FS7: You've Got a Decent Budget, So Which Lens Do You Get?

Joshua Milligan said:
Hey Run&Gun, thanks for your response. It’s not the price of the 20-120 that worries me, it’s the weight. I’m unsure of how I’ll like working with a 6.5 pound lens everyday.
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She's definitely a little piggy. I've never used it on a camera as light as an Fs7. My client that has one, it's usually on one of their Amira's, so it does balance out decently with a big body with a brick on the back and the ability to slide move the body way back on the shoulder mount to get it balanced.

It's actually just as heavy as the 17-120, but in my opinion, it is much better balanced than the Canon.
 
Joshua Milligan said:
How are people powering the servo grip on the 20-120 Fujinon when using a camera like the FS7? Can you power it with simply a FS7 battery that has D-Tap out? Or do you need V-Lock batteries to do it? If that's the case, then would it make more sense to get the 20-120 without the Servo grip and instead pick up the Chrosziel motor and use the FS7's handgrip to control the lens? The Chrosziel motor can be powered with a FS7 battery that has D-Tap ports and the overall cost would be about $2,000 less.

I'm also curious if the FS7II's newly designed locking E-mount can handle the weight of the Fujinon 20-120 without the need for lens support. It's definitely a stronger mount, but I'm not sure what's too much weight for it. I'd love to be able to run it without lens support so that I can keep my overall rig size to a minimum.
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I have some friends with the Chrosziel units on their MK's, but I don't know how they perform compared to the Fuji native servo's/grip. Personally, I'd stick with the Fuji grip/servo solution.

The lenses don't really pull that much juice and one of the BP-U batteries with a Power-tap out should be sufficient, but a brick is going to balance it out much better.

I would not trust or subject the E-mount to that kind of weight/torque/stress. The 20-120 is PL mount only, so you would have a PL adapter on the E-mount and then the lens, which would move it even farther out, resulting in even more torque/stress on the mount. Even with the "native" PL mount on my F55, I support my 17-120. In an effort to save weight out in front of the camera, with an already heavy lens, I switched my rods to the new Bright Tangerine Titanium rods a few months ago, from the aluminum ones I was running. They're as light as carbon fiber and as strong as steel. I was surprised at how light they really are. You don't get it until you actually pick them up. I didn't run CF rods, because I run a grip near the end of the lens and I was afraid all of that torque would possibly break/splinter them while I was shooting. You don't really want ~$60K worth of camera and lens to go crashing to the ground off of your shoulder.
 
I'm using the following cables, see down below. Can be 12 pin or D Tap. Somehow I ended up with both. If you have the CA back you can power from a 12 pin Hirose output on that. I have a Hawke Woods wireless mic plate that has four switched 12 volt 12 pin Hirose outputs that can also drive 12 pin lenses. You can of course get IDX BPU style batteries that have D Tap output so you could power the lens from one of those. For what it's worth just be aware of the earlier Chrosziel servo controls. They had a recall on a bunch of them because they were frying the FS7's Lanc port. Hunt on the web and you will find some very unhappy shooters who experienced these burnouts. Expensive! I believe that problem has been rectified.

These CAMEO cables are dual purpose. They power the lens plus they allow stop/start of the camera from the lens servo hand grip stop/start button. There is a Lanc cable 'Y' split that plugs into the existing Lanc port on the FS7. Also all works well if using a servo zoom demand on a tripod. All very useful and normal to anyone with an ENG, sport, entertainment shooting background.

Re running a heavy lens on either model FS7. Even with the better locking mount on the MKII there is no way I would run anything close to the weight of a Cabrio without support. The Mk II has a better positive lock where you don't have to turn the lens to mount it but the front mount plate is the same thickness as the MkI. Not super strong like most of the old 2/3" ENG cams. I won't even mount the 1Kg Sony 18-110 on an FS7 without support let alone a Cabrio or Canon 17-120. The 20-120 weighs 2.4Kg, that's reasonably hefty. Way to much flexing. Also you can affect the focus plane as with a bit of up/down side to side movement of the lens you can "walk" the focus plane axis across the image. Not at all desirable. I don't think when they designed the FS7 that Sony thought that it would sell as well as it has. That of course means every man and his dog will try to fit all and sundry that there is in lens land onto the camera which I am sure Sony never anticipated.

My tripods are all set up to run Sony VCT 14 type plates so any camera can go on any tripod. My solution for solid lens support on the FS7 when not shoulder mounted is to use this plate:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1471315-REG/sony_vcttp1_tripod_adaptor_plate.html

Genustech.jpg

It allows two screws to solidly mount the plate onto the FS7 body and then at the front of the long slot I mount it directly to the lens support on the 18-110. Basically something like this could be rigged for almost any heavier lens I guess. This is a rock solid setup, very solid and keeps bulk and weight down. When using a Metabones PL adapter that is not a problem either as that can mount very solidly to the plate as well. I don't use the FS7 shoulder mounted so much these days as most of that run around corporate work is now covered by an A7III and Z90 so I find the VCT 14 a suitable solution for the FS7.

Chris Young

The cables:

https://www.abelcine.com/search?query=cameo+lanc+power+cable&tab=buy

Cameo 12 pin.jpgCameo D Tap.jpg
 
Run&Gun said:
I have some friends with the Chrosziel units on their MK's, but I don't know how they perform compared to the Fuji native servo's/grip. Personally, I'd stick with the Fuji grip/servo solution.

The lenses don't really pull that much juice and one of the BP-U batteries with a Power-tap out should be sufficient, but a brick is going to balance it out much better.

I would not trust or subject the E-mount to that kind of weight/torque/stress. The 20-120 is PL mount only, so you would have a PL adapter on the E-mount and then the lens, which would move it even farther out, resulting in even more torque/stress on the mount. Even with the "native" PL mount on my F55, I support my 17-120. In an effort to save weight out in front of the camera, with an already heavy lens, I switched my rods to the new Bright Tangerine Titanium rods a few months ago, from the aluminum ones I was running. They're as light as carbon fiber and as strong as steel. I was surprised at how light they really are. You don't get it until you actually pick them up. I didn't run CF rods, because I run a grip near the end of the lens and I was afraid all of that torque would possibly break/splinter them while I was shooting. You don't really want ~$60K worth of camera and lens to go crashing to the ground off of your shoulder.
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Yikes I just bought some CB rods.. and have a grip at the end of the rods.. using Sigma cine zooms 18-35 -50-100mm... PL mount f5.. have you actually ever heard of CB rods splitting ???
 
I don’t think I know anyone that it’s happened to personally and I actually own some and used to use them all the time, even on my ENG cameras, but now it seems like most people I know use metal rods. It’s probably a very slim possibility, but when I started supporting the 17-120 and supporting/holding the camera(F55 & C300) that far out with that much weight(each rig has to be pushing at least the mid 20’s or higher), I decided to play it safe and only use metal, at least in those configurations/situations. And honestly, I’m probably putting way too much faith & confidence in the set-up I have and the way I use it, because a lot of shoulder mounts and LWS rod systems, like the Zacuto’s that I run, are only holding the rods by maybe a 1/4” at its end. And my grips are probably secured 8”-10” away on the opposite side of a 12” set of rods. They should be secured on the camera side by probably at least 1”, if not more, for the type of stress I’m putting on them at times.
 
cyvideo said:
If you go with the workhorse Sony 18-100 also consider this. his poor man's Cabrio...
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...wa_8xlc_95_8x_wide_angle_converter.html/specs

cyvideo said:
My solution for solid lens support on the FS7 when not shoulder mounted is to use this plate:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1471315-REG/sony_vcttp1_tripod_adaptor_plate.html

Chris - thanks for sharing both of these - I wasn't aware of that zoom thru WA adapter... looks like it simply screws on the threaded end of the lens. May have to try that out for certain jobs. Same goes for that plate - but yikes - it's a little pricey for what it is.
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The adapter yes it does just screw in. The plates I've got are actually made by Genustech and they are called 'Genus GL GAP Adaptor Plate for VCT-14 Tripod Plate.' I see it is now listed as discontinued on the Genus site

https://www.genustech.tv/GAP-Genus-Adaptor-Plate-for-VCT-14-Tripod-Plat-p/gap.htm

This discontinued state is a recent development and it seems that Sony have now copied it and upped the price. I paid $95 for my last one. I have also had one on an old EX3 for years with a DM-Accessories reinforcement plate which made a big difference in robustness and security. A company I bought from before in Singapore looks like they may have it in stock still for US$86.00. I think if you hunt around locally you may find one:

https://www.expandore.biz/product_detail.asp?productid=6438

A very versatile plate that can work for a number of cameras.

Chris Young
 
Run&Gun said:
I don’t think I know anyone that it’s happened to personally and I actually own some and used to use them all the time, even on my ENG cameras, but now it seems like most people I know use metal rods. It’s probably a very slim possibility, but when I started supporting the 17-120 and supporting/holding the camera(F55 & C300) that far out with that much weight(each rig has to be pushing at least the mid 20’s or higher), I decided to play it safe and only use metal, at least in those configurations/situations. And honestly, I’m probably putting way too much faith & confidence in the set-up I have and the way I use it, because a lot of shoulder mounts and LWS rod systems, like the Zacuto’s that I run, are only holding the rods by maybe a 1/4” at its end. And my grips are probably secured 8”-10” away on the opposite side of a 12” set of rods. They should be secured on the camera side by probably at least 1”, if not more, for the type of stress I’m putting on them at times.
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OK thanks. I have the CN7 too and would probably go back to the metal bars for that .. as its longer than my CB rods and I have a different lens support for it too.. but I haven't used the CN7 for many months now.. fell in love with the Sigma cine zooms..
 
Stupid name, but a beast of a lens. By all accounts, the original Premiere series s35 zooms rivaled some of the best primes available. All of my HD ENG lenses are Fuji Premiere's.
 
Finding myself currently in this dither... 18-110 (slow & steady) or 18-55 (fast & shaky). Used the 18-110 before, and really had an issue with how not-close its close focus was... and it doesn't really look like I'd get much better with the 18-55?

I know I could use the x0.8 WA adapter with either (potentially) and get x0.8 the close focus (in a hilarious hearkening back to my HVX200 and HV30-shooting days), but that glass usually degrades images somewhat.
 
mcbob said:
Finding myself currently in this dither... 18-110 (slow & steady) or 18-55 (fast & shaky). Used the 18-110 before, and really had an issue with how not-close its close focus was... and it doesn't really look like I'd get much better with the 18-55?

I know I could use the x0.8 WA adapter with either (potentially) and get x0.8 the close focus (in a hilarious hearkening back to my HVX200 and HV30-shooting days), but that glass usually degrades images somewhat.
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The 18-55 has a delicious macro mode that really changes the close focus range to much much more usable. It's so great. Just a flip of a switch and once the lens is at close focus, you use the macro ring to focus. Really can't say enough good things about that feature. I've got the pair of MK zooms and absolutely love them.
 
mcbob said:
Used the 18-110 before, and really had an issue with how not-close its close focus was
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How close to you want to get? Using Manual focus in the AF/M focus mode works pretty well, used it often. Quote:

"The lens offers two different minimum focus distances. When you are in Manual Focus mode, the minimum focus is limited to 3.1’. Since the lens isn’t particularly long physically, the minimum distance to the object isn’t so great. Especially at 18mm, the effect keeps you pretty far away from the object. But when you switch into Auto Focus / Manual Focus, the minimum focus distance drops significantly to 1.3’ when at the wide end of the lens. The minimum focus goes back to the original 3.1’ at the tight end of the lens. This effectively puts you in Macro focusing at 18mm. When this mode is engaged, you can get very impressive close focus shots."

IMHO the worst aspect of the 18-110 is its bokeh as it runs a seven blade iris like a lot of the Cooke lenses. There again if circular bokeh is an important aspect of the shoot I'm doing, which it often isn't, I would use a different lens.

https://www.abelcine.com/articles/b...uides/behind-the-lens-sony-e-pz-18-110mm-zoom

Chris Young
 
Issue being that frequently, I want to focus in on something close while also zoomed in. 18-110 is horrible at that from my experience.

Renting an 18-55 next week, cooking show pilot, will test the limits of its macro for certain.
 
For closeup or macro work, I just put on a 90mm micro Nikkor. It is a beautiful lens that I always carry with me along with the Rokinon 12mm. They fill in the blanks for me with the 18-110. Takes just a moment to swap lenses. That is the beauty of removable lenses.
 
mcbob said:
Issue being that frequently, I want to focus in on something close while also zoomed in
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Then agreed the best is a lens with a proper macro function. The Fujinon MK macro ring will allow you to lock in dual focus point macro zooms which for cooking shows and for real quick transitions from zoom to super close without having to refocus is great. Having two nailed in focus points locked into each end of the zoom range you require is a great extra capability of this type of back focus macro ring setup. Used to use that a lot with the B4 lenses.

Chris Young
 
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