YAGH! as Opposed to BeachTek or JuicedLink Boxes?

Michael Erlewine

Michael Erlewine

Well-known member
Not an expert in this, but why buy the YAGH add-on for $2000, when I can buy a BeachTek or JuicedLink box for my XLR connections for much less? If it is for the BNC connectors, I understand that the GH4 on its own can output a 4K 4:2:2 at 10-bit stream via the HDMI port. Of course, there are no recorders for that 4K.

So the only reason to get the YAGH interface is for those BNC connectors to my CD Odyssey 7Q, correct?

So why buy the YAGH?
 
I'm guessing it bypasses the GH4's audio circuitry, which a 3.5mm TRS connection cannot do. This means a lower noise floor.
 
Thanks. I wonder how we could verify that it bypasses the GH4's audio circuitry? What then do the BeachTek and JuicedLink boxes do as bypassing the internal audio circuitry?
 
Michael Erlewine said:
Thanks. I wonder how we could verify that it bypasses the GH4's audio circuitry? What then do the BeachTek and JuicedLink boxes do as bypassing the internal audio circuitry?
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I do believe in the zacuto video the Panasonic rep talks that audio is fed from XLR into the camera via 4 pins on the (the ones not on the GH3) and then is processed and fed back out via HDMI to the YAGH unit.

I think the price of the YAGH is due to it being one of the few HDMI-SDI converters out there. lots of processing in that thing to hit the SDI and TC outs not only pre-amps.
 
Mini HDMI is the worlds worst connection - SDI to your monitor will make the box worth it (to the right people)

Im unclear if the YAG powers the camera (lets hope so!) but again a solid power supply would seem 'worth it'

S
 
I don't think that YAGH powers the camera, but perhaps it does. I have been told by someone who should know and who has tested the GH4 that its dynamic range is not all that great. I need to figure out how to power the YAGH.
 
morgan_moore said:
Mini HDMI is the worlds worst connection - SDI to your monitor will make the box worth it (to the right people)

Im unclear if the YAG powers the camera (lets hope so!) but again a solid power supply would seem 'worth it'

S
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Yes, according to the GH4 press release, the YAGH will supply power to the GH4. The flip side is you need to supply the YAGH with power via the 12v XLR input. For some it's no big deal, but for me having to rig an Anton Bauer type battery to supply power, and then investing in enough batteries, is more pain than it's worth. That's a $1,000+ investment right there. Plus the $2,000 for the unit itself... for just XLR inputs, that's a bit much.
 
Mike Harvey said:
Yes, according to the GH4 press release, the YAGH will supply power to the GH4. The flip side is you need to supply the YAGH with power via the 12v XLR input. For some it's no big deal, but for me having to rig an Anton Bauer type battery to supply power, and then investing in enough batteries, is more pain than it's worth. That's a $1,000+ investment right there. Plus the $2,000 for the unit itself... for just XLR inputs, that's a bit much.
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Indeed. I'm in the opposite boat, Vlock and even 4pin XLR cable ready to go, buying a load of panny batts and acquiring a few new chargers would be more annoying!

S
 
stoneinapond said:
OK, just for clarity sake, there is more to the expansion box than just XLR inputs.
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I realize that, there is also the HDMI-SDI conversion going on. However, the initial appeal for a lot of folks (like myself) would be the XLR's. The SDI is nice, but XLR's are going to be a lot more practical in terms of day to day needs.

[EDIT] Let me rephrase that... "a lot more practical in terms of *my* day to day needs". Don't want to presume to speak for anyone else.
 
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Consider this:

Realistically for most shooting situations, one would want a better/bigger monitor that the little LCD on the back of he GH4. With the YAGH mounted and the HDMI connected, that screen will no longer articulate. So you will need a decent screen anyway.

Here comes the Odyssey7Q, with a 7.7" OLED 1280x800 screen and a host of exposure tools. Oh by the way, for no additional cost you can also record to it in 4K from the camera via the YAGH.

The Odyssey7Q can run off a variety of power sources and voltages. Here's where it gets fun. Several manufacturers (such as Convergent Design and Nebtek) make dual battery plates for various little camcorder batteries such as Sony L-series, Sony U-series, Panasonic, Canon and even JVC. All of those batteries except the Sony U are 7.4v. he plates come wired standardly in parallel or simply separate (one for Odyssey and one for accessories), but it would be easy enough to have them wired in series. This would deliver 14.4v, which is the same thing that comes out of something like an Anton Bauer or IDX larger battery. Split the feed to power both the Odyssey and the YAGH and you're all set. The Sony U-series are 14.4v already, so you could simply send power from one into the Odyssey and the other to the YAGH.

These little batteries only cost about $100 each for the largest size, and generally a pair of them are about equal in power to an Anton Bauer Dionic 90. The chargers are equally less expensive. You might need to buy a bunch of batteries, but they are compact, lightweight, inexpensive and come with a ready-made mount to help keep things tidy.

Worried about 5 cables running between the YAGH and the Odyssey7Q? Use our Ultra-Thin SDI cables to take up less space than a single standard BNC.
 
Mitch: I am new to this D-tap battery stuff. Could you or someone outline a part-by-part, preferably with links to read about them, so that I could gather all the pieces. Please and thanks.
 
I am in the same boat as the OP. Don't really care about SDIs. At this stage, I am happy with the onboard 4k and can rent if I need anything extra, I only need decent sound.

What I am probably going to go with is the Zoom H6. 4 XLR inputs. I can send audio to the camera as well as record straight to an SD card for backup. $400.

I believe it was the Zacuto video that mentioned you can turn off AGC, so you should be able to get decent audio straight into the camera.
 
Michael Erlewine said:
Mitch: I am new to this D-tap battery stuff. Could you or someone outline a part-by-part, preferably with links to read about them, so that I could gather all the pieces. Please and thanks.
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I suggest you work with a reseller such as AbelCine to figure all that stuff out. As I now work for one manufacturer it probably isn't my place to put stuff out like that.
 
HD-SDI is worth the price if you need HD-SDI. Believe it or not there is a huge need for HD-SDI when it comes to live production environments. You just cannot run 100 feet of HDMI to a switcher. If you want to run a camera feed live into a production switcher than HD-SDI is your only option. There is also the quality of the connections and sharing timecode between devices which is huge for that environment.

Most video cameras with HDMI also only output broadcast standards. For example 59.94i. If you shoot 23.976p a 3:2 is added. Not a big deal for some external recorders but that is what happens if that is a big deal to somebody. HD-SDI typically gives you the choice of exactly what format is output including many forms of psf if you need it.

Honestly the YAGH is not designed for everybody to use. This is one of those devices that you should only really buy if you need it. If you plan on only using an external recorder that will live close to the camera then there is very little reason to use it. We also do not yet know what the audio recording in the camera will be like. The 3.5mm jack was the least of the problems on a DSLR and most of the audio issues come from the internal AGC and audio processing in the camera itself. Even the most amazing XLR connections in the world will not change the AGC or how the audio is processed. We may find many of those audio issues still there even with XLR. I think in certain environments many may choose to still record external audio because they can choose what audio processing takes place and get rid of AGC entirely if they so choose. Recording audio in camera is better suited to a live event environment where convenience sometimes trumps pristine quality and a user would depend on AGC anyway.
 
XLR inputs with good preamps and a digital input into the GH4 (compared to the analog 3.5mm mic jack) are compelling, but as others have stated, if you don't need SDI or TC-sync, then the YAGH is likely not a good fit for you. If audio is your only concern, then you will save a bundle by getting a standalone preamp or recorder and deal with the analog input and additional post work required to sync the audio.

Even very low budget indie features require SDI (if only to run picture to video village) and timecode sync (hopefully the GH4 can do a jam sync), so a full 4k setup for under $4k (GH4 + YAGH) is definitely of interest.

Mitch, some great info on powering 7Q plus GH4/YAGH, thanks for that. HDMI 1.4a spec supports 4k so hopefully we'll see 4K recording on the Odyssey 7Q at some point in the future?
 
Bern Caughey said:
Sam,

Mini HDMI is robust compared to the GH4's Micro HDMI. What was Panasonic thinking?

Best,
B
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Yes, this.

Had the same problem with the micro HDMI port on the Blackmagic Pocket. Compared to mini-HDMI it saves, what, 2mm of space? :Drogar-BlackEye(DBG
 
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