GH13 GH5 Rumors

[malibudutchie]

I said that in video mode you sometimes have to press record twice,

Never had that problem, not once. Maybe they've given you a dud beta version. And as far as releasing cameras when they're happy with them - when would that be. ?? As we're never happy, why would they be. The minute they release the next model this forum will be crawling with people not "satisfied" with price, bitrate, battery power, LCD, DR, peaking, ND's, etc. Me, I like a $1200 broadcast camera that I can put good glass on and shoot like a demon all day on one batt in different codecs. Could it be better - always.

 

[Cory Braun]

Never had that problem, not once. Maybe they've given you a dud beta version. And as far as releasing cameras when they're happy with them - when would that be. ?? As we're never happy, why would they be. The minute they release the next model this forum will be crawling with people not "satisfied" with price, bitrate, battery power, LCD, DR, peaking, ND's, etc. Me, I like a $1200 broadcast camera that I can put good glass on and shoot like a demon all day on one batt in different codecs. Could it be better - always.

He doesn't have a dud version. When the display info goes away, pressing the record button brings the info back, and doesn't start recording. It's extremely annoying.

 

[malibudutchie]

Does it beep when you hit it onto record ? - does it beep when it doesn't? Do you have that activated to help you know if you're recording. I do, and it's great - double-reassurance. If you can' tell if it's recording by the time the display goes off you're not looking. Also there is a timer on the left that tells you that you're running - do you have that?

 

[Cory Braun]

Does it beep when you hit it onto record ? - does it beep when it doesn't? Do you have that activated to help you know if you're recording. I do, and it's great - double-reassurance. If you can' tell if it's recording by the time the display goes off you're not looking. Also there is a timer on the left that tells you that you're running - do you have that?

That's a great workaround, but it shouldn't be necessary. Unfortunately, as I shoot a lot of b-roll, I can't have my camera beeping. When you press record, the camera should record. Also, the info shouldn't be disappearing if you don't want it to.

 

[malibudutchie]

But it does disappear, so look at your timer. If it's not running it's not recording. Yes, it's a pain, what else can you do? The beep is good for talent, like a tally light, they know it's recording, just like I do.

 

[vtwiz]

But it does disappear, so look at your timer. If it's not running it's not recording. Yes, it's a pain, what else can you do? The beep is good for talent, like a tally light, they know it's recording, just like I do.

I cant believe that your just happy to sit there and accept what your given even though its obviously un acceptable. I never have the 'beep' on as I too shoot a fair bit of B-Roll and cant have the camera beeping away. The simple fact is that when you press record on a camera, recording should start. Why would you defend Panasonic on this and suggest we change the way we work to accommodate their fault? Not only that, but when using an external EVF like my DP4, the red record indicator is so small in the display that it gets lost in the image and sometimes its very hard to see. Just face the fact that we all work in different situations. It might be fine for you to use an audible sound to indicate you are recording but it doesn't for some and shouldn't be required at all if the camera did the simple task of recording when the record button is pressed.

 

[malibudutchie]

There's three functions to tell you you're recording. The red light, the timer and if you want, an audible beep. it's like complaining about focus peaking when there are 5 functions including manual to help you find focus, but that's not enough is it ? Now the red record light is too small - you break me up. I don't defend Panasonic, but this obsession you have with everything that's wrong and nothing that's right is really annoying. Saying a camera is not operationally acceptable is completely wrong. If you can't tell when a camera is recording, that is not a problem with the camera. What do you mean the camera "beeping away" - you hit record, it beeps once to tell you you're on, it don't get much simpler than that. However maybe Panasonic should make a big red dot on the LCD to make it obvious.

 

[Zephyrnoid]

I upgraded from GH2 to GH3 and could not be happier.. 1080p50 all the time.. better battery life, crispier and overall better picture..no brainer

Good. Can you share.....
1) how many Video capable cameras of any type you've owned prior to the GH3?
2) Do you still own the Gh2 or did you resell it. If the Latter, how long did you own it?

 

[vtwiz]

There's three functions to tell you you're recording. The red light, the timer and if you want, an audible beep. it's like complaining about focus peaking when there are 5 functions including manual to help you find focus, but that's not enough is it ? Now the red record light is too small - you break me up. I don't defend Panasonic, but this obsession you have with everything that's wrong and nothing that's right is really annoying. Saying a camera is not operationally acceptable is completely wrong. If you can't tell when a camera is recording, that is not a problem with the camera. What do you mean the camera "beeping away" - you hit record, it beeps once to tell you you're on, it don't get much simpler than that. However maybe Panasonic should make a big red dot on the LCD to make it obvious.

Give it some thought Malibudutchie, Start record=one beep, stop record=2beeps, start record again= 1 beep, stop again =2 beeps. That's how many beeps now? For each clip there is three beeps. so thats already 6 beeps. So not only do I have to turn on the beep function but now I have to keep the camera running so I don't get beeps in the audio track of the A-Cam. The GH3 is dictating my shooting style here. Now, due to the GH3's poor EVF and lack of peaking I use a DP4 EVF. Are you aware that the beep function does not work when using the HDMI out to an EVF? You didn't? You obviously use the camera in a very limited capacity and not discovered its operational short comings or have never filmed under pressure situations, as a self shooter in run&gun situations but ill tell you as someone who has, the unprdictable record button is a major pain in the arse!

i would't be complaining about the red light if the camera just went into record when I hit the record button. I have been in certain situations where I can't get my eye all the way up to the eye piece on my DP4 so am not seeing the extreme edges of the screen. The record indicators that appear on an external EVF via HDMI out are much smaller (tiny) than they appear on the cameras LCD. So small it's kinda commical. Unless you can get your eye all the way up to the EVF then you can't see the on screen indicators. If you ever filmed with an external EVF (which I know you haven't otherwise you would know the beep doesn't work) you would know this and not come across as so arrogant telling me how ridiculous I am. This would all be a non issue if the camera just went into record when I hit record!

Also, you arrogantly said that the 5 focus aids are not enough for me and that i shouldnt want peaking. Can you please tell me how many focusing aids there are to find focus once you start recording? Manual is not a focus finding aid it's the method of focusing. I have already told you why auto is also not an option for me as i don't like the camera guessing what part of the image it thinks i want in focus. You'll find most advanced amatures, semi pros and pros don't like autofocus in video mode. So, back to the question, how many focus aids are there once you start recording? Ill give you a clue.... 5-5=? You could say the EVF itself is a focusing aid but many times I want my focus point to be extreme left or right of frame and the GH3's EVF gets blurry away from the centre no matter how much diopter adjustment and I have perfect 20/20 vision.

Back to the record button: Ask a photographer if it would be acceptable if his or her camera sometimes needed one press of the shutter to take a photo and sometimes two. Seriously, ask all your photo/video colleagues and I bet they ALL say that it's unacceptable.

The annoying one is you. Your lack of knowledge of the camera is really showing through yet you persist on flaming my completely valid points despite your inexperience.

 

[Zephyrnoid]

Yeah, I started my shooting on tube cameras too. It's incredible how far we have come in a relatively short timeframe but the whole world has moved at that pace. Should I be grateful and not complain that the camera I bought has a very poor viewfinder, lacks basic features, and has certain 'features' such as disappearing info that make using it for its intended use very difficult? Should I just say 'oh well, look at how far we've come'?
Panasonic have released a product and marketed it as a hybrid stills/video camera. Video wise, its not up to an acceptable operational standard. I can't believe that when Philip Bloom (or anyone else they gave it to) shot with a pre production version, he would not have flagged the disappearing info with Panasonic if the pre prod camera suffered this same flaw. Maybe they added the feature afterwards and released it to the public without any feedback? Speculation but considering the outcry from users, its hard to believe that the GH3 had much time being tested in its final state as these issues would have arisen within a few minutes use.

I too believe the consumer is now treated as a beta tester and the GH3 not only feels like an incomplete product rushed to market, but Panasonic have themselves admitted it. Why should I be content with that?

I can't believe that when Philip Bloom (or anyone else they gave it to) shot with a pre production version, he would not have flagged the disappearing info with Panasonic if the pre prod camera suffered this same flaw.

Outstanding! Philip Bloom does good work but he's a paid 'shill'. And when you are getting paid high dollar to plug anything, you are not going to highlight the problems.
He lost credibility with me when he allowed Bruce Logan, who directed 'Genesis' to say that the arrest scene was shot available light from street lamps and headlights ONLY and then.... a sharp eye on this forum spotted 1X1LED panel lights hidden in the background to rimlight the characters from a distance. Considering the pompous "Ethics Statement" that Phil makes at the top of >this page< I'd say the team fibbed and withheld a lot about this camera.
Phil. On the Internet, you get caught fibbing.
So all it took was a few weeks after general release for us to ferret out the truth from the fiction. To mark down the misses, near misses, promises and broken promises
I was so appalled by the let-down ( I had funds ready for two bodies) , that I launched a facebook group for sharing details on the GH3 features and samples etc.
I also applied for a Marketing job at Panasonic and unsurprisingly enough, was politely passed over

This hocus pocus stuff should end. I already know that a lot of posters here and in the Blogesphere as well as the Web in general are paid shills- paid to say stuff like
"I upgraded from the XYZ to the XYZ2 and couldn't be happier." (Well. If you're paying for gear with a trust fund- why not, you have nothing to lose right?)
No one is being fooled any more. The G6 is a tiny stepping stone towards the next stepping stone- Panasonic feeling out the crowd.
I'll let you know when the GH series Hybrid is a finished product.

 

[keylight]

Disagree. Look. When the GH3 first got into people hands in what Dec 2012, the first thing that happened was direct comparison to GH2 taking price into consideration. The conclusion? Only worth buying if it's your first M43 and you really need the variable bitrates.

Maybe your conclusion, shared by some, but definitely not shared by a lot of people.

I did another calculation a while ago. there have been 175 Nikon cameras released between 2004 and 2013. In the 1970's - 1980's Nikon gave us a new camera every 5 years and that was proper SLR, no point and shoots existed in the Nikon line.

Your numbers are BS, but you know that. You including the Coolpix line of consumer cameras in your tally of 2004 to 2013, but you exclude the many compact point and shoot film cameras from the 70's and 80's. And you exclude the 1990's entirely, when even more P&S film cameras came out. Remember all the APS film cameras? What about those?

Here's all the SLR film cameras from the 70's and 80's, including consumer, pro-sumer, and professional.



One every 5 years? BULL

And here are all of the DSLR cameras from 2004 - 2013. Note that they're color coded into 3 distinct classes.



They've released cameras as the technology has improved. One look at the professional line, meant for working professional photographers, shows just how baseless your position is:

The D3 came out in 2007. The D4 in 2013. Each was a major advance over the previous. The D3S and D3X were specialized versions geared toward very specific pro markets.

While you're certainly entitled to your opinion, by cherry picking the data you weaken your position and credibility.

EDIT: Let me add that you see the same exact kind of thing with professional video cameras over the years - new gear released as technology advances, to meet the needs of the professional shooter.

 

[keylight]

BS is it?

Would Sony release a video camera where sometimes you press the record button once to record and sometimes you have to press it twice to record? This alone makes the GH3 not fit for purpose. Would the stills guys be happy if they sometimes had to press the shutter button once to take a shot but sometimes had to press it twice. Irrelevant of price, this is a major flaw. A $300 video camera doesn't have this flaw so why does the flagship Panasonic Hybrid Camera? Would professionals be happy if their on screen info disappeared during a take leaving them blind in relation to what their camera was doing? These are two issues that should not be allowed onto a $300 camera let alone a camera like the GH3. When I bought the camera, I did not know of these issues as they are not listed on Panasonics GH3 page. Selling the camera now means I would loose money on it. Why should I have to do that when Panasonic can so easily fix these issues?

The images are great from the GH3 considering the price but I shouldn't have to spend $25K on a C500 like you suggest to get a camera that goes into record the first time I press the record button.

Haven't heard about this problem. Is it with using the large shutter release (when shooting video) or the dedicated video button?

 

[Kevin Lee]

I haven't heard of that issue either. Mine doesn't have that problem.

 

[Mike Lorushe]

Would Sony release a video camera where sometimes you press the record button once to record and sometimes you have to press it twice to record? This alone makes the GH3 not fit for purpose. Would the stills guys be happy if they sometimes had to press the shutter button once to take a shot but sometimes had to press it twice. Irrelevant of price, this is a major flaw. A $300 video camera doesn't have this flaw so why does the flagship Panasonic Hybrid Camera? Would professionals be happy if their on screen info disappeared during a take leaving them blind in relation to what their camera was doing? These are two issues that should not be allowed onto a $300 camera let alone a camera like the GH3. When I bought the camera, I did not know of these issues as they are not listed on Panasonics GH3 page. Selling the camera now means I would loose money on it. Why should I have to do that when Panasonic can so easily fix these issues?

The images are great from the GH3 considering the price but I shouldn't have to spend $25K on a C500 like you suggest to get a camera that goes into record the first time I press the record button.

True, you do sometimes have to hit the record button twice, and it is annoying at times but its hardly a big deal. It's a flaw, but a very minor one. The GH3 isn't perfect, but what camera is? Every camera (and every piece of electronic, digital technology for that matter) I've ever used has had something about it that wasn't perfect. The GH3 certainly has it flaws but they are well within reason. If they wasn't then I would have sold it ages ago and bought another camera. You're analogies are rather flawed and far fetched.

 

[kurth]

No one is being fooled any more. The G6 is a tiny stepping stone towards the next stepping stone- Panasonic feeling out the crowd.
I'll let you know when the GH series Hybrid is a finished product.

...in your humble opinion, what is lacking in the g6 that you think you should get for $750 ? ...or better yet, what is lacking in the bmpcc for a grand that you think they owe us ? Personally, I agree with you somewhat , for example, when it comes to programs or even computers. Enough is enough and I don't want to upgrade another time. But in terms of cameras , I think the progress is amazing in the last 3 years. Maybe you'd do better to get a s16 on ebay . They haven't changed in 25 years !

 

[Jim Simon]

Saying a camera is not operationally acceptable is completely wrong.

I kind of agree that the GH3 isn't "operationally acceptable", at least not for my needs. The disappearing info alone is what kept me from buying it. I can't have that happen. It's just not an acceptable mode of operation for a camera display.

And when you shoot events for a living, a half second can mean the diffrence between getting the shot or losing it forever. The camera needs to start recording on one push every single time, no exceptions. Hell, even the slight delay for writing to the card when I stop recording is too much. I can hit that record button twice, once to stop and once to restart, in a 1/4 second. I'd LOVE for tapeless cameras in general to be that responsive.

And for a professional to have his camera beep every time it enters or exits record mode is just...amateur.

 

[Jim Simon]

what is lacking in the bmpcc for a grand that you think they owe us ?

10 bit 4:2:2 DNxHD in an MXF OP1a wrapper containing video, audio, timecode and metadata without a 'folder structure'.

 

[kurth]

10 bit 4:2:2 DNxHD in an MXF OP1a wrapper containing video, audio, timecode and metadata without a 'folder structure'.

prores converts in avid ...gee that was easy !

 

[stoneinapond]

....The disappearing info alone is what kept me from buying it. I can't have that happen. It's just not an acceptable mode of operation for a camera display.

And when you shoot events for a living, a half second can mean the diffrence between getting the shot or losing it forever.

So, as the consummate professional, what camera are you using?

 

[vtwiz]

True, you do sometimes have to hit the record button twice, and it is annoying at times but its hardly a big deal.

What kind of shooting do you do? I agree that if you only shoot narrative or sit down interviews then it's not a big deal but I also do quite a bit of documentary work where sometimes you only get one chance to get the shot. Often, its just me and a producer so having to think about shot composition, audio levels, exposure etc is enough of a task let alone having to think about pressing the record button twice. Hell, maybe if you always had to press record twice it would be better as it would be consistent and I would learn to always press record twice but the way it is now if I press record twice every time just to be sure its recording then sometimes it records and sometimes it records and stops.

It's a flaw, but a very minor one. The GH3 isn't perfect, but what camera is?

When you break it down to its most simplest, what is the BASIC function of a video camera? To record images and sounds when the user presses record. I'm not asking for the perfect camera but the GH3 fails at its most basic requirement. what if you had to press the record button three times?Would that still be be acceptable? 4 times?

TYou're analogies are rather flawed and far fetched.

I earn my living from my work. My reputation is everything for ensuring on going work. My 'far fetch analogies' are in fact real world experiences that I experience every day with this camera. I'm not making this sh1t up! I have missed shots because the camera did not record when i asked it to. How can you be the judge and say that my real world experiences are flawed or far fetched?

Now, when I was using the 5D II, I knew that it was a stills camera first and foremost. I knew that as a video camera it had its quirks but to Canons credit, many of them were rectified with firmware updates. I accepted it for what it was.

The GH3 on the other hand is marketed as a video camera as much as stills. With the great images it produces, TC, good codec options and frame rates that's fair enough. What was not known to me when I decided to leave Canon and go to the GH3 was these major flaws with the camera. So, with the information I had, I thought I had chosen the best camera for the job. While I did have a quick play with the camera before I used it, i didn't think of trying to leave the camera for 10 seconds and then pressing the record button to see if it worked because in my 20 years as a camera operator I have never come across a camera that fails at its most basic task or has this unacceptable 'quirk'.

Lets also remember that the record button issue is a very easy firmware fix for Panasonic. I know that for a fact! Why shouldn't I want it fixed?

again, just because you may only shoot student narrative films with the GH3 it doesn't mean you have the right to assume that other people's real world experiences are any less than yours or not important.