Gh5ii?

Since I really only want this for filmmaking and some photgraphy, I might as well wait to see what the GH6 will offer. For now, I might just use the iPhone 12 Pro max, Moondog lens and Filmic Pro.
 
The GH6 most likely won't be shipping until November or December. The announcement should happen at NAB in the middle of October and since almost no camera ever ships within a month after an announcement, probably looking at the middle of November for early savvy shoppers.

(Maybe September the earliest which would = October/November.)

If you're considering an iPhone, you could also use any camera with a decent 4K sensor as they all pretty much look the same.

Today, it's mostly about the features as minor differences in color and dynamic range will go unnoticed by regular viewers.

The extra 15% in IQ does exist from the ARRIs and REDs, but that's mostly for people working in the 1%.
 
Zack Snyder, Steven Soderbergh, Sean Baker, Michel Gondry and many others will use iPhones. iPhones can now shoot 4k 10bit, (dolby vision you want) . The Filmic Pro app has 10 bit and they even have Vlog, and lots of control. I think iPones have moved past the "experiment" stage.
With a good story and good audio you can do a lot. Lot's of bad movies have been made with ARRis and Reds etc.

As a low budget filmmaker I want to make it as easy as I can, and not have to carry around a ton of crap I don't need. I also like my GH3 and I'll see what the GH6 has to offer, but for now the the iPhone 12 Pro Max, Moondog lens, Filmic Pro app, 4K, 24p 10bit.
 
NorBro said:
The announcement should happen at NAB in the middle of October and since almost no camera ever ships within a month after an announcement, probably looking at the middle of November for early savvy shoppers.

(Maybe September the earliest which would = October/November.)
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I think September for the reveal, and then on display at NAB. I would agree with the rest of your timeline.
 
Zim said:
Zack Snyder, Steven Soderbergh, Sean Baker, Michel Gondry and many others will use iPhones. iPhones can now shoot 4k 10bit, (dolby vision you want) . The Filmic Pro app has 10 bit and they even have Vlog, and lots of control. I think iPones have moved past the "experiment" stage.
With a good story and good audio you can do a lot. Lot's of bad movies have been made with ARRis and Reds etc.

As a low budget filmmaker I want to make it as easy as I can, and not have to carry around a ton of crap I don't need. I also like my GH3 and I'll see what the GH6 has to offer, but for now the the iPhone 12 Pro Max, Moondog lens, Filmic Pro app, 4K, 24p 10bit.
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lol. Those guys are already rich and just messing around...they are artists with different paint brushes.

Baker's latest project was shot on film.

I don't want it to sound like I don't like iPhones; I would absolutely love to use them for all filming, but I think for most people using them right now for something possibly financially rewarding is a waste of time. (But maybe this is just for fun.)

Once in a blue moon we'll get a Tangerine.

Maybe that will be you...

P.S. Thousands of us were so excited for RED's phone 'Hydrogen One' (discontinued) because it could have been an incredible tool with more time.
 
stoneinapond said:
I think September for the reveal, and then on display at NAB. I would agree with the rest of your timeline.
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FWIW, the consensus around the interwebs is that the Japanese have managed their inventory fairly well and, unlike the American car manufacturers, would not be facing a major shortage of chips. Otherwise, shortages are expected to last into Q2 2022.

As to iPhone - or, for that matter, any smartphone - filming, one can make a decent looking video in a small, well lit, room/studio. The alternative is to make a "Blair Witch" for 2021 - "it may look like crap but it's by design!".

I still recommend a slightly used Pocket4K for someone with the MFT glass and on a budget.
 
DLD said:
I still recommend a slightly used Pocket4K for someone with the MFT glass and on a budget.
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Everyone does...how could you not.

Lighting is most important below, but the quality is tremendous for less than $1000 used.

You can't compare iPhone's sharpened, low bitrate video look to something like this.

 
NorBro said:
lol. Those guys are already rich and just messing around...they are artists with different paint brushes.

Baker's latest project was shot on film.

I don't want it to sound like I don't like iPhones; I would absolutely love to use them for all filming, but I think for most people using them right now for something possibly financially rewarding is a waste of time. (But maybe this is just for fun.)

Once in a blue moon we'll get a Tangerine.

Maybe that will be you...

P.S. Thousands of us were so excited for RED's phone 'Hydrogen One' (discontinued) because it could have been an incredible tool with more time.
Click to expand...

Just messing around? Unsane had a $1,500,000 budget, Tangerine, $100,000, High Flying Bird, $2,000,000 etc. Not really messing around.
Once in a blue moon you get a Blair Witch too. Really even with Reds Cameras you only get "once in a blue moon" a good movie and one that makes money.

It does sound like you don't like iPhones. . If you set out to make a movie only for money then you have failed at the start. You have already said writing doesn't matter and that is a bad way to start a film.
 
Are we discussing the same RED? Hundreds of successful movies have been made and grossed billions of dollars between them.

Whether you like them is a different story.

As far as budgets...2 million? Would you feel confident you could do a lot with that amount of money?

I do love iPhones. If you spent more time on this forum, you'd know my feelings about Apple and the future of this industry. Phone filmmaking is the future for many...they are just not optimized yet as much as they could be.

___

And I didn't say writing doesn't matter, I said this:

NorBro said:
I actually wonder if storytelling even matters anymore.

Since the beginning of filmmaking many people have spent a lot of effort writing, telling stories they truly think are good only to get criticized or go completely misunderstood.

Sites like Rotten Tomatoes exist in which at times so-called professionals have completely opposite opinions from the audience (or even each other).
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___

But I do agree about your comment about not only making movies for money...follow your heart.
 
By the way...because RED and Apple have/had some sort of relationship that also involved a lawsuit, I'm actually very excited about the future of their phones because most would conclude that there is no doubt they are working on a powerful phone for better video, which might include ProRes RAW internally (hence the legal conflict with RED, but I don't know the details).

An iPhone with better codecs, higher bitrates, LOG, ProRes RAW, artificial intelligence that controls depth-of-field, deep-learning AF, video IQ basically on par with modern mirrorless'...that is a dream come true!

If we could have that unsharpened, thick quality with shallow DOF (if desired) from a phone (with built-in focal lengths), I would never buy another camera again.

This is what many of us are waiting for...not something that currently looks just a bit better than a new GoPro.
 
NorBro said:
You can't compare iPhone's sharpened, low bitrate video look to something like this.

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Now, that's pretty. And, for a Russian guy, really pretty.

And a smartphone with external lenses, improved codecs, etc., will likely come close to a low budget camera with the same in the next generation.The manufacturer would have to only provide the computational muscle inside the phone. It really doesn't have to be a ProRes Raw either - it wouldn't hurt but it wouldn't have to be - but there should be more of a video specific camera module rather than a photo-oriented one. That Quad Bayer Sony sensor in wide and standard might be a good fit.
 
ProRes RAW just has to be in an Apple even if only because they make it and offer different products that work with it. Too fitting not to have it.

Someone - who would know - once told me that all cameras will eventually and naturally be shooting RAW (for video).

And although the change hasn't happened yet, external RAW recording and proprietary RAW recording is at an all-time high. Even if it's not the purest RAW one could have, it doesn't matter because everyone is clearly interested in building their own corporate path.

Day and night compared to what it was. (I was told the above about 6-7 years ago.)

Blackmagic's BRAW-only URSA 12K is the first of its kind and I could see Apple following suit with a ProRes RAW-only iPhone. This would continue to lock users in their system, but nothing would change as far as how you'd handle the video (for most people). You would still be able to send it, edit it and export it in various formats as you always did, but it would provide you the next-generation technology and direction the world is moving in.

Even if the benefits aren't superior to H.265/6, corporate attainment is always desired.
 
I remember Rodney Charters at an NAB being asked about his work on the "Dallas" reboot and him answering, "We shoot on Alexa in ProRes". ProRes was the pro codec de jour at the time but, technically, any high bit rate (or its equivalent) Log would do. Besides, FX-9 does its 6K-into-4K internally and R5 does 8K-inro-4K HQ internally too. And 4K Raw (at 2x compression) will already work with most CFExpress cards.
 
He also probably had no other choice then, ha.

The industry changed for the better...like you said, all it needs to be now is a high-quality, high bit-rate LOG format since almost all are accepted in almost any NLE.

Like Canon's CRL, I don't necessarily think of ProRes RAW as some pure, gold-standard RAW; I think of it as the 2nd generation of ProRes that the company developed that may eventually replace ProRes if certain business happens.

Their introduction of ProRes RAW happened around the time when they appeared to be chatting with RED. They most likely see the benefit of any kind of association with a RAW format.

Everyone has a "RAW", and they keep advancing their codecs and formats.
 
NorBro said:
Are we discussing the same RED? Hundreds of successful movies have been made and grossed billions of dollars between them.

Whether you like them is a different story.

As far as budgets...2 million? Would you feel confident you could do a lot with that amount of money?

I do love iPhones. If you spent more time on this forum, you'd know my feelings about Apple and the future of this industry. Phone filmmaking is the future for many...they are just not optimized yet as much as they could be.

___

And I didn't say writing doesn't matter, I said this:



___

But I do agree about your comment about not only making movies for money...follow your heart.
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I'm saying NO camera is going to guarantee you a good movie. Plus everyone can't afford or need one.
Speaking of Tangerine, Sean Baker waited till after the film in the Q&A to tell everyone it was made with a iPhone. Many would have dismissed it without even watching it.
 
At the end of the day, you have to do what's best for you.

I'm just saying it would be a shame not to use a better camera for better results when you have the opportunity to do so (especially with all of the hard work and time invested).

Most of us aren't on the level of any of the directors above and we don't have any connections to have executives give our work the time of day. And the odds are stacked against us, and I wouldn't use something that will make it even more difficult because you're absolutely right that many would have dismissed the movie above without even watching it, and that's even more so the case 6 years later when average production value is insane.
 
NorBro said:
At the end of the day, you have to do what's best for you.

I'm just saying it would be a shame not to use a better camera for better results when you have the opportunity to do so (especially with all of the hard work and time invested).

Most of us aren't on the level of any of the directors above and we don't have any connections to have executives give our work the time of day. And the odds are stacked against us, and I wouldn't use something that will make it even more difficult because you're absolutely right that many would have dismissed the movie above without even watching it, and that's even more so the case 6 years later when average production value is insane.
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You are right. Since I started this filmmaking I've used the Canon Xl1, DVX100b, GH3 and a few Nikons. My budget is usually tight so I have to watch what I spend. This next buy will have to last for awhile. Your right I could by a Red and chance are slim to nothing any executive would ever see it. But, I still want to try and make something and make it look and sound good.
 
I'll watch your movie when it comes out :cool:

On a related note, this is why so many of us fell in love with Blackmagic almost 10 years ago now (time flies), because we were finally, finally able to have 85% of ARRI's and RED's image quality for very little money.
 
NorBro said:
I'll watch your movie when it comes out :cool:

On a related note, this is why so many of us fell in love with Blackmagic almost 10 years ago now (time flies), because we were finally, finally able to have 85% of ARRI's and RED's image quality for very little money.
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I've thought about the pocket before but things like battery life, lots of data and AF on that camera. The price is really good.
 
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