HMC150: Would you do it again?

Denwa said:
averan, I think making a blanket statement like that is very obtuse. It has more to do with card brand than user error.

That aside, Yes, I would buy an HMC150 again. My OCZ cards have been great. Adata lasted 10 days.
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obtuse can still be helpful. :cheesy:

when newbs get the sense that solid state memory cards in general are unreliable, and therefore that the hmc150 is a crappy camera, then it helps to let them know that most folks have never ever had a problem at all.

but good to know there are some brands that apparently are total crap and should be avoided at all costs.
 
Sorry... in most discussions here at least, no brands seem to be particularly failure-prone or failure-proof. We certainly don't have enough data to generalize, but what people have reported has been fairly even across brands. I don't think any major brand has been free of some failure reports (except maybe Delkin, but that may be because Delkin is hardly ever mentioned at all).

Further... take averan's message to heart. Solid-state workflows are in some ways more prone to user error than tape-based workflows... they require a little more care to be sure that data is safely transferred and backed up, and often include general-purpose computers in the loop that may do strange things to media. Good PRACTICES much more than "good brands" will keep your data safe.
 
Before buying a card go to newegg and see what the comments are. Not a guarantee but it will help you avoid the ones with common problems.
 
On the OP's question:

Under the same circumstances and knowing what I know now after using the HMC150 for nearly a year, yes, I would buy it again.
 
Averan,

As the OP, I'm not a newb to video, but am trying to make an informed decision about changing my workflow away from tape.

This is not about the 150 being a crap-cam, it is about the reliability of the media. Like everyone, I would hate to loose a days work because of a $100 worth of SS memory cards. And worse yet, loose a "only happens once event" like a wedding.

In my case, I want to love the 150, but there have been media issues, and there has been very little credible analysis of the problems. My own review of the archives has shown that a certain amount of users have created there own problems with bad technique; usually with regard to formatting or card removals. There is a whole different class of problems which seem to indicate a higher failure rate than the much more expensive P2 system. For me, the issue is to gain confidence in the SD memory system, or just bite the bullet and go P2. There are other reasons to choose one cam or codec over the other, but without confidence in the recording medium, then the rest hardly matters does it?

Since the facts of the non-operator error card failures are pretty difficult to quantitatively investigate, I was seeking the answer to the most basic of qualitative questions: Would you do it again. For users of the 150, that sums up their individual confidence factor in a yes or no answer.

Best Regards,
Grant
 
ggrantly said:
In my case, I want to love the 150, but there have been media issues, and there has been very little credible analysis of the problems.
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Don't use cheap crappy brands. Don't remove the card while the light is flashing. Don't take the battery off while the camera is on and the light is flashing.

I have another Panasonic AVCHD camera, and so far had problems with one card only, I had these problems right while I was recording, I was able to put in another card and to finish what I was shooting. I lost one clip because it stopped recording and I was immediately informed that the card is bad.

Treat cards as normal computer media.

P.S. I lost more clips when I thought I was shooting and in fact I was putting the camera into pause. They should make this red "Record" dot larger, larger, larger :)
 
ggrantly said:
This is not about the 150 being a crap-cam, it is about the reliability of the media. Like everyone, I would hate to loose a days work because of a $100 worth of SS memory cards. And worse yet, loose a "only happens once event" like a wedding.
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My solution? Don't shoot weddings with less than two cameras, and use multiple cards (i.e one preceremony only, one ceremony only, and one reception only). But I took that philosophy with my DVX100a too.

I honestly feel more confident in the SDHC approach (assuming you don't buy a cheap card) than tape. I had far more issues with bum tapes (and that was using the expensive Panny tapes) in my DVX than I've had with my HMC, and I'm using my HMC a lot more. And the idea of shooting HDV to tape scares me even more (long-GOP + tape dropouts = more likely headaches).

What I have done with the last few cards I've bought is to just run them until they're full a few times through my camera before actually putting them into service. Chances are, if they're going to crap out, that's the time when they'll do it.

Frankly, a bigger issue is archiving the footage in a way that you won't lose it (since there's a bigger chance of a hard drive dying than a card dying).
 
Hey Grant, I'm going to be up at my folk's place over Christmas weekend, and I'll probably have my HMC with me. If you want, on my way back south Sunday afternoon you can take a gander at it for a little while.
 
The only thing I don't trust about SD is the flimsy construction of the card enclosures. I have had every single SD card eventually crack down till little pieces fell off. Of course I didn't care $$ wise, and new ones came out with double or quadruple the size when that happened, making it sort of timely... but CF's are where it is at for me now... they are FAR tougher, P2's are probably better, a little bigger makes you treat them with a bit more seriousness, but CF's are so easy to carry... either way P2 or CF, whichever is your favorite, cards used for professional purposes MUST be tougher than SD's.

That said I never had a single issue, maybe one but I don't remember, where I lost data. I always bought good brands and fast cards though.

And all of that said, it is a shame the 150 doesn't use CF. I think CF is definitely affordable enough, and plenty small for anyone to be happy. Or that the 7D isn't a professional video camera, heat friendly, long shot friendly, XLR equipped, etc, etc... camera.
 
I live on an ice planet for most of the year up here in Canada (I kid), an I can honestly say if I knew about the cold weather performance of the lens ring, I would have seriously thought twice about the 150.

It's impossible to roll focus and maintain a steady shot. I'll have to invest in an external control for it and hope it's as precise as the ring.

Simple to use camera, manual control & audio are great, price is fair. But not meant for a cold location.
 
WpgCameraMan said:
I live on an ice planet for most of the year up here in Canada (I kid), an I can honestly say if I knew about the cold weather performance of the lens ring, I would have seriously thought twice about the 150.

It's impossible to roll focus and maintain a steady shot. I'll have to invest in an external control for it and hope it's as precise as the ring.

Simple to use camera, manual control & audio are great, price is fair. But not meant for a cold location.
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HPX170 reportedly has the same issue. I had a varizoom controller before I had the camera. (Almost bought an HVX200 a couple years back and bought the controller first).

It's definitely a drawback that Panasonic should address considering they market solid sate as being extreme temperature friendly (vs tape).

Controller is accurate. Varizoom's focus control could use a larger focus knob though. You could replace the know as it fits over a standard size pot stem.
 
I'd do it again.. and coming from a P2 camera I never have looked back. Simply a major blessing to not have to offload in the field and deal with the expense.


The 150 is also a pretty darn good low-light camera. I think that the upgrade on the 150a should include a timelapse option, maybe exporting out the focus and waveforms and possibly 1080 60p would be a nice touch..
 
i know i said this already.....but, 'yes!', i'd do it again.
i love this camera more and more every day. =)

@uslatin - what in the heck are you doing to your sd cards to make them break???
their small size and compactness seems to make them quite durable despite being made of plastic....there's simply not many ways to apply any force or leverage in such a way as to damage them. and most cards come with a little protective case which should keep it totally safe. i for one am glad it's not CF as i don't like the bigger size and higher cost.
 
I would do it again for sure. I got my 150 in the fall of 2008 one of the first in Canada. I have used it for the past year on one long term project and will sell it at the end of February. I have to date had no problems with SD cards, using the original Panasonic 16 gig that came with it and 5 other Transcend 16 gig all class 6. I keep them in a Pelican memory case, transfer using a superb Nexto back-up system and secondary back up at days end to portable 500 gig drives.
I live in Montreal Canada some of the time and have not experienced the cold weather issues that my fellow Canadian in Winnipeg has experienced, but then it is only December.
The camera, much like the DVX100B I had before is lightweight and easy to handle. There are some drawbacks but most can be overcome with "add ons" like rails and matteboxes and .....
The images from the HMC150 are excellent and I highly recommend it!
My next camera will be an HPX 300. P2 is not the reason for the change, but my next gig will be require more run and gun and the form of the 300 is just more like my old Iki and will require less stuff hanging off the camera. And with 128 gig P2 cards around the corner, transfer will become less of an issue. I will definitely look for a Nexto for P2 along with the camera.
 
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