Avatar - James Cameron Returns! (Spoilers in thread, obviously!)

I'm sorry, but I'm gonna go ahead and disagree with the sentiment about the digital animation here. Even from the 1080p file you can tell it's outright incredible and pretty damned seamless. I can't imagine how mind-numbing it must look in 3-D if it looks this sick in 2D @ 46".

I remember my first big "holy crap" in CGI was Squaresoft's (now Square-Enix) Final Fantasy: Spirits Within. That was a good nine to ten years ago and they've come a long way. Avatar looks like the next CGI Holy Crap to me. Being out-and-out CGI and less CGI with composited assets.

Wish I would have gone to see the fifteen minute sneak peek but it looks surreal.

Addenum: This is probably the first movie I'll make sure I see Digitally Projected. No old screens or anything like that.
 
I haven't seen the big preview (15 minutes one), but did see a trailer prior to Inglorious Basterds. It really didn't click, for me.

Fellow dvxuser Brian Parker summed it up well: It just doesn't feel anything special. We've seen this all before, maybe less crafted, in movies like Beowulf and Final Fantasy. But my main concern here is not the CGI, since I really enjoyed Beowulf, for example, but the story. The premise doesn't captivate me at all. 3d? I have to say I'm one of those that think that 3d is just another fad, something that really doesn't add much to the storytelling process. What 3d gives to producers and directors is the pressure of creating countless chase sequences and "Boo" moments to stick something at you. This will easily become repetitive. 3d is a bit like the Nintendo Wii: something that will be huge in the short therm for novelty reasons, but then, when 3d movies start repeating the same tricks again and again, become more of a nuissance.

I don't see a problem of a realistic CGI approach, as long as there's a point to it- something that really helps on the storytelling. It worked for Beowulf, and also for Final Fantasy- I'm one of the few that liked that movie. Its a good vehicle for fantasy/fiction films. But I have to agree that the most remarkable CGI animated films have come from Pixar- I hope they continue to push the envelope not only with the animation but with the risk on their storytelling. Up and Wall-E are modern classics that will survive the test of time. I hope Toy Story 3 really continues this trend, and not become merelly a cash making machine with cheap 3d trills and a bland fan service storyline... For that, go straight to DVD- Blu-ray!
 
Part of what's impressed me since the earliest test-footage is the degree to which this isn't just about boo-stuff-flying-at-you-from-the-screen.

So far there's been comparatively little exploitation of the cheap stuff-coming-out-of-the-screen-just-for-the-sake-of-it. For the most part the effect is more akin to the screen surface falling away, creating the sense of looking into the environment of the film, rather than at it.
 
How long did it take Cameron to make this thing? 15 years? The trailer is very disappointing. Did anyone say Micheal Cimino?

I hope I eat my words when I watch the film in its entirety.
 
i saw the 15 min screening and it looks great. not sure about the story. but it is technically brilliant.
 
Sprocketboy said:
How long did it take Cameron to make this thing? 15 years? The trailer is very disappointing. Did anyone say Micheal Cimino?
Click to expand...

Can you show me any CG characters that are coming even close to these shown in Avatar? I don't think so. Then you know why it took so long. Also it didn't take him 15 years to complete.

spidey said:
i saw the 15 min screening and it looks great. not sure about the story. but it is technically brilliant.
Click to expand...

Word!
 
Simon Höfer said:
Can you show me any CG characters that are coming even close to these shown in Avatar? I don't think so.
Click to expand...

i think the best i've scene is this, in terms of being photo real...
davyjones_l.jpg


what are you doing in HK?
 
Although there's a degree of cheatfulness there, in that almost everyone has a firm handle on what a regular human being looks like - making regular human beings a particular challenge to sell, as digital characters - while really no one has any first-hand experience with guys who have octopi for heads, making Davey Jones a bit easier to sell...
 
Zak Forsman said:
i think the best i've scene is this, in terms of being photo real...
davyjones_l.jpg
Click to expand...

What parts exactly are CG on this? Everything? Also, is there a person under a costume somewhere? Or is the complete character CG?

And as Sad max mentioned. It is not a normal human being. Neither are the avatar creatures, but they are close.


Zak Forsman said:
what are you doing in HK?
Click to expand...

I'm writing my diploma thesis here in Hong Kong. I'm developing performance tests for HDTVs in a german testing company.

And I am also planning to shoot a Monster Fest entry on my new GH1 here :) Meeting with another DVXuser member on thursday for preproduction.
 
Ok, I read about Davy Jones. Mighty impressive, I didn't know that.

But I still think that Avatar is a major accomplishment.

In Pirates the "actor" was still in the filmed scene. Whereas in Avatar you've got the entire movement in complete 3D, not just from one angle.

FromRealToReal.jpg


Also the clothing on Davy is hiding alot. Whereas in Avatar the characters are almost naked, which is much more complicated.

I think both are really impressive. Both in different ways. Also I can only tell you about my impressions I had in the IMAX theater and I thought it was just amazing, but I also said it didn't look 100% realistic in one of my earlier posts. It looks too smooth.
 
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAhahahahahahahahaha!!!!! It's like they totally missed the point that the comparisons were to illustrate a possible shortcoming, not praise.
 
Doesn't seem like they have much to stand on plot wise. Not sure they can be sued based just on image similarity...I saw the Avatar trailer in the theater, on 35mm film. The CGI did look marginally better. Maybe the final renders will push the quality even further, although I'm sure some of those shots represent the final versions...I always wondered if somewhere down the line people will start rerendering old CGI effects and market the films as new & improved. If the data still existed, I wonder how hard and costly it would be to reload, improve the textures and animation and re-output.
 
Sad Max said:
Part of what's impressed me since the earliest test-footage is the degree to which this isn't just about boo-stuff-flying-at-you-from-the-screen.

So far there's been comparatively little exploitation of the cheap stuff-coming-out-of-the-screen-just-for-the-sake-of-it. For the most part the effect is more akin to the screen surface falling away, creating the sense of looking into the environment of the film, rather than at it.
Click to expand...


This is exactly what I'm seeing in the 1080 version of the trailer. It's really friggin' immersive even in a 2D arena, I can only imagine it surrounding you in an IMAX theater.
 
Ah, the things you can find on the internet! James Cameron's first film, Xenogenesis...How's this for photo real effects?

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8786521104625863614

Wow! Almost every single idea Cameron ever had is contained in this film -- A kickass heroine, terminating robots, humanoid machines, someone fighting a much larger foe in an exo-skeleton...
 
Last edited:
Weirdly enough, the opening shot...is compositionally the marines' first view of the alien nest, in Aliens.

Wacky.
 
Thanks for the link Batutta. A lot of stuff I've already read about him, but a very well written article though. I had fun reading it. It's not something I'd ever relish saying to someone myself, and I wouldn't want to be on the receiving end of it, but some of the quotes of him ragging on his crew were priceless:

"Watching him light is like watching two monkeys **** a football.

"Hiring you is like firing two good men."

Of course, maybe he wasn't serious and these are totally out of context. Still hilarious though. Maybe Sad Max can chime in and tell us if he experienced the Wrath of Jim when he worked on Avatar.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top