Is it normal for 24P CINEMA to have a lot more moire,aliasing than 1080i, this is what i found testing the setting on my GH2,although i have not yet edited and properly watched any 24P, while recording moire/alising showed terrible in the lcd/vf in 24P mode compared to 1080i mode.
24p cinema
- Thread starter flinty
- Start date
awelgraven
Well-known member
I don't know if you can trust the tiny LCD to show you what aliasing or moire you've recorded. Try looking it at it at 100% on a monitor.
Bane
Active member
Ian-T is correct, when I first got my GH2 I was flipping at how much aliasing the camera was showing and I even thought I had a lemon, but after I put everything through my NLE I was speechless at the quality, so no, don't trust the junk LCD, EVF looks better if you are trying to play the footage on the camera and the outcome is even better.
Thank you very much for the responces,i have not got around to start editing or watching proper yet as i was tired and leaving till tomorrow but i can not understand how it can be different in as much as if the aliasing shows far worse on the viewfinder/lcd in 24P than 1080i it will not show worse on tv or pcs.tomorrow i will know.thanks
well i have now been and tested some of the footage on my 1080P tv and i find the 24p footage still has worse moire/aliasing than 1080i but it is bad on both far worse than i expected from these GH2s,if railings are in the film shots they show as continualy shimmering and moving together and brickwork shimmers, even my canon was not as bad,i was not using a tripod but a brace,is it the lack of 25p i wonder.
NLE is that different from standard editing will that help .
NLE is that different from standard editing will that help .
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJAeQfledmI
The only thing that the render altered was the shimmer on the blue car at 1m-11s on clip 5
The only thing that the render altered was the shimmer on the blue car at 1m-11s on clip 5
Pietro Impagliazzo
Well-known member
When I see a lot of aliasing I switch to MF and use the focus assist. 100% alias-free everytime.
What film mode are you using? And what is your Sharpness set to? Also, are you shooting that with the 14-140 kit lens?
That's much more aliasing than I'm used to seeing from a GH1 or GH2. My guess is maybe you have Sharpness set too high and that's causing the problem.
That's much more aliasing than I'm used to seeing from a GH1 or GH2. My guess is maybe you have Sharpness set too high and that's causing the problem.
Pietro Impagliazzo
Well-known member
Note that 0 means low sharpening while 2 is high sharpening. You need to turn sharpening to -2, that means it's turned off (or at least a very small amount, we have no idea how the unprocessed image from the sensor looks like).
yes 0 is centre and if the GH2 needs to be set at the lowest setting that is something i have never done with any of my many cams or canon DSLRs.The canon i had was at 0 or plus 1 most of the time with little moire/aliasing, i will stick with 1080i that is acceptable,thanks for the info.
Flinty, I'd be curious to see that same footage on your Canon with no aliasing. Whenever I've seen Canon footage with any kind of detail evident in closely spaced lines, I've seen plenty of aliasing. It's odd that the GH2, which is known for having less aliasing & moire than any other DSLR on the market, is behaving worse in that respect than your Canon. Of course the GH2 provides more detail than the Canon is capable of and that's one variable that has to be considered.
It may be worth it in shots where moire may appear (like shots with brick walls) to dial down the sharpness to -2. I've shot everything on the GH1 and GH2 with Sharpness at -2. I have noticed the kit lens seems to cause more aliasing and moire than, say, an old Nikon prime. So your combination of kit lens and Sharpness at 0 with brick walls seems logical to be showing moire. Shoot a test with Sharpness at -2, just to see if it makes a difference. You can stick with 1080i, but you're sacrificing the 24mbps benefit the GH2 has when set to 24p.
I believe when you use MF adjust the LCD image acts sort of like the teleconversion mode, it's basically showing a 1:1 crop so there would be no aliasing. To me it's very interesting how the LCD works when showing a preview of the video, it's as if it's using a 2nd scanning mode to generate the preview instead of taking a downsampled version of the video coming off the sensor.
Ken7 you will have to take my word about my canon which i had a refund for because i had two that deveoped a slight sound problem the second after 7 months,i decided on a gh2 after the reports,if i can find similar footage i will show it,dvbrother i will try the lower setting but stick with 1080i i dont think i will ever like the 24P jitter like movement i like 25P,
the clips i showed were with MF,at this time there are no funds for more lenses and most of the time the 14-140mm suits me fine.thanks a lot
the clips i showed were with MF,at this time there are no funds for more lenses and most of the time the 14-140mm suits me fine.thanks a lot
Ian-T
Veteran
Surely you still have the raw file from that shot for us to look at? It's hard for me to believe those shots are @ "0" sharpening. That looks more like +2 sharpening 2 me. But I agree with folks...you should dial these camera's sharpness all the way down. They are not Canons.. I had a Canon also...and "0" sharpening always produces aliasing/color moire. I tried to convince myself that it was not a problem....but no dice.
