Camera choice, waiting for the A7RII vs A7II now vs GH4 vs D810

D

Disambiguous66

Member
NOTE-- I posted a similar message on the GH4 forum, but this one is worded differently and I'm sure will get a different set of opinions because of the different knowledge base of the readers, so it is not really a cross-post.

I'm in the midst of shooting a very large job with close to 100 locations/scenes required. For the interviews and those that require set-up and lighting, and where I have more time, I use the Sony FS700. However, there are lots of situations where a quick run-through with a good camera on a one-handed gimbal will work well. I also have another job coming up in the fall with similar requirements, with the additional factor of lots of air travel and extremely limited luggage space and weight.

Currently for still shooting I am Nikon-based, though I haven't updated my still cameras for a few years.

It would be nice to have the new camera be 4K capable. Though I have not had any call for 4K yet, it's nice to be able to shoot in the higher resolution and then downsize.

The ideal solution would be the new Sony A7RII, except for the fact that I need something by next week and that camera won't be out until August. Also, the GH4 is about half the price of both the A7RII and D810, and the A7II is only a couple hundred dollars more than the GH4.

One reason I'm considering the GH4 is that it is light and compact, there are several one-handed gimbals that work for it, and also because it does 4K. I have not used a GH4 yet, but I have seen a lot of sample footage and there are a lot of DPs I respect who use it. Also, I'm a fairly capable drone pilot, and when I upgrade to a 6-rotor there are several solutions for mounting the GH4.

The Sony A7 series, on the other hand, is only a couple of ounces heavier than the GH4, and there is that wonderful, massive FF sensor.

As you can tell I'm no fanboy, I'll use whatever brand fills the need. However, one reason to choose the D810 is because I already have a lot of excellent glass to go along with it. The reasons why I would consider the GH4 versus the D810 are the ability to fit on a one-handed gimbal and 4K capability. The Sony A7 series will also fit on one-handed gimbals, plus I have a couple of lenses that fit the E-mount now (for use on the FS700) and E-mount adapters for my Nikon lenses. With many of my lenses the D810 would exceed the 1kg (or lighter) limit of most of the one-handed gimbals.

Since I like to use selective focus for much of my stills work, I would probably not use the GH4 for stills too often. It would probably be used solely for video. Most of my stills jobs are headshots and macro fine-art, for which the 42MB FF sensor of the A7RII would be outstanding.

It has also crossed my mind to get the Sony A7II (not the R, the A7II model is out now) for a little more cost than the GH4, and then upgrade when the A7RII comes out later. It can at least shoot Hi-Def, which will suffice for the current job.

If anyone has any cogent thoughts on how the A7 series would work in this type of situation, I'd be obliged to hear them. And if anybody knows how to get Sony to lend me a pre-production unit for a couple of months, that would be very nice indeed! Many thanks for all input.
 
These cameras have completely different image quality. The Panasonics are usually sharper (e.g. GH4 with internal 4K) but have very limited DR. The Sonys have great DR, but only the a7R II offers internal 4K.

In any case, I think the NX1 beats the GH4 in absolutely every way, except post workflow: it's even sharper, has much less noise, and a lot more DR (though not as much as the Sonys), but requires a transcode because current edit software can't take H.265. So I'd be choosing between the NX1 and the a7S.

The a7II, AFAIK, has aliasing/moire, so I'd pass on that one unless you absolutely need the IBIS.
 
The best option seems to be a RockyMountain transcode to H.264, then, if your PC doesn't work fine with that at 4K, from H.264 to ProRes with something like FCPX or PP. The reason for the H.264 intermediate step is that RockyMountain is pretty bad at encoding ProRes.

Whether you lose something in this process is actually irrelevant, since you can't do anything with the H.265 footage except press play: it doesn't load into any editor AFAIK.

In any case, my main point is that the answer depends on whether you are resolution-obsessed or DR-obsessed, and how many hoops you're ready to jump through. Cameras are so good now that it's a very personal decision, there's no longer a king of the hill like the 5D2 was.
 
Supposedly, Windows 10 and the related editing suites will all be able to play with H265 quite nicely. If a camera purchase is long-term, that is something to keep in mind.
 
Maybe the Nikon D750 would be another option if you are already considering the D810.
Less expensive and great autofocus.
 
DLD definitely has a great point -- barring unforseen incompatibility/bug issues and other Windows 10 fun -- editing on PC and using Adobe software you might have zero H.265 issues at the end of this year (what is the OSX situation?). I don't say that sarcastically either, I'm excited. It should be very easy for Adobe to update CC to make it friendly with the new codec, having OS support bult-in.
And Sam is spot on, for a lot of shooters looking seriously at the GH4, the NX-1 has significantly more bang-for-buck! NX-1 shows Samsung is eager to compete and offer serious video cameras. The NX-2 or an ILC dedicated video camera is really going to be interesting to see.
 
hojomo said:
DLD definitely has a great point -- barring unforseen incompatibility/bug issues and other Windows 10 fun -- editing on PC and using Adobe software you might have zero H.265 issues at the end of this year (what is the OSX situation?)...
Click to expand...
Officially, July, 29th for Windows 10. One has to think that all the associated third party editing suites will be compatible (more or less) instantly, as M-soft must have given everyone sufficient lead-up time to get ready for this.
 
I wouldn't be *that* optimistic about H.265 support on editors with W10. I still think Adobe and the others will have to change something in their code to make it work, and sometimes they take relatively long, even for things that look simple from the outside. I would give it a 50/50 chance at best. Much more likely three months later.
 
I'm with Samuel, unless something specifically about the sonys or the panasonics jumps out as a 'must need' thing, the nx1 is a fantastic choice. compact, 4k, and h265 is a codec that will only get easier to use... though maybe for now it's a hassle. DR is respectable and it's sharp (internal processing gets rid of chromatic aberration as well it would seem), and the s35 sensor packs enough MP to yield good stills as well. so unless you need a FF low light monster or have a stockpile of m4/3 glass, thats my vote as well.
 
Investing in new system, glass, and workflow seems a little counterproductive.
I own a GH4 and im massively happy with the camera, controls are all where I need them and the massive amount of bells and whistles beats almost any sub $2000 camera on the market.
E-Shutter so I can do time lapse without up my mechanical shutter, speed adaptors to use almost any glass, continuous recording, 96fps, internal 4k, RAW HDMI, small light package.
My only complaint is that the lowlight isn't good, which I work around using a speed adaptor and a couple of primes.

My friend has the Sony, and loves it. But the controls are a little hard to use, especially since you'll have to do a lot of menu diving. But the lowlight is killer and with a speed adapter you can use Canon glass almost like its native Sony glass. And you have the Full Frame look.
Im unsure about the NX1, since its so new to the market. My worry would be about camera controls (loads of menu diving?), glass, and workflow. Image seems great, no doubt... Oh! and almost forgot, you have to charge it via USB!!?! (The NX1 seems more like a photo camera with video added on)

But all 3 cameras perform amazingly, and at 4K you'll be hard pressed to tell the difference.
Personally, id rent a camera and wait for the new Sony.
 
OK, new possibility. The CyberShot DSC-RX100 IV is due out this Friday. I can wait until then to get it. It's just under $1000, has a 1" sensor, does internal 4K with S Log2, and slo-mo up to 960 FPS. Except for the sensor size, it looks like the GH4 at about half the price, plus the slo-mo. However, the lens is not interchangeable, though the zoom looks like it would take care of most of my needs.

Since it has not been released yet I can't find any video samples. Any thoughts?
 
What kinda job you doing? Does the job pay well?
Are we looking at the same camera? The RX100 in no way looks like the GH4.
If you walk onto any respectable job with that camera the probably won't take you seriously. Yes it's got nice specs, but that's where it ends...
you can pick up a GH4 for under $1500, and a Sony under $2000. What I'm getting at, how much work do you foresee yourself doing with this camera? $1k is still a bit of money. Are you needing more then 60fps?
Your FS700 does pretty good slow motion for the high end, and the GH4 does 96fps at 1080. The Sony does 720/120fps... Heck a GoPro will make do in most situations.
 
The RX100 IV shoots slog2, so it should have a lot more DR than the GH4. And the slowmo is really sweet: seems super fine at up to 240 fps, and usable at 480 fps. It's not the perfect camera for me by far (I love my glass) but I may get one for the N4000, for slowmo, and for those times when I know I won't be carrying anything that can't go in a pocket.

There are some samples online, check this thread, and also this one because the sensor and processor seem to be the same in the RX10 II.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top