you all but almost never anywhere else. It’s shorthand. Too high falootting for what I do.

As to the title Videographer, seeing how I am so close to cashing in my chips I will now spill the beans: I’m 99% sure I was the first non-wedding guy in Chicago to take on that moniker and it was then considered a pejorative, I could tell by all the ribbing I took from my fellow shooters, who all tended to call themselves Cinematographers, DPs, Cameramen or Camera Operator. Only wedding shooters used that word and they were, before the DSLR revolution, looked down upon by all the other shooters. But I was the first guy in Chicago to have a website, and when the search engines were invented I would always ask the prospect how they found me, what specific words they put in, and invariably they would always say: Chicago Videographer. That’s when and why I started to re-brand myself as a Chicago Videographer and would never tell the other Chicago shooters in the biz why. My secret. They could call themselves Cinematographers, although I feel that should be reserved for the tip top guys doing features like La La Land. But my marketing secret was to always present my brand to be what they were looking for, right? After all, I’m Zelig, I’m a chameleon. I need to survive, so what you want me to be, I will be! But in sum, for the most part, if I am not communicating with a working class Joe or a cubicle slave, I say, “I’m a cameraman on TV shows”, if I want to impress. Everyone knows what a cameraman is. I even have the Buster Keaton poster in my office, see below.

Lastly, since my fingers now are numb, my latest goal is to get to the Keys as soon as money comes in and get another ten hours of diving in my log so I can check off another of my bucket list dreams: Feed the fish in front of the crowd in the big 90,000 gallon tank at the Shedd Aquarium! Fascinated by that since I was a toddler on my dad’s shoulders. Finally, trying to ease into life without shooting....Is there life after shooting? I'll let you know.

I still haven’t used the 85mm I bought for getting a new look. Soon I hope.

Later,

Ned

P.S. I forgot to mention, when we were discussing pissing away money on gear to feel better. I had several offices over the years, maybe 12-15 years, from $800-$1200 a month, although one I traded two shoot days a month for rent. I now wish I had put all that money into Vanguard Total Stock Market Index!

 

[gkantziper]

I remember early my career when 16mm was still shot regularly in the circles I worked in and hearing the slang term "vidiot" to describe the "lowly videographer". Well we videographers got the last laugh because all the film guys had to learn how to shoot video! Even the still photographers had to adapt to shooting "still" video frames.

 

[Paul F]

Hi Paul, Yes! Great idea as to the forum, I don’t think I’d have the time or energy to make a Cameraman’s Business Forum, with Tricks of the Trade, Newbies Corner, Retirement, etc. I would have to farm out the IT and coding which would cost me money.

There's no need to do anything Ned. I have all of those forums now set up at this link. http://tabbycatmusicarchives.com/FilmMakersForum/index.php?sid=5cda31b04a0d7b0a0696c48ecd11f49e. I can set up and manage the forum and re-arrange, add, delete forums as we like. Feel free to get it started with some posts.

We can get started by discussing retirement in the retirement forum. 7 years ago I was afraid of losing my job, having no medical benefits, no job opportunities. I was in a panic. I've been through many of the hurdles, questions and fears. I'll go post something in the retirement forum about it.

Private Message sent.