1DC: Upgrade Advice - 1DC vs. C300

housetwelve

housetwelve

Member
I will start by saying I've read through many of the threads already up on this topic, but I still feel uneasy about making a final decision.

I currently work with 5Ds (mkii) and despite the limitations, I am comfortable with DSLRs. I'm all set in terms of accessories and equipment, and I've adapted to the workflow, I'm just ready to upgrade.

I am leaning toward the 1DC because I feel it would be more familiar to me. Most of my work is short corporate pieces and music videos, although I do some weddings for variety. I feel like I've gone this long with the DSLRs, I don't see why I couldn't continue with one.

I do think the C300 would be a "better" option, but more expensive (in terms of camera and peripherals), and less familiar.

I ruled out the C100 a while back. Even though it's probably enough camera for me now, I don't buy cameras frequently and wanted to invest in something that would last beyond the next year or two.

The advice I'm looking for isn't so much about the technical capabilities of the cameras, but maybe a potential oversight, something I haven't considered in making the jump? Any input that would make me less nervous about buying the wrong camera would be greatly appreciated!

-Elizabeth
 
Good advice from David. Its worth just waiting a little longer if you can. Things are getting ready to get interesting on the new product front .
 
I've been hearing there will be a new version of the C300 by NAB and it is supposed to be a shoulder mount.

On a personal note, I don't see how anyone shoots video with a DSLR. I own a C300 and hate shooting with it, and it was 'designed' as a video camera. I couldn't imagine using a body designed for still photography to try and shoot video on a regular basis.

If you HAVE to buy something right now, go C300. It will generate work just by you getting the word out that you own one. They are still that popular.
 
The C100 mk II is a very soild choice for any type of work now, and it will last quite a bit. The Sony FS7 is also great and will last a few years popular. I wouldn't invest in neither a C300 or a 1Dc because they are nearly at the end of their life cycle, they woll depreciate greatly the moment a new model comes out at NAB or so. I'd look at the new C100 mk II or Sony FS7. Both great video cameras. And adapting from a DSLR to a C100 is not as weird as you may think, it's essentially a bigger better DSLR with all the things you missed.
 
I was originally planning on waiting until after NAB, but had an unexpected boom in work all scheduling for December. After checking out the rental costs for these two cameras, it seemed silly not to buy when that is my plan eventually anyway.

I should have mentioned that I will most likely be looking for a used camera (unless I decide on the C100). I'm sure they will be easier to come across in a few months, but I might also feel worse about spending tons of money on a C300 if there actually is something way cooler on the market.

But I have been holding out for the past 3 years, so maybe I should rent a C100 for the upcoming gigs and hold out on purchasing.
 
I would rent a C100 for a few weeks and then pick up a C100 Mark II around Christmas. I think you would be happy with that decision. Looks like a really nice upgrade/fix to the existing C100 quirks.
 
housetwelve said:
I will start by saying I've read through many of the threads already up on this topic, but I still feel uneasy about making a final decision.

I currently work with 5Ds (mkii) and despite the limitations, I am comfortable with DSLRs. I'm all set in terms of accessories and equipment, and I've adapted to the workflow, I'm just ready to upgrade.

I am leaning toward the 1DC because I feel it would be more familiar to me. Most of my work is short corporate pieces and music videos, although I do some weddings for variety. I feel like I've gone this long with the DSLRs, I don't see why I couldn't continue with one.

I do think the C300 would be a "better" option, but more expensive (in terms of camera and peripherals), and less familiar.

I ruled out the C100 a while back. Even though it's probably enough camera for me now, I don't buy cameras frequently and wanted to invest in something that would last beyond the next year or two.

The advice I'm looking for isn't so much about the technical capabilities of the cameras, but maybe a potential oversight, something I haven't considered in making the jump? Any input that would make me less nervous about buying the wrong camera would be greatly appreciated!

-Elizabeth
Click to expand...

First off, I haven't used the 1dc or c300, so feel free to dismiss my advice.

That said, I did come from dslr's to a c100, and if the only thing that's holding you back is familiarity, I can tell you the c-line is pretty similar to dslr's. There's some changes, but think of them like added features-- you can completely ignore them if you want, but they'll be there if you want/need them. They're only a bonus, never a detriment. (Plus, it's not that hard to learn them and it might be good for your career to start learning about these extra features in a camera that's still similar to the dslr's, so when you move on to even more advanced cameras it'll be a smaller step)

Also, I don't want to be the guy that ignores what you're asking, but if the only reason you're ruling out the c100 is you think it'll become obsolete, take this into consideration: no camera is "future proof," and at the same time they all kind of are. 4k is still a ways off from something you'll "need," at least if you're talking about the lower-end professional cameras. So if the c100 can do everything you need it to, I would reconsider it. There's not going to be any huge advancements any time soon that'll make it worthless. It'll still capture images, it'll still have a nice dynamic range, it'll still have the xlr inputs if you need them, it'll still have a histogram and waveform. Slow-mo, 4k would and hd-sdi would be nice, and maybe soon cameras at this price point will have a bajillion stops of range, but if you don't need any of that now it's unlikely you'll find it a necessity before your next camera upgrade. You can and will always be able to get great images from the c100. Plus, there's always the option of a 1-day rental if you ever really particularly need any of those features. Considering there's a pretty big price difference, I might reconsider it.

David W. Jones said:
If you can hold off a little longer, you might wait to see what the new offerings will be.
Click to expand...

In this particular case you might be right since we're right on the cusp of what seems to be some serious upgrades, but as a general rule I try to stay away from this kind of advice. Cameras, at this point, are a little like phones. No matter when you purchase, there's always going to be something "better" right around the corner. I tend to just try and find the best camera I can afford at any given time, which will get the job done, and go for it. There may be more features down the line, but if a camera can capture the image I'm trying to get, I can do the rest.
 
I'm not the type to chase after the newest gear. I have no intentions of working in 4K anytime soon, BUT--I'd be lying if I said it didn't give me some peace of mind. Plus, I really don't mind dslrs, and I'm quite used to being talked down to for using one by now. I'm unapologetic, even if it has let me down a couple times before.

I was all about the C100 for the past year, saving up for one, and then changed my mind after reading through some posts on the forum. I'm not worried about it being "obsolete", but it's so rare that I buy a camera, that I really feel that I should get the best I can afford. I've also observed what people get rid of--used c100s are a dime a dozen, finding a used 1dc or c300 is harder. I think that speaks volumes.

But I'm glad to hear that the c100 is worth another look, I wouldn't mind saving a few grand. Renting one for a couple weeks is affordable. I will have 3 jobs I can use it on and gain real experience and then go from there.
 
I am very happy with my 1Dc and can whole heartedly recommend it—if it's your thing. The 4k files look stunning, but it's not something you would want to cover an event with where long recording times are needed.

BUT, it seems like the C100 mkII would be a perfect fit for you. It ticks almost all the boxes for versatile video production. You get a high end image quality with really nice features such as Dual pixel AF.

The C100 mkII is coming in at the right price for the kind of work you describe. It won't break the bank, yet deliver the image you need. A purchase you won't have to worry about later, or second guess yourself stepping up to a too expensive camera.
 
Get the C100 mk II and rent anything to work these next couple of days.

The original C100 was a very successful camera just like the C300, I don't know what you heard about it. It just had a couple of issues which are:
A bad EVF
Screen in the wrong position
No slow motion

All of these are now solved with the C100 mk II. I would argue that it's a better camera now than a C300.

On the C300 you get an SDI output, and a broadcast approved codec (50mbps 4:2:2).

With the C100 mk II you get a slightly better image especially in lowlight than the C100 mk I and C300, 60p 1080p slowmotion, Dual pixel AF with face detection, a smaller body and also lighter, internal wifi for remote controling by any device, two internal good quality microphones. And if you have to work for broadcast the C100 outputs a 4:2:2 uncompressed signal via the HDMI, so you can also get a better codec than the internal C300 50 mbps with the addition of a 300$ Ninja Star, and of course it's 5K cheaper! The C300 almost makes no sense now unless you really need these SDI/Genlock ports. That's why it's definitely going to be replaced as soon as possible now that a better smaller cheaper model is released.

It's really the perfect camera for anyone who doesn't need 4K. If you do want 4K then the Sony FS7 is a great option at 8K and will also last you a good few years. C300 mk I and 1Dc now? Bad investment! It doesn't mean they are bad cameras, it's just from a financial POV speaking here. If all you care about is delivering the absolute best image quality then the 1Dc at 4K scaled down to HD makes better images than both the C100 and C300, but of course it's not a very wise investment now as it's going to be replaced pretty soon especially with all the new 4K shooting DSLRs on the market. You will also lose all the video-camera ergonomics advantages, like proper audio with XLRs, ND filters, Peaking, Zebras, long lasting power and cheap media, EVF, articulating screen, etc

So your options are

-5.5K C100 mk II: Just released. A perfect 1080p camera

-12K C300: Old and due to change at NAB. Same as C100 mk II but adds the 50 mbps codec + SDI and loses the DPAF, slightly worse lowlight, 1080p slowmotion, internal wifi

-10K 1DC: Old and due to change. Delivers a better image than both (the C100/300 still produce a pretty spactacular image though for 1080p) but doesn't have all the features of video cameras mentioned above.

-8K FS7: new and just released. Vs the C100 mk II it Adds 4K 10 bit internal, 180fps vs 60p, a future raw option, shoulder mounted design if that's your thing, and loses the DPAF, compatability with Canon lenses (it doesn't realy work well as of now with Canon adapters and lenses), smaller size and lighter weight, loses a bit of lowlight performance, and people prefer the Canon coloir science and look but that's personal. It's 2K more too.

These are all the options now and how they compare, choose based on what you need.
 
Jim Martin said:
FYI, I don't see anything being done with the 1DC for a while.....just my opinion...

Jim Martin
Click to expand...
What do you mean? Yeah, the 1DC will probably not see any more updates, but the 1DC mkII may materialize in a couple years.
 
I have both and they are each special in their own way. C300 is super easy to use just grab it and shoot . You get a very nice film like look which is very easy to deal with in post , doesn't take a lot of hard drive space and plays very nice just a breeze all the way around.
The 1DC on the other hand is quit different . The image is really,really good. But, it needs a bit of rigging to shoot with as you are used to with your 5D . It is kind of a pain in post, takes a lot of hard drive real estate and really slows things down . Im working with a mac trash can .
I meant to replace my still camera and my c300 with the 1DC kind of a two birds with one stone but, didn't really work out that week so i have kept the c300. But am thinking of selling, so let me know if interested.
Thanks,
Tim
www.tjphoto.net
1DC http://vimeo.com/76069993 http://vimeo.com/94067821
C300 http://vimeo.com/109499039 Shot in almost total darkness c300 http://vimeo.com/102792602
 
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James0b57 said:
What do you mean? Yeah, the 1DC will probably not see any more updates, but the 1DC mkII may materialize in a couple years.
Click to expand...

I could be wrong, but I don't see the 1DC being replaced when it hits EOL. It has it's uses, but I think it was a stop-gap product from the start.
 
I also suspect it might not be made into a direct 1DC mk II, the 1Dc was probably a one-time product. But they will make a cinema DSLR, there was talk about a "modular" cinema DSLR. So I think it's going to a radically different design. The current complaints they will need to adress are, an EVF, Articulating screen, peaking/zebras/waveform, etc
 
tjphoto said:
It is kind of a pain in post, takes a lot of hard drive real estate and really slows things down . Im working with a mac trash can .
Click to expand...

This surprises me. CF-card in the reader and you can start working in FCPX right away—at least with keywording/grouping. Then, as soon as the ProRes files are created (automatically) you just drag them into the 'original files' folder and have new ProRes Masters.

Need proxies for a laptop edit? Basically a one click operation, and everything is contained in the library.

Working in FCPX and round-tripping to Resolve couldn't be easier.
 
AndreeOnline said:
This surprises me. CF-card in the reader and you can start working in FCPX right away—at least with keywording/grouping. Then, as soon as the ProRes files are created (automatically) you just drag them into the 'original files' folder and have new ProRes Masters.

Need proxies for a laptop edit? Basically a one click operation, and everything is contained in the library.

Working in FCPX and round-tripping to Resolve couldn't be easier.
Click to expand...
True, 1DC workflow was easier than C300 workflow.
 
Run&Gun said:
I could be wrong, but I don't see the 1DC being replaced when it hits EOL. It has it's uses, but I think it was a stop-gap product from the start.
Click to expand...
"Stop Gap"?!


The 1DC is a completely different beast. It is an amazingly flexible tool, and one of the best all round video cameras ever made to date. FF35, APSH, and s35 in one body. And a form factor that surpasses and is different from the overrated c300 form. The 1DC at its base form is a far superior platform than the C300.

The 1DC is amazing. If they issued a version II, I will probably get that too.
 
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