Its been mentioned several times that your "friends who went into x field are now rich as sheeyit, I wish I'd done that instead". But really, DO YOU? Really put yourself there mentally...40+ hours a week of (likely sitting in an office or various conference rooms) doing something you have zero passion for. What's the point of all that money if you have no time to enjoy it and hate every single second you're working?
C100: I need a New Look for 2017. What's your fave interview lens besides the 70-200?
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puredrifting
Major Contributor
Josh:
I did it a few years ago. I was head hunted by an instructional design company and from 2010 to 2013, I took a break from production and worked a corporate gig. There were several reasons I took it. Company was a Swedish based consulting firm and my nearest offices were Scottsdale and San Francisco, which meant I worked from home or was out on the road traveling. My first week was during the organizations annual conference, which was held at a ski resort in the Italian Alps. So my first day "on the job", I went to four hours of meetings, then went skiing on a mountain right down the road from the Matterhorn, not the Disney one ;-) I was compensated pretty well during the three years, met and worked with lots of people MUCH smarter than me (mostly 20-something MBAs fresh out of the Ivy League). The work was very challenging, super interesting, I traveled all over the world, designing training programs for the Fortune 200. Big clients like UPS, Cigna Health, GlaxoSmithKline, it was really fun. In 2011 and 2012, I racked up almost half a million frequent flier miles, got to visit places all over Africa, Europe, South America, it was an amazing adventure. I was banking really good money into my 401k, received a $30k bonus each year on top of my already very generous salary, I made my own hours and didn't have to sit in a cubicle. Unfortunately, there was a downsizing and consolidation within the industry and my position and the positions of my entire team were eliminated so I was laid off. Fortunately, I had not dissolved my corporation and still had it running so I was able to just slide back into production.
My point being, there are amazing, incredible corporate jobs out there, you just have to have the skill set to hunt them down or if you are lucky like me, they come find you, headhunt you and are in. I did not have a degree in anything related to the job, but my reputation and skill as a writer, manager, and strategic thinker preceded me and they practically begged me to join their team. It was an amazing three year run and I will always be grateful I had the opportunity. I still occasionally produce projects for this company and their sister company, good people and there was no ill will when they laid me and the rest of the team off. If I had been more skilled and had more knowledge, I probably could have figured out a way to evolve my position and stayed with the company but that would have involved selling, being a salesperson as well as a designer and I really didn't want to go back into sales, taking clients out for drinks, etc. I missed production too. So I look at it as an incredible experience that was like going to graduate school, very intense and I learned so much. They were matching my 401k contributions from year one and by year three, they were doubling my contribution. If I could have stayed with that company, my retirement fund would have been well over a million dollars in about ten years. You aren't going to have stuff like this happen freelancing.
I know several people who work in corporate America who have amazing, very interesting jobs and make a ton of money. Yes, they work a lot of hours but most freelancers average 50-60 hours week either working or hustling to try to land more work too so that's not a huge factor in my mind. If someone freelances and is working 30 hours a week, I bet they are poor. Having your healthcare paid for, 401k and a yearly bonus is nice. When young people ask me any tips about going into production, I tell them the same thing I posted in my last post. If you want a "normal" life and security, forget production. If you want more variety and can deal with living on a financial roller coaster for the rest of your life, sure, go for it.
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Run&Gun
Veteran
I think Scott hit the nail on the head. Yes, the internet is full of @$$holes that hide behind screen names just so they can be mean and nasty with no repercussions, but I'd say that's probably the minority on a board like this. Pretty much anyone that knows me that would come across this board and see my screen name would know immediately who I am, so I'm not really trying to "hide". I wouldn't Mother F*** a client by name on an open forum like this, but I would hate for something that was said and possibly misconstrued to come back and be used against me later. We have all seen it where someone says something on social media or on-line and it results in their careers being ruined. You can make the argument that if you are using your real name then there is accountability in what you're saying, but on the other side of the coin, going by a screen name, allows people to be more honest and candid than they may otherwise be. That being said, I'm still somewhat guarded in some of the things I say because of professional courtesy and to CMA.
Eric Coughlin
Veteran
So, how much does one need to make in your respective area to raise a family without relying on a wife's income?
While rates dropping over time may mean not living the same lifestyle as what one was accustomed to, as long as one makes enough to live a satisfactory lifestyle financially, while enjoying their job, then making less shouldn't be the end of the world. And, if you're making less, there are typically ways to try to make more money in your respective field if you put the effort into it instead of staying complacent with the work you're doing and the income you're making.
As for myself, so far I've been making more and more money each year, and continually try to find ways to increase my income. My primary strategy has been investing in equipment, and then charging clients more money for the more equipment I own. Three years ago I couldn't have imagined making $1500-$2500 for one day of work as I didn't own enough equipment to justify those rates, but these days I occasionally do when hired with a good amount of my gear.
Last year I was about 85% freelance and 15% company clients. As a freelancer you do eventually hit a cap at how much money you can make (in the high end they tend to rent more often from rental houses than owner/ops), while as a production company/producer, you can always find bigger gigs and higher end clients to land say a $100k job like puredrifting mentioned and which some of my co-workers have gotten. This year I'm looking to get back into doing more company projects (producing) to grow my company instead of just growing my equipment and rates as a freelancer. I think I said that last year, though, so we'll see how it goes.
____________
Ned, going back to Easy Rig, you sound like you have a beef with it. Like maybe a friend of yours got nick-named "Bad Back Henry" or something for using an Easy Rig on set. Have you ever used an Easy Rig? And perhaps more importantly, have you ever used an Easy Rig on a commercial or narrative production (where they are best suited)?
My beef with your beef with the Easy Rig is that you seem to dismiss it as a stabilization tool, and seem to regard it only as a back reliever. My argument is that the Easy Rig provides a type of stabilization that no other tool offers. Putting a camera on gaff tape in your pocket or on a Hipshot will not have the same semi-floating feeling that an Easy Rig provides. You won't be able to semi-smoothly dolly in, or go left to right with a type of swaying movement, and even a static shot will look different. Handheld has a more course feel to it, handheld with IS has a less organic feel to it, and Easy Rig has an organic and less course feel to it. Hipshot also doesn't offer the range of height that an Easy Rig does, and is more difficult to adjust height mid-shot with.
Easy Rig also sells a version which supports up to 11 lbs, for lightweight cameras; I assume this is not marketed as a back saver if it only supports 11 lbs, but more so as a stabilization tool.
I understand how an Easy Rig is easily too cumbersome for a lot of doc style and run n gun shooting, but to dismiss it for narrative and commercial use as nothing more than a back helper seems a bit...dismissive. But maybe I was reading into your post incorrectly.
While rates dropping over time may mean not living the same lifestyle as what one was accustomed to, as long as one makes enough to live a satisfactory lifestyle financially, while enjoying their job, then making less shouldn't be the end of the world. And, if you're making less, there are typically ways to try to make more money in your respective field if you put the effort into it instead of staying complacent with the work you're doing and the income you're making.
As for myself, so far I've been making more and more money each year, and continually try to find ways to increase my income. My primary strategy has been investing in equipment, and then charging clients more money for the more equipment I own. Three years ago I couldn't have imagined making $1500-$2500 for one day of work as I didn't own enough equipment to justify those rates, but these days I occasionally do when hired with a good amount of my gear.
Last year I was about 85% freelance and 15% company clients. As a freelancer you do eventually hit a cap at how much money you can make (in the high end they tend to rent more often from rental houses than owner/ops), while as a production company/producer, you can always find bigger gigs and higher end clients to land say a $100k job like puredrifting mentioned and which some of my co-workers have gotten. This year I'm looking to get back into doing more company projects (producing) to grow my company instead of just growing my equipment and rates as a freelancer. I think I said that last year, though, so we'll see how it goes.
____________
Ned, going back to Easy Rig, you sound like you have a beef with it. Like maybe a friend of yours got nick-named "Bad Back Henry" or something for using an Easy Rig on set. Have you ever used an Easy Rig? And perhaps more importantly, have you ever used an Easy Rig on a commercial or narrative production (where they are best suited)?
My beef with your beef with the Easy Rig is that you seem to dismiss it as a stabilization tool, and seem to regard it only as a back reliever. My argument is that the Easy Rig provides a type of stabilization that no other tool offers. Putting a camera on gaff tape in your pocket or on a Hipshot will not have the same semi-floating feeling that an Easy Rig provides. You won't be able to semi-smoothly dolly in, or go left to right with a type of swaying movement, and even a static shot will look different. Handheld has a more course feel to it, handheld with IS has a less organic feel to it, and Easy Rig has an organic and less course feel to it. Hipshot also doesn't offer the range of height that an Easy Rig does, and is more difficult to adjust height mid-shot with.
Easy Rig also sells a version which supports up to 11 lbs, for lightweight cameras; I assume this is not marketed as a back saver if it only supports 11 lbs, but more so as a stabilization tool.
I understand how an Easy Rig is easily too cumbersome for a lot of doc style and run n gun shooting, but to dismiss it for narrative and commercial use as nothing more than a back helper seems a bit...dismissive. But maybe I was reading into your post incorrectly.
Run&Gun
Veteran
Except for the few years that I worked for my family in my teens, I've never had a staff job, and actually take pride in that. I've said countless times, I could not have a "9-5, M-F, office job". Last year, we did a big shoot for a client and they basically rented the top floor of an office building in the same business park as their studio for us. We had two video set-ups, one two-cam and another three-cam, they had stills, plus some other stuff. I believe we were there three days, plus a set day. After the second day of pulling into the parking lot and walking into the same building to go to the elevator I said there is no way in hell this could be my life: pulling into the same parking lot everyday, getting in the same elevator everyday, walking into the same office everyday and sitting at the same desk in a God-awful boring corporate office with white walls, fluorescent overhead lights and sit in a cubicle EVERYDAY. That would be Hell. I used to say my personal Hell would be shooting "reality tv", but I think that would actually be worse.
indiawilds
Veteran
I am an engineer and MBA by education and was in senior positions in the corporate world. I was head of Govt relations in Nokia and was based in chennai, India where we had the worlds largest mobile manufacturing unit. Then I was Executive Director of Manufacturers association for information technology. I was asking questioning myself about my aim in life. I had seen my dad pass away due to a medical negligence. Unlike US, we can't even sue the hospital as our laws are S***. I was thinking that someday my time will also come and when that moment arrives if by chance all that I have done in my life flashes infront of my eyes, then it will be a big regret. So I decided that money is not the only thing and decided to start on my own.
Filming is for a passion as well as to continue earning money. I am involved in wildlife conservation, awareness creation as well as I take up lot of social issues and shoot and edit stuff for many NGOs. One thing I have now learnt. Whenever I have told a prospective client about my background, I have lost the job. The moment they hear it, they try to either think that I have got lot of money and squeeze me or they think that I am just one of those crazy guys and hence may not be good. So I prefer to keep my mouthshut and things are fine.
Based on my background, I have realised that if would have failed in filming, then I could have gone back to the corporate world and lectured about it and made money. I also have a consulting background (Strategy consulting, Performance improvement etc) in PwC and other companies. So taking full day sessions comes easily to me.
Now the media is moving towards videos. There is a huge requirement for content. People are just shooting stuff in Canon 550D or Go pros and earning good money from youtube channels. Slowly the quality level requirement will also go up. However, even basic cameras will become better and better. Competition is going to increase. So professional videographers have to find their strengths and create their own niche.
People here can form an alliance and pitch for projects and each person can get a cut. So if something originates from someone, then that guy gets his cut and vice-versa. Guys like Ned, Run&Gun, Puredrifting and others can leverage their contacts.
Filming is for a passion as well as to continue earning money. I am involved in wildlife conservation, awareness creation as well as I take up lot of social issues and shoot and edit stuff for many NGOs. One thing I have now learnt. Whenever I have told a prospective client about my background, I have lost the job. The moment they hear it, they try to either think that I have got lot of money and squeeze me or they think that I am just one of those crazy guys and hence may not be good. So I prefer to keep my mouthshut and things are fine.
Based on my background, I have realised that if would have failed in filming, then I could have gone back to the corporate world and lectured about it and made money.
I also have a consulting background (Strategy consulting, Performance improvement etc) in PwC and other companies. So taking full day sessions comes easily to me. Now the media is moving towards videos. There is a huge requirement for content. People are just shooting stuff in Canon 550D or Go pros and earning good money from youtube channels. Slowly the quality level requirement will also go up. However, even basic cameras will become better and better. Competition is going to increase. So professional videographers have to find their strengths and create their own niche.
People here can form an alliance and pitch for projects and each person can get a cut. So if something originates from someone, then that guy gets his cut and vice-versa. Guys like Ned, Run&Gun, Puredrifting and others can leverage their contacts.
puredrifting
Major Contributor
You are making me laugh, you have a great sense of humor JP, just like Eric. I love sarcasm and wit and the two of you have it.
puredrifting
Major Contributor
It's all relative Eric. I live in a nice but not wealthy suburb of LA. To live a very average lifestyle here (I drive a 2010 Corolla, I have zero consumer debt other than mortages on three houses, I rent two of them and live in one - to me a decent lifestyle is being debt free, putting money into your 401k), I have to make between $100k to $125k. When I was with the training company, we actually researched, read studies and worked with author Daniel Pink who wrote the very profound book, Drive, (Read it guys, it will educate you in ways you never knew possible) about what motivates people and it's not money at all for most. People actually reach their greatest potential as a freelancer or employee when they make just barely enough where they don't have to constantly worry about money and for most Americans, that is between $85 to $125k per year. Anyone making less lives in constant worry of financial ruin, not having enough to handle the monthly emergencies we all have (Car breakdowns, appliances die, property taxes are due, unexpected dental or medical bill). For those reading this in America, not stupid, overpriced California, $100k sounds like quite a bit of money but to live in Southern California, that's nothing. On my Facebook feed, I was just making fun of a local real estate ad for a small 2/2 1950s home in Ventura that was listed for $575,000.00 Anywhere else in America, this is a $100k starter home but in Ventura, Ca. it's a half million dollar home. So dumb, it's not that great here. It's nice but there are plenty of drawbacks as well.
As far as making less, I don't mind normal year to year variances but when you see a steady five year decrease, all of the while working harder and longer, taking more and more projects on for less money just to stay at financial equilibrium, that's when you should question what you are doing, how you are doing it and why.
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nedcam
Well-known member
Sheeeeeet...just wrote a long piece but lost it when I hit refresh! Oh well.
Eric, when the Easy Rig was introduced, if you can find the original ads, it was as a "Back Saver". So to this day, when I see one, I think to myself: "He must have a bad back."
As to anyone now wanting to enter into freelance DP work, who is not from a wealthy family, married into one, or marries a high paid spouse: You're Nuts!
I know of what I speak.
And oh yeah, I will try to get over the thing I have about dealing with anonymous posters.
Best,
Ned
Eric, when the Easy Rig was introduced, if you can find the original ads, it was as a "Back Saver". So to this day, when I see one, I think to myself: "He must have a bad back."
As to anyone now wanting to enter into freelance DP work, who is not from a wealthy family, married into one, or marries a high paid spouse: You're Nuts!
I know of what I speak.
And oh yeah, I will try to get over the thing I have about dealing with anonymous posters.
Best,
Ned
JPNola
Veteran
While it can be financially turbulent, most of the guys I know who do this for a living do alright, even with the saturation of shooters, sound ops, cameras, etc. They earn more in revenue working 8 days a month than do most people working 20 days a month. ( keep in mind that the average monthly income in the U.S. is $3,769. ) And sometimes a "day" of work is only 3-5 hours when you do a quick live shot or a short interview and are still able to bill for a full day.
How much you need to make depends, as puredrifting noted, on where you live. As well as on your personal circumstances and lifestyle. If you have kids, that is a consideration in your career choice. You have an obligation to provide financial stability and provide for their needs. That said, kids are better off with a parent that enjoys their career than with a parent who is miserable in their career and perceives their kids as having caused them to have to abandon their dreams. Your kids need you to be happy in your career and in your own life. And I concur that, while easier said by someone who doesn't have kids or massive personal debt, money isn't everything.
I have a relative who is a highly successful radiologist. He is a millionaire. Yet he is often joking that he hates me because I get to do all this cool stuff, every time I work it is something different, and I never dread going to work. He does the same thing every day- reading x-rays and dictating- and most of the time he is miserable doing it. It is drudgery. While I, on the other hand, have been able to have experiences that no amount of money could buy. I am not wealthy in money but I am wealthy in experiences. Experiences so incredible that I can rarely tell anyone of them, even you all, without eyes rolling over as a result of it sounding braggadocios. This career has taken me to some 40 different U.S. states and 14 countries. I have been able to meet and work with iconic individuals in sports, music, Art, Hollywood, politics, Business, and academia. And more than that, I have had the honor of telling the stories of ordinary people, dropping in on their lives for a day or two, hearing their perspective, learning about their world, sharing in their joys, sorrows, and struggles, and being a part of bringing attention to injustices, social issues, and the forgotten man. From heads of state to inmates on death row. All walks of life. Some 4000+ unique shoots. As far as I am concerned it is the greatest job in the world.
There are SO many different disciplines in the field of TV and Film production that the sky is the limit for anyone who is motivated. I think it is a mistake to say that others are crazy to get into the biz or to discourage others from becoming a Cameraman. I encourage others to follow their passion. You will find a way to make it work. I would never be one to advise others to go into a job that they dislike just because it is financially lucrative or offers stability. That's no way to approach life. That is soul-crushing.
I don't for a moment believe that Ned regrets his career choice or would sincerely advise others not to follow their dream as he himself did. The only limitations are those you place upon yourself. I know that sounds like a motivational poster, but it is true.
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Oh yeah, it's great fun no doubt. There's a reason why I put up with the crippling financial stress. Even if it's just another old corporate gig, I rather enjoy meeting new people, learning about their business and putting it together.
Many of my friends have more financial stability but that is 100% the end things I envy about their lives. Work takes *way* too much time out of your life to do something horrible.
Many of my friends have more financial stability but that is 100% the end things I envy about their lives. Work takes *way* too much time out of your life to do something horrible.
nedcam
Well-known member
I feel slightly better because I just got booked for next Thursday to film the cast of Hamilton including BTS. But one day a week is not survivable!
So that long post I wrote that got deleted...one main thing, it relates to DBP's age group trying to break in, and there is a great differentiation between those living on their own, in a childless couple or a union with children. Assuming that one is not from wealth or married into it, here's the trajectory I have seen many dozens of times, experienced it myself, and paints one into a corner of having to run faster on the Hamster Wheel of Generating Cash. It always happens in one's late twenties/early thirties. Eric wrote:
as long as one makes enough to live a satisfactory lifestyle financially, while enjoying their job,
The whole deal is, what is satisfactory when you are in your twenties/early thirties, is not going to be enough for when you get older and if you enter a profession where there's no revenue growth, you're screwed IF you get married and have kids. As a DP you then can't buy more and more gear. See below:
• DP minding his business and enjoying life. Not too concerned about The Benjamins. Does low budget indies, freebies, his art. Supplements DP jobs with other work in the Gig Economy. Doesn't stress about his revenue, the future...
• Poof! Meets someone and falls in love!
• Her friends are all getting married. Hmmmm....
• DP now must save and buy ring, instead of gear. Rings are very expensive, more than many lenses!
• DP must now help pay for wedding instead of buying gear.
• DP now part of a couple so must move into larger, nicer place, pay more for housing instead of buying more gear.
• Wife sees all her friends having babies, feels clock ticking.
• Nine months later DP is a daddy. Profits go to Kid #1 rather than buying more gear.
• Decision is made to move to safer place with nice yard, nice schools, DP needs more money. Gear is now on-hold, on a Wish List.
• Wife keeps an eagle eye on DP's gear buying habits. Watches for UPS delivering B&H boxes. Checks recycling bin for folded up B&H boxes. Looks in DP's van for hidden, folded up B&H boxes. Checks DP's credit card statements for known drug, I mean gear, dealers.
• DP learns few wives want just one kid, nine months later Kid #2 arrives. DP begs to stop at two, knowing he needs to buy more gear.
• Decision is made that day care is too expensive for two kids, so wife will stay home, means one less paycheck. Money pressure mounts. DP starts to think maybe he should have picked a "sensible" major?
• Everyone in baby group starts talking about college fund savings. Money for DP's Wish List now goes into college savings fund. Also, that nasty acronym IRA also raises its ugly head, gear money starts to go into that fund.
• DP, who had followed his dream, realizes freelance video DP work is not a steady, profitable income stream for the lifestyle he is now in, compared to the single, childless lifestyle of his late twenties, early thirties. DP realizes at this point why so many other DPs are from wealthy families or married one. Who else could afford this, let alone keep buying more gear?
And that's my story too! But I was really lucky in terms of timing and I was a DP in a twenty-five year window when we worked all the time for top dollar. Just luck, although the official (Google it) definition of Luck is: Preparation Meets Opportunity. Yes, the growth of video production looks like a hockey stick on a chart, but the rates are lower, you now need to keep buying new cameras and the competition is intense, all in favor of a buyer's market. When we would buy the "best" camera, it's popularity could last five years, no competitors, the clients only asked for that model, so it came with a crank to print money! I do see that if one specializes in post, rather than shooting, your body will last longer and it isn't capital intensive. To edit, every few years you need a new computer, buy some software. So if an older DP transitions to editing, that can work. But me...I can not stay in front of a computer all day. I'm too "high energy" as they say. Outdoorish sort of fella.
As to buying more gear, unless it's really needed, gear is not an investment, although we can talk ourselves into thinking it as such. It's an expense, albeit a necessary one. An investment would be to hire an experienced sales person, someone with a track record in production, someone who could do your Constant Contact outreach, attend networking meetings, turn over rocks, in other words: Get New Business. Now that's an investment. Thinking that having a shiny new doodad that clients will salivate over and thus hire you, is a pipe dream.
I love what I do/did, I had an incredible run, the envy of all, although I always played that down as much as possible, especially among friends, neighbors and family, I know people get jealous. People with "regular" jobs don't want to hear about our exotic travels, celebrity shmoozing, etc. But I just don't see how someone in 2017 can start a freelance DP biz and make it through the above phases of life unless they are rich kids, and I do see a LOT of that. Perhaps if there are no children and the wife has a good salary, but kids will zap your cash, your gear money. I lucked out. The internet ruined an awful lot, damn them! We DPs also made a ton selling digital beta stock footage, buy and sell used gear, dub orders!, etc. Lot's of ways to make extra dough. Not now, although I feel if you can latch onto TV clients who have this regular, conveyor belt need for programming, that can be the ticket. I see that in Chicago with peers doing ESPN, Dateline, prime time news feature shows, etc. But it is difficult to grow old in those, the late forties and your body starts saying "Where's the Aleve?"
I suck at math but I am expert at Cameraman Math and I don't see how people can buy all this gear, not being able to upcharge the cheap clients we get nowadays, and stay in business. Beyond me...
That's my nickel's worth!
Mr. Miller
So that long post I wrote that got deleted...one main thing, it relates to DBP's age group trying to break in, and there is a great differentiation between those living on their own, in a childless couple or a union with children. Assuming that one is not from wealth or married into it, here's the trajectory I have seen many dozens of times, experienced it myself, and paints one into a corner of having to run faster on the Hamster Wheel of Generating Cash. It always happens in one's late twenties/early thirties. Eric wrote:
as long as one makes enough to live a satisfactory lifestyle financially, while enjoying their job,
The whole deal is, what is satisfactory when you are in your twenties/early thirties, is not going to be enough for when you get older and if you enter a profession where there's no revenue growth, you're screwed IF you get married and have kids. As a DP you then can't buy more and more gear. See below:
• DP minding his business and enjoying life. Not too concerned about The Benjamins. Does low budget indies, freebies, his art. Supplements DP jobs with other work in the Gig Economy. Doesn't stress about his revenue, the future...
• Poof! Meets someone and falls in love!
• Her friends are all getting married. Hmmmm....
• DP now must save and buy ring, instead of gear. Rings are very expensive, more than many lenses!
• DP must now help pay for wedding instead of buying gear.
• DP now part of a couple so must move into larger, nicer place, pay more for housing instead of buying more gear.
• Wife sees all her friends having babies, feels clock ticking.
• Nine months later DP is a daddy. Profits go to Kid #1 rather than buying more gear.
• Decision is made to move to safer place with nice yard, nice schools, DP needs more money. Gear is now on-hold, on a Wish List.
• Wife keeps an eagle eye on DP's gear buying habits. Watches for UPS delivering B&H boxes. Checks recycling bin for folded up B&H boxes. Looks in DP's van for hidden, folded up B&H boxes. Checks DP's credit card statements for known drug, I mean gear, dealers.
• DP learns few wives want just one kid, nine months later Kid #2 arrives. DP begs to stop at two, knowing he needs to buy more gear.
• Decision is made that day care is too expensive for two kids, so wife will stay home, means one less paycheck. Money pressure mounts. DP starts to think maybe he should have picked a "sensible" major?
• Everyone in baby group starts talking about college fund savings. Money for DP's Wish List now goes into college savings fund. Also, that nasty acronym IRA also raises its ugly head, gear money starts to go into that fund.
• DP, who had followed his dream, realizes freelance video DP work is not a steady, profitable income stream for the lifestyle he is now in, compared to the single, childless lifestyle of his late twenties, early thirties. DP realizes at this point why so many other DPs are from wealthy families or married one. Who else could afford this, let alone keep buying more gear?
And that's my story too! But I was really lucky in terms of timing and I was a DP in a twenty-five year window when we worked all the time for top dollar. Just luck, although the official (Google it) definition of Luck is: Preparation Meets Opportunity. Yes, the growth of video production looks like a hockey stick on a chart, but the rates are lower, you now need to keep buying new cameras and the competition is intense, all in favor of a buyer's market. When we would buy the "best" camera, it's popularity could last five years, no competitors, the clients only asked for that model, so it came with a crank to print money! I do see that if one specializes in post, rather than shooting, your body will last longer and it isn't capital intensive. To edit, every few years you need a new computer, buy some software. So if an older DP transitions to editing, that can work. But me...I can not stay in front of a computer all day. I'm too "high energy" as they say. Outdoorish sort of fella.
As to buying more gear, unless it's really needed, gear is not an investment, although we can talk ourselves into thinking it as such. It's an expense, albeit a necessary one. An investment would be to hire an experienced sales person, someone with a track record in production, someone who could do your Constant Contact outreach, attend networking meetings, turn over rocks, in other words: Get New Business. Now that's an investment. Thinking that having a shiny new doodad that clients will salivate over and thus hire you, is a pipe dream.
I love what I do/did, I had an incredible run, the envy of all, although I always played that down as much as possible, especially among friends, neighbors and family, I know people get jealous. People with "regular" jobs don't want to hear about our exotic travels, celebrity shmoozing, etc. But I just don't see how someone in 2017 can start a freelance DP biz and make it through the above phases of life unless they are rich kids, and I do see a LOT of that. Perhaps if there are no children and the wife has a good salary, but kids will zap your cash, your gear money. I lucked out. The internet ruined an awful lot, damn them! We DPs also made a ton selling digital beta stock footage, buy and sell used gear, dub orders!, etc. Lot's of ways to make extra dough. Not now, although I feel if you can latch onto TV clients who have this regular, conveyor belt need for programming, that can be the ticket. I see that in Chicago with peers doing ESPN, Dateline, prime time news feature shows, etc. But it is difficult to grow old in those, the late forties and your body starts saying "Where's the Aleve?"
I suck at math but I am expert at Cameraman Math and I don't see how people can buy all this gear, not being able to upcharge the cheap clients we get nowadays, and stay in business. Beyond me...
That's my nickel's worth!
Mr. Miller
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JPNola
Veteran
I toyed with going that route but I hate "meetings". Besides, I lacked the necessary foreign accent. :grin:
That's me! No kid plans and my wife will have a good, steady salary. Still, I want to make a decent living simply out of pride. Throwing away money on gear that doesn't make me money won't cut it.
Still though, you do reach a point to where the 20s lifestyle of low rent apartment, no car, barely enough to afford raman noodles starts to get old. I do want to up my standard of living a bit and *maybe* have some actual real money left over.
Plus it'd be nice to buy gear. I buy practically nothing, and it always amazes me how little gear I have compared to many on here. Even the ones who are hobbyists only.
Never any money, though. Rates are too low. Gotta work on changing that this year.
PedroAquiles
Active member
Great post ! Love to read life experiences!
Much more to learn than gear tech
Much more to learn than gear tech
gkantziper
Esteemed Member
I've always prefered the phrase, "Lighting Camera Person". DP always sounded pretentious to my ear, especially since more than half of my work over the last 3 decades has been corporate video. "Lighting Camera Person" differentiates you from an "operator". I think it is an English title?
morgan_moore
Major Contributor
On funding/business - it is probably an impossible ask but..
I learned very simple economics.. work out your costs
Eg. Van..
cost $10000,
life 4 years
resale $2500
depreciation $7500
employed days per year 100
cost of van $18.75 per worked day.
(excluding, roadside repair, professional on set insurance, service)
Add business rent, cameras, lenses, grip, PL insurance, bla bla
Simply one can come up with a daily cost to operate
One then simply adds ones desired wage.. or even the wage of a typical skilled tradesperson.
This is ones minimum dayrate.. it is also a factual minimum.
So those who work below that factual minimum are a problem. Educate them.. and dont lend them one bit of kit, or pass them a job or give them 1stAC gigs. Ever.
If clients ever mention that you are quoting against them sh_it up the client with tales of employing newbs with no PL insurance.
Because they are industry breakers!
And join a union, and encourage those around to join a union.
S
I learned very simple economics.. work out your costs
Eg. Van..
cost $10000,
life 4 years
resale $2500
depreciation $7500
employed days per year 100
cost of van $18.75 per worked day.
(excluding, roadside repair, professional on set insurance, service)
Add business rent, cameras, lenses, grip, PL insurance, bla bla
Simply one can come up with a daily cost to operate
One then simply adds ones desired wage.. or even the wage of a typical skilled tradesperson.
This is ones minimum dayrate.. it is also a factual minimum.
So those who work below that factual minimum are a problem. Educate them.. and dont lend them one bit of kit, or pass them a job or give them 1stAC gigs. Ever.
If clients ever mention that you are quoting against them sh_it up the client with tales of employing newbs with no PL insurance.
Because they are industry breakers!
And join a union, and encourage those around to join a union.
S
cpreston
Veteran
I just say videographer. I know that term is scorned, but it is precise. I find it interesting that videographers dislike the term "videographer", but photographers still use "photographer".