C300: Canon C300 mkII

DLD said:
The innate 8K will probably be for the special events only. (OK, Apple is allegedly getting ready to release a 27" 8K monitor for one of its flagship pro systems ... at about 330 PPI, it'd still be lower than the 557 PPI screen from a new Samsung smart phone ... with no 8K sources, this will need a massive upscale, which is what likely to happen with the consumer grade TV's, as they ramp up their pixel count also)...
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So, to amend my own post - some new smartphone (I think iPhone, but who cares by this point) that will be announced in two weeks time will have a UHD resolution on an approximately 5" screen for 778 Pixels per Inch.

Ah, ya, 8K can't get here fast enough.

PS. 778 PPI on a 55" 16x9 screen will have ~ 850,000,000 pixels, more than 32K.
 
I'm sure it will be a fantastic camera!
Was still hoping it was more of a competitor to the FS7......Obviously not the case (and regardless of pricing... FS7 vs C100ii isn't even close). Disappointing... I see an FS7 in my near future!
 
alohype said:
+1
If everything what Canon is claiming will be true I see it like this: Alexa mini minus prores plus run n gun aids (AF, weather sealing) for the quarter of the price.
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Alexa mini shoots 200fps and is, well, an ARRI Alexa. It is in a different market with superior specs in every facette.

My main gripe is the fps-limitation. Almost EVERY shoot that is not dialogue alone has some shot that is over/undercranked (in musicvideos, commercials, sports, docs). Even the iPhone and GoPro shoot 120fps. Clients demand more than that, because "they have that at home".
100fps in HD is not a lot anymore. It is below any standard for a cam for that price. The question will be: can Canon open features like this up later like Sony does with the F5 or can´t they? My guess is Canon will bring a new C500 for 25k and will add 120fps in 4K and 240fps in 2K there. And leave us C300 users out in the dry. Again.
 
At least you won't need an adapter for all the Canon glass (ef version) it supports the newer STM lenses too. :happy:
MX-AVC 2K 12bit 4:4:4 without needing prores is a nice feature too, especially for those of us editing on Windows. (using the MXF wrapper).
 
alpi69 said:
Alexa mini shoots 200fps and is, well, an ARRI Alexa. It is in a different market with superior specs in every facette.

My main gripe is the fps-limitation. Almost EVERY shoot that is not dialogue alone has some shot that is over/undercranked
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Completely agree.. If this is the best Canon could muster, sony(and a slew of other boutique cameras) will wipe the floor with them over the next 1-3 years in the fps market. Although I will admit the mk I didn't need fps to gain its popularity with the rental/operator market. The mk ii seems to offer high speed but only in a "cropped" mode, wonder how the image quality compares vs non cropped. Also curious as to the the internal HD quality vs its 4k, hopefully see some examples in a few days.
 
LeoGrey said:
Completely agree.. If this is the best Canon could muster, sony(and a slew of other boutique cameras) will wipe the floor with them over the next 1-3 years in the fps market.
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Since Canon isn't even IN the "fps market" I would wager that you're right.

//Canon provides high and slow frame rates to cover many situations, but I wouldn't say that they are in the spec race. At all. They are not aiming to be high fps cameras.

LeoGrey said:
The mk ii seems to offer high speed but only in a "cropped" mode, wonder how the image quality compares vs non cropped.
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Admittedly, this is only speculation on my part: but since it is a cropped mode I'm guessing it is pixel for pixel without any tricks. I expect the 2k 120 fps mode to be full quality, albeit with a crop factor.
 
Not to be too critical, but have you picked up an Ursa? Its a tank of a camera. Black magic from what I can see is following in Red's footsteps by releasing cameras that are minimally functional and then rolling out firmware updates over time to correct deficiencies. If that's what you want in a camera, then by all means buy a Black magic.
 
Mark Smith said:
Not to be too critical, but have you picked up an Ursa? Its a tank of a camera. Black magic from what I can see is following in Red's footsteps by releasing cameras that are minimally functional and then rolling out firmware updates over time to correct deficiencies. If that's what you want in a camera, then by all means buy a Black magic.
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In all honesty I have yet to read a negative review of the URSA. In fact, all the negativity I do read seems to come from people that have never operated one. The weight doesn't really turn me off(even a rigged c100 approaches the 10lb area) it's the 12 stops, poor low light, no ND filters and hungry power draw. If you had clicked the link you would see he is referring to an URSA mini with 15+ stops of dynamic range.. I don't care what brand you prefer, an URSA mini with beefed up specs is sure to raise some eyebrows. Exciting times!
 
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There was a time in my life, when I used to eagerly listen and believe in hype and join start-ups. I had laughed at no-nonsense companies that had assured me conservative amounts as salary. Once you become wiser by such life experiences, you realise that you can't bank upon such big talk (read specs). If you have to make money with the camera, then the camera has to work anytime and everytime starting from day one.

Some of the posters here have talked about high frame rates available even in iphone and go pro. I do have a Go Pro 4. Do I use the high frame rates of it instead of shooting with C300? For assignments I use C300. The quality of the C300 files, even in high frame rates are consistent. Canon doesn't give you lower quality when shooting in high frame rates. The specs that you see in the C300 Mark II will be of use to you in professional environments.

For wildlife, I am happy with the 2K crop mode at 100/120fps, as that will give me higher reach ie for distant subjects when my longest telephoto is still not frame filling, and there is nice action, I can employ the 2K 100 fps (in PAL) in the crop mode.

I like the fact that there are many buttons in C300 Mark II so that one doesn't need to dive into the menus. It is a big time saver to have buttons. In shooting situations, this is a big plus point which people don't realise.

There is no single ideal camera which is the best for every situation. Our needs and wants and aspirations are different. If the critical basic shooting needs are covered and it makes business sense then buy the camera. Else hire it when it is required. We are not camera collectors, nor can we buy every camera in the market. Buy the camera which will take care of your maximum needs.

I feel the C300 Mark II will be one of the most used cameras not just for broadcast but for narratives as well. For a 4-5 week shoot, if you need high fps for 2-3 days, then hire a phantom or a dragon or whatever to shoot the high fps stuff and for the rest, the C300 II will be good. It will save the project budget. Producers will love it.
 
If URSA Mini is priced at $3000, as been reported, then it'll target the entirely different niche from C300 MK II (which, I agree with indiawilds' post above, will soon be very ubiquitous).

But, presuming it's reliable and quirk free off the bat, URSA Mini will definitely squeeze the sub-$10,000 camera market and thus will effect C100 MK II a lot more. Throw in whatever Panasonic conjures up and Canon might be forced to fill in that $4,000-$10,000 gap too.
 
It isn't about what price range it fits, it's about the camera's capabilities. The C100 is a 1080 camera, with a nice, but limited codec.
The Mini Ursa is a 4.6k camera that shoots raw and ProRes and has 15 stops of DR, so it's specced considerably beyond the C100 and sits righting the wheelhouse of the C300
 
Blackmagic has no track record of great cameras yet, but I'll give them the benefit of a doubt.

As a camera company they've made a couple of valuable experiences. Hopefully they've learned something. And since they are giving me DaVinci Resolve Lite for free and can't not like them.

I don't expect anything of the new announcements but I'll dismiss the cameras AFTER we've seen some tests and reviews. The new specs for URSA Mini might point to the new v2 sensor that was mentioned in the latest URSA firmware update? I guess that sensor will land in the main URSA as well then.

These new v2 URSAs probably won't have the world's greatest low light performance, but if they can deliver cinematic images in reasonable light for $3000-6000, they will be a great option for 'out of school' up and coming film makers. I'd even wager that category would absolutely love to have a beefier camera with displays and blinking lights here and there.
 
My god, this last weeks of pre-nab its like a crazy gears/tech drug addiction ! lock those visa and master cards and let the hangover pass before making any pre-orders...
 
If there was ever a camera that needed to have a mini version it is the Ursa. Black Magic makes some interesting products but they struggle when it comes to cameras. It took them about a year after the BMPC was released to actually go through enough firmware updates to make the camera useful. The 4K cinema camera was cheap and pretty much a clinker. Black magic sells "cheap' that's their whole deal. Cheap comes with a lot of compromises and if you choose to go that way that's just fine.
 
Mark Smith said:
Cheap comes with a lot of compromises and if you choose to go that way that's just fine.
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Well, I look at it this way:

With a very cheap product, realistically, you won't get "all the features". But it can very well be that if the cheap product only includes a small subset of commonly asked for features, but those features are all you need, you can get a great deal.

My main concern is that they list features as part of the camera specification—and then fail to deliver on those. THAT will erode reputation quickly. It's not OK to say the camera will do one thing, and then deal with a year of forum frustration and grief before you get 70% there via firmware updates...

So. the URSA Mini should deliver: HD internal and UHD external up to 60fps with a S35 format and 15 stops of DR. After it's been actually launched its easier to see what it is with more complete specs.
 
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I've never shot with a BMD camera. But a friend used one for his indie film and lost years off of his life from the stress of the camera constantly locking up, breaking, battery and audio problems. BMD replaced the camera FOUR TIMES and all four cameras had different problems. No thanks. Maybe someday BMD cameras might approach the big three for reliability. Say what you want about specs but my C100 just works. It doesn't do weird, cryptic things for no reason. Same with every Panasonic and Sony I have ever owned or rented, they just work. BMD, Aja are not camera companies, they are editing gear companies that have branched out into cameras. Give them five or ten years, then they may have their act together.
 
jimagine said:
It isn't about what price range it fits, it's about the camera's capabilities. The C100 is a 1080 camera, with a nice, but limited codec.

The Mini Ursa is a 4.6k camera that shoots raw and ProRes and has 15 stops of DR, so it's specced considerably beyond the C100 and sits righting the wheelhouse of the C300
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People won't drop C300 MK II for URSA Mini ... but some folks will take gorgeous looking clips with either or both of these cams.

For the budgeted endeavors, URSA Mini is unlikely to be more than a B-cam. Yet, if BMD uses this opportunity and produces a camera without its typical unusual quirks, shooters will get used to seeing them on sets that used to only welcome the high end $50,000+ models.

Of course, upping the ante on the top of the line, Red has announced an 8K camera and you'd figure that Sony won't be far behind.
 
Thanks BMD!!! I`m looking forward to not hearing anymore how the FS7 offers so much more over the C300MII;)
I got mixed up in that BMPCC sale hype, ordered one, waited for three months, without knowing if orders would be fulfilled , finally got one, used it one time on a pro-bono music video, never used it again.
BUT I knew I was getting the Pocket just for fun, because, well look at it.
The URSAmini could make sense for a lot of productions, that would normally opt for shooting on a DSLR. It could also impact FS7 sales much more than C300II sales...
 
puredrifting said:
I've never shot with a BMD camera. But a friend used one for his indie film and lost years off of his life from the stress of the camera constantly locking up, breaking, battery and audio problems. BMD replaced the camera FOUR TIMES and all four cameras had different problems. No thanks. Maybe someday BMD cameras might approach the big three for reliability. Say what you want about specs but my C100 just works. It doesn't do weird, cryptic things for no reason. Same with every Panasonic and Sony I have ever owned or rented, they just work. BMD, Aja are not camera companies, they are editing gear companies that have branched out into cameras. Give them five or ten years, then they may have their act together.
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Well said.
 
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