Why Matte Boxes on DSLRs or Video Cameras when using still lenses??

G

Gene Sung

Veteran
I see a lot of people's DSLR and video camera rigs (such as the FS100), and I often see a Matte Box attached to the front.

I was always under the impression that a Matte Box is used for lenses such as PL Mount lenses which often do not have front threads for filters.

But a majority of stills lenses that people use with DSLRs and video cameras such as the FS100 have the circular front threads to attach filters.

With that said, what is the use of a Matte Box for lenses that have threads on the front? I know there is the stray light issue, but it seems like an articulating arm with a french flag would do the same things and it's much more flexible. Or even a lens hood.

Am I missing something?
 
gene_can_sing said:
I see a lot of people's DSLR and video camera rigs (such as the FS100), and I often see a Matte Box attached to the front.

I was always under the impression that a Matte Box is used for lenses such as PL Mount lenses which often do not have front threads for filters.

But a majority of stills lenses that people use with DSLRs and video cameras such as the FS100 have the circular front threads to attach filters.

With that said, what is the use of a Matte Box for lenses that have threads on the front? I know there is the stray light issue, but it seems like an articulating arm with a french flag would do the same things and it's much more flexible. Or even a lens hood.

Am I missing something?
Click to expand...

The 'matte' box gives better coverage to shadow the lens than the typical little 'lens hood' that comes with still lenses, especially if the shot has lights that are close to the lens, despite being flagged appropriately. There may be some sort of 'trying to wear big boy pants' for some set of people, but the matte box is useful. For the typically DSLR applications the matte box would be cumbersome but for narrative style shooting it has a place. The other issue is being able to use thin gel type filters, rather than glass.
 
For me, it's mostly because it adds a professional look to the camera. I bought the super cheap chinese knock off version for $30. It's not even a real matte box, it doesn't hold 4x4 filters or anything. It's basically just a big sunshade. But it adds a professional look, which can make a difference to your clients.

side_cam_a_550-620x463.jpg
 
Last edited:
Just having one set of filters? Worth the price of a good matte box alone. Being able to buy a 4x4 filter and knowing I'll use it on the next 10 camera upgrades is great. Sliding a polarizer in at the start of a shoot and not messing with it for every lens change? Kickass.

One of my favorite DSLR lenses is a vintage Nikon zoom. Sharp as hell at 2.8, but really prone to veiling flare. The flare looks really kind of "cinematic" if used for a whole project, but if I want the full color density, I need to adjust flags for every single shot. The matte box makes it a breeze.

Small sensor cams using full-sensor glass can give you terrible flare problems, from light sources not visible in the viewfinder; you can flag those issues, but a matte box means just reaching out and tweaking something, not guiding an assistant with yet another light stand and a flag. I can't tell you how wonderful just that ability is. Reach forward and tweak a flag without even really thinking about it vs. stopping to change grip gear.

And you can joke about this all you want, but for corporate clients who aren't up on the latest camera trends? Having a matte box, flags, loupe and rails makes them much more comfortable than seeing an SLR body on a QR plate. I can't tell you how many clients have done the whole "whooooooo... what did THAT cost?" when I set up my humble T2i (I was luckily able to find a great rolling case that holds my rig fully assembled, with room for lenses, focus gears, and 4x4's).

I like the follow focus & matte box combo so much, I often use it for product still shots. It feels odd to have the DSLR rig on a camera stand, rotated 90 degrees, but I'm no longer hanging flags to protect from a visible strobe head, and checking shots with the loupe is dynamite.
 
One of the problems with using screw-on filters is you have to unscrew them every time you change lenses and then screw them back on the next lens. With a matte box the filters sit in a filter tray, so when you change lenses you do not need to remove any needed filters. Another downfall of screw-on filters is they can start to vignette when you stack them, where large matte box filters cover an area larger than the diameter of the front of the lens. Also using a screw-on filter you can not reposition the filter. For example... If you were using an ND grad filter you would have to live with where the grad line is on a screw-on, but with a matte box filter you can slide the filter tray to reposition the grad. That being said, I don't use a matte box unless I feel it's needed for the shot.
 
on the kind of lenses that would vignette with a couple of screw-in filters (e.g. tokina 11-16 on aps-c), wouldn't most matte boxes vignette too?
 
SLR lenses have front filter threads commonly ranging from ~50mm to 82mm. Some of the larger telephoto lenses have front elements of 100mm or greater in diameter. So if you want to use screw on filters you are going to be spending lots of money on duplicates in different sizes and using lots of stepping rings as well. With a Matte box, you have one set of filters for all your lenses.

In practice though, most of the people who use Matte Boxes for DSLR's are simply trying to make their cameras look more impressive for the clients.
 
Samuel H said:
on the kind of lenses that would vignette with a couple of screw-in filters (e.g. tokina 11-16 on aps-c), wouldn't most matte boxes vignette too?
Click to expand...

Well my friend, it depends.
I have 2 matte boxes, one is a smaller 4x4 bellows unit, and the second is a wide matte box with 2 4x5.65 trays, 1 4x4 tray, and a 138mm rear holder. I do have to remove the 4x4 tray with some lenses to avoid problems at wider angles.
 
I was always under the impression that a Matte Box is used for lenses such as PL Mount lenses which often do not have front threads for filters.
Click to expand...
absolutely NOT!

well, that may be a benefit. but by far NOT the primary reason.

the two primary reasons are:
- to hold one or multiple-stacked filters, and often with one having the capacity to rotate (like a grad ND)
- to control light spilling into the lens

For me, it's mostly because it adds a professional look to the camera.
Click to expand...
wow man. i dont think there's been a single post in the history of this forum that quite so well illustrates my general disappointment with typical dslr jockeys...

It's basically just a big sunshade. But it adds a professional look, which can make a difference to your clients.
Click to expand...
im the biggest proponent of things that ad vibe. or give clients production-woodys, but they have to actually DO what they are supposed to DO. your two statements truly disturb me.
 
^ Always purchase filters which will cover your largest front lens element^

In my case the majority of my filters are Panavision size 4x5.65, which is a little more future proof and versatile than the smaller 4x4 filters.
 
when a decent filter costs £150 per piece, you want to be able to buy just one of each. if each lens has a different filter thread you need a set for each lens! cheaper than a 4x4 + sunshade combo.

most clients see a square sunshade and they see a 'cameraman' doing video work. clients see a round sunshade and they see a 'photographer' who is using the video mode - everyone and their grandma can shoot 1080p on their camera nowdays. anyone can order a £5 rubber lens hood. only professionals who value being professional and more importantly (unfortunately) perceived as professional will invest in a proper setup ready to accept pro grade filters.

in todays world, where everyone reads the net, with diy tutorials, it takes more to stand out and get the real clients coming up and asking for you card. anyone who thinks different is likely missing out on work.

I get asked for my card about 5 times per job i carry out. i never have to follow up. they get in touch with me. these guys havn't even seen my work before contacting me. they contact me initially because I try my best to exhibit an air of professionalism while i am working. Unfortunately we live in a world where the gear you use is a walking advert for your success. its the same as idiot salesmen driving over expensive cars. what ever can give you the upper hand in a world of competitors is worthwhile in my book.

Using attractive gear is sometimes annoying. you end up being cornered 10 times per job by camera buffs who read these forums too much, and all know more than you do! question your methods, try talking about gear, when you have deadlines to hit!
 
Last edited:
MB's can be useful in some situations - the filters are generally better and the flags help immensely for controlling light in highly-lit sets.

As I work, I've never found them more useful than the cheap plain rubber collapsible screw-on hoods. They're bulky and just another thing to smack up against doorways, macro subjects, milling crowds, etc. Every extra bit of weight and encumbrance is just a little more incentive to not bother moving that camera into more interesting positions, and stick to "safe" locked-off blah angles. I don't use them, work quicker, and still manage to get steady work.

My limited experience has shown me that clients who are significantly influenced and impressed by glitzy paraphernalia festoonery generally wind up being annoying clients to work for... not always, but often enough.
 
I use a matte box because it is not only more convenient than screw-on, but also less expensive. My $50 matte box and inexpensive (~$8) Cokin filters cost less than screw-on filters and are a lot easier to mount and dismount.

What puzzles me is people who spend almost as much for the matte box as for the camera :-)

Cheers,

Bill
 
Last edited:
I do agree with ErikTande on the previous page, showing up to a gig with only a dslr and lenses can give a psychological affect towads what your client's think you will be able to use, so I would say there is a major aesthetic aspect to using a mattebox with a DSLR :)
 
I'm looking for a decent matte box I can buy, grow, learn and possibly upgrade. Not sure if I want to spend big money yet, but a decent matte box and some filters can really help me out. Any suggestions?
Thanks
 
I use the matte box for the filters but most of all the balance of the camera when I go hand held and also it looks really great as a prof setup.
Camera1.jpg

Film3.jpg

Film1.jpg
 
I've got one of the indian matte boxes and it's held up well for a couple years; it's rod-mounted vs. screw on, which I prefer by far.

The only issue I had with mine was when you have all the metal flags on it, they can get a little "clanky" when you move; I used some self-adhesive velcro in the corners where the flags touch, just enough for them to stick together and have some padding. I keep a set of alan keys in my bag, since you occasionally have to tighten the mounts for the top flag.

Been very happy with it and there have been times when all those flags have been priceless; though often I just use it without flags, or just the top flag.

I have to disagree with the "clients who are impressed by gear are often pain in the rear clients" comments. When I shoot DSLR with flags, loupe, FF, shoulder mount and rails, even my nicest clients remark about it -"man, I'm not getting near that thing, bet it costs more than my car" kind of stuff - and they feel like they're getting their budget's worth. And they are- I use that stuff because it helps get perfect footage with minimal time and hassle. Funny thing is, I've done some BTS video shoots of high-budget fashion still shoots for well-known brands, lots of people like putting that stuff on their sites, using it for model search, etc. At those gigs, where the shooter has three assistants and two data wranglers, it's the industry people that freak over my rig. A room fool of 5D's and those amazingly expensive Profoto packs, and everyone's like "man, I wanna camera rig like that!"

Funny, when I get a killer shot with groovy lens flare, slomo, hair blowing, it's a blast to stick the loupe up to the big-name stills guy and his crew and watch 'em go "man, I am SO getting into this video stuff..."
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top