I like my DSLR better than my girlfriend because it's okay if I only go for 12 minutes with my DSLR.
General Think I made the wrong camera choice...
- Thread starter JohnFB
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I like my DSLR better than my girlfriend because it's okay if I only go for 12 minutes with my DSLR.
Rick Burnett
Section Moderator
Ahh, but I have an external monitor! I use a smallHD already with a sunshield. It's great! But sometimes, I don't want all that weight with me. I also use a blackbird stabalizer which is AWESOME.
I use a smallHD already with a sunshield. It's great! But sometimes, I don't want all that weight with me. I also use a blackbird stabalizer which is AWESOME.I like my DSLR better than my girlfriend because it's okay if I only go for 12 minutes with my DSLR.
haha
Hey, Thanks alot for informing me of all that Trauma bunny. Infact I thought I could just buy the camera and shoot amazing footage like the House ep, I thought maybe they used like 400$ more expensive lenses then I see this review "oh yeah, we used a couple of 30,000 dollar lenses, oh and this 2000$ rig" Then I was like, oh wait, what? And I been searching up later today finding out how much money you need to invest in DSLRs. I also now understand why all the filmakers are using them, they can use their expensive lenses on a super compact body and get amazing results!
Sadly, I don't have alot of money to spend and I have thought maybe I should just go with the camcorder, but I've already canceled my order, and I'm waiting 4-6 days for them to recredit to my CC and the T2is are out of stock everywhere I looked geez lol
Anyway, for post processing I literally have everything I need and a fast computer (can edit the .movs from dslr natively), it's the physical camera stuff I don't current have and I do have a pretty damn small budget to get it (1500$) I am getting this for myself for creative videos and things.
So DSLRs can't zoom? I'm thinking there'll be lenses with zoom rings but then you would have to adjust the focus ring at the same time to stay in focus right?
Anyway with my relatively tiny budget I could either get a dedicated tripod,dedicated audio, and the camera with a F1.4 50mm lens or I could get the camera with a good lens and not have the other stuff. I still definitely want to get this camera before it's really exciting for some reason, the look of it and how it's fully manual and all the recording modes.
But again thanks for pointing those issue out Trauma, funny how I was thinking the same thing as you were when I found otu about all the extra costs "Wow, I can't believe everyones saying it's so cheap to buy this camera when you need all this extra stuff to get decent footage" But, alas since I thought that I looked up stock lens footage and actually found some decent stuff shot on it, and I do think collecting lenses is cool I'm probably going to make this my most expensive hobby ever (2nd most being pokemon card collection! ) and haha yeah I was thinking about buying some lenses off ebay because I saw the 400$ price on amazon.
Sadly, I don't have alot of money to spend and I have thought maybe I should just go with the camcorder, but I've already canceled my order, and I'm waiting 4-6 days for them to recredit to my CC and the T2is are out of stock everywhere I looked geez lol
Anyway, for post processing I literally have everything I need and a fast computer (can edit the .movs from dslr natively), it's the physical camera stuff I don't current have and I do have a pretty damn small budget to get it (1500$) I am getting this for myself for creative videos and things.
So DSLRs can't zoom? I'm thinking there'll be lenses with zoom rings but then you would have to adjust the focus ring at the same time to stay in focus right?
Anyway with my relatively tiny budget I could either get a dedicated tripod,dedicated audio, and the camera with a F1.4 50mm lens or I could get the camera with a good lens and not have the other stuff. I still definitely want to get this camera before it's really exciting for some reason, the look of it and how it's fully manual and all the recording modes.
But again thanks for pointing those issue out Trauma, funny how I was thinking the same thing as you were when I found otu about all the extra costs "Wow, I can't believe everyones saying it's so cheap to buy this camera when you need all this extra stuff to get decent footage" But, alas since I thought that I looked up stock lens footage and actually found some decent stuff shot on it, and I do think collecting lenses is cool I'm probably going to make this my most expensive hobby ever (2nd most being pokemon card collection! ) and haha yeah I was thinking about buying some lenses off ebay because I saw the 400$ price on amazon.
Rick Burnett
Section Moderator
If you have a local camera store, you can try out lens and even rent them for pretty cheap before buying them. I'd suggest you take a look at the 30mm lens as this is the closest to what our eyes see and is relative to the 50mm lens that Full Frame (5D) cameras use.
Every person I have shown the 30mm understands why that is such a great all purpose lens for the APS-C sensor size (which is pretty close to S35 size, just a little smaller).
It doesn't take $30k glass either to shoot amazing video on these cameras. The difference between cine glass and DSLR glass is not always fully apparent, but there are differences, and I myself live with them because my $400 30mm lens resolves amazingly and a $30k lens is not going to look better, it's just going to behave better in certain circumstances.
When buying lens, here are a few things to look for. And just so you know, $30k lens DO suffer (some of them) from chromatic abborations ( this is where the different colors do not line up in the image around the edges and cause distortion in what you see, like color fringes like purple on objects)
1) Cine lenses are typically designed to not breathe as much. What this means is as you turn the focus ring, the camera appears to zoom in or out slightly as it is focusing. I have lens that breath A LOT and others than don't breath at all. This really matters to me on when you are pulling focus between objects, but some people just don't care. Also, in post, you could fix the breathing if you didn't like it by adjusting the scale of the frame. Would be very simple to fix.
2) Cine lenses typically have a longer throw for focus. With my Canon lenses, the movement of the focus ring is so quick to what happens, it can be hard to hit a focus sometimes. My Nikons are a bit smoother, but still, they are harder than a cine lens.
3) Cine lens are typically geared so you could easily use a follow focus. I use the inexpensive D-Focus which requires me adding plastic gear rings to my lens. In addition, Cine lens have rings on focus, zoom and iris. Also, many cine lens have smooth iris adjustments so you can actually pull aperature if you needed. My lenses all have fixed stops so I cannot do this. I've never experienced pulling the iris and so far, haven't needed it, but you just don't have that option.
4) MANY DSLR lens can maintain focus during zoom, I believe this is refered to as a parafocal lens. Actually, ALL of my lens retain focus during zoom. I've tested this. It is something you should look up if you are interested. Also, make SURE the lens also doesn't adjust the aperature while you zoom. On some of my lens, even if I set the aperature to the largest value, say F5, when I move through the zoom, the aperature still clicks around and makes the lens useless for pulling zoom in a shot. Again, research, research, research.
I plan on sticking with DSLR lens even when I upgrade to a more expensive body as I like them and I know them. I also don't like how large Cine lenses tend to be.
Once you get the T2I and either the 30mm or 50mm F1.4, you will TOTALLY see how much you can do with these at night. If you are shooting during the day outside and want shallow DoF, you are GOING TO NEED ND filters. Trust me. I use the FaderND and can use F1.4 even in full on beach sun with good results.
In any case, welcome to the DSLR world. You're going to love it.
Every person I have shown the 30mm understands why that is such a great all purpose lens for the APS-C sensor size (which is pretty close to S35 size, just a little smaller).
It doesn't take $30k glass either to shoot amazing video on these cameras. The difference between cine glass and DSLR glass is not always fully apparent, but there are differences, and I myself live with them because my $400 30mm lens resolves amazingly and a $30k lens is not going to look better, it's just going to behave better in certain circumstances.
When buying lens, here are a few things to look for. And just so you know, $30k lens DO suffer (some of them) from chromatic abborations ( this is where the different colors do not line up in the image around the edges and cause distortion in what you see, like color fringes like purple on objects)
1) Cine lenses are typically designed to not breathe as much. What this means is as you turn the focus ring, the camera appears to zoom in or out slightly as it is focusing. I have lens that breath A LOT and others than don't breath at all. This really matters to me on when you are pulling focus between objects, but some people just don't care. Also, in post, you could fix the breathing if you didn't like it by adjusting the scale of the frame. Would be very simple to fix.
2) Cine lenses typically have a longer throw for focus. With my Canon lenses, the movement of the focus ring is so quick to what happens, it can be hard to hit a focus sometimes. My Nikons are a bit smoother, but still, they are harder than a cine lens.
3) Cine lens are typically geared so you could easily use a follow focus. I use the inexpensive D-Focus which requires me adding plastic gear rings to my lens. In addition, Cine lens have rings on focus, zoom and iris. Also, many cine lens have smooth iris adjustments so you can actually pull aperature if you needed. My lenses all have fixed stops so I cannot do this. I've never experienced pulling the iris and so far, haven't needed it, but you just don't have that option.
4) MANY DSLR lens can maintain focus during zoom, I believe this is refered to as a parafocal lens. Actually, ALL of my lens retain focus during zoom. I've tested this. It is something you should look up if you are interested. Also, make SURE the lens also doesn't adjust the aperature while you zoom. On some of my lens, even if I set the aperature to the largest value, say F5, when I move through the zoom, the aperature still clicks around and makes the lens useless for pulling zoom in a shot. Again, research, research, research.
I plan on sticking with DSLR lens even when I upgrade to a more expensive body as I like them and I know them. I also don't like how large Cine lenses tend to be.
Once you get the T2I and either the 30mm or 50mm F1.4, you will TOTALLY see how much you can do with these at night. If you are shooting during the day outside and want shallow DoF, you are GOING TO NEED ND filters. Trust me. I use the FaderND and can use F1.4 even in full on beach sun with good results.
In any case, welcome to the DSLR world. You're going to love it.
ROCKMORE
Veteran
Send it back get a T2. I shot a commercial with a t2 and 7D Sunday shooting B roll for a news interview style spot. It's no problem working with when you get used to where the controls are. The 7D overheated a lot because between takes the camera won't power down till 60 sec while the T2 shuts down in 30 sec. Never got a warning from the T2. This is in the tropics so heat is an issue.
I shoot about 1,000 stills a week with a T2 average and shot some location stills for Nissan last week 1,500 shots in a few hours. Very versatile little camera. It's light and I carry it everywhere I go. I'm still renting an EX3 for my primary camera but when the new 5D III hits the market I'll add one of those and maybe a second T2 and the EX3 will be history for my work.
Way to go Canon.
The lower shot is 5 stills merged together
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Rick Burnett
Section Moderator
Did you try the new firmware for the 7D? It supposed to help with the overheating specifically. I shot in 100 degree weather and had no overheats. I will say, ANYTIME I shoot in 720p (which I try to avoid since it is so much more moire prone) I get overheating in a short amount of time.
I am in the middle of a shoot so I don't want to try the firmware till this project is done, in case Canon broke something else!
Thanks for that info grimepoch, very interesting and your getting me even more excited now! I'm going to read up more about lenses, Relieved that I can get similar quality for what my original thought was of a 400$ lens.
Quick question about filters: When I was looking up my camcorder I heard you should always have a UV filter on it to protect the camera lens, is this the same for these cameras with exchangeable lenses? People told me to get the HOYA multi coated UV filters for the HF S20, if it is true then I probably should get the larger sized ones so I could use step up rings on the smaller lenses incase I ever get a bigger lens ya?
Also quick question about keeping lenses safe:
I heard leather bags could possibly build up mold inside the lenses or something, which kind of bag should I get to store lenses in, and I think I should get one of those little packets that sucks moisture out of the air and throw it in with the equipment in the bag (overprotective right? lol)
The heat here has been 95-100 degrees (110-115 index past couple of days) in Florida, as long as the overheat sign comes up and you shut it down immediately the camera won't get damaged right?
And oh geez I completely forgot this camera is a photograph camera too, I bet more people buy this guy for film then photographs lol
Quick question about filters: When I was looking up my camcorder I heard you should always have a UV filter on it to protect the camera lens, is this the same for these cameras with exchangeable lenses? People told me to get the HOYA multi coated UV filters for the HF S20, if it is true then I probably should get the larger sized ones so I could use step up rings on the smaller lenses incase I ever get a bigger lens ya?
Also quick question about keeping lenses safe:
I heard leather bags could possibly build up mold inside the lenses or something, which kind of bag should I get to store lenses in, and I think I should get one of those little packets that sucks moisture out of the air and throw it in with the equipment in the bag (overprotective right? lol)
The heat here has been 95-100 degrees (110-115 index past couple of days) in Florida, as long as the overheat sign comes up and you shut it down immediately the camera won't get damaged right?
And oh geez I completely forgot this camera is a photograph camera too, I bet more people buy this guy for film then photographs lol
ROCKMORE
Veteran
The reality is with the fast processor, large sensor, view screen, and battery all in a tight sealed space you would expect it to overheat. I can feel the grip heating up by the minute from the start.
Try putting your computer in a plastic bag and shutting off the fans and see you long it takes to burn down the house.
The only way is to keep it powered down as much as possible. an external monitor would probably help as would an external power supply. For me the 550D never overheated. If I start using it as a production camera I would just get a 2nd and maybe 3rd camera and switch them out as needed. For $800 bucks the money comes back every day I use it, no complaints.
ROCKMORE
Veteran
Watch the mold factor it will kill your lenses. Try to keep your gear in a dry place. I have a Pelican case that I keep in a room that has AC. The case is sealed and when the AC is on I leave it opened for a while to dry it out. Can't be to careful with mold. It will be the end if it gets inside your lens.
Rick Burnett
Section Moderator
I have a variety of different quality UV filters. When I was at the local camera store a few days ago, I looked at 5 different UV filters, from 30 dollars to 120 dollars. I ended up going with the 70 dollar filter because when I shifted the 30 dollar filter left and right, the reflections were REALLY bad in the lens. This finally allowed me to understand why my Hoya UV filters, when on, sometimes caused bad reflections when recording during dark situations. The new filter that was 70 on my Tokina does not cause those reflections.
That said, on all my over $500 lens I have UV filters. During the day or much brigher recording, they are fine AND they do protect your lens. For me, I would rather not move the filter between multiple lens as if I want I want it for protection, I want it on ALL the time. Especially when placing the lens cap on and off in a hurry!
I do use a stepup ring setup for my ND filter (FaderND) and do use it on multple lens since it is a bit pricey (but VERY well worth it in terms of cost).
I use a Canon bag to keep my lenses in. I keep them in a dry place, so far, I've had no issues with any sort of mold. I do use a pelican case for all my tripods and stuff, but they are pricey. BUT, they are SO worth it.
The camera shuts down if it gets too hot, I haven't heard of one damaging yet. The T2I seems to be more temperature friendly as it's not designed to be so water protective as the 7D is. I can honestly say I've never had issue with my 7D, but others have. Since you are getting the T2I, you should have no problem.
While waiting for your camera, I suggest reading these two topics:
(1) Moire / Aliasing
(2) Rolling Shutter
These two things are the BIGGEST issues with DSLRs that line skip on the sensor. Both will cause you to really think out some shots on how to avoid them. (the rolling shutter isn't a line skipping issue, just a slow read/reset issue, but they both will annoy the hell out of you, trust me)
TraumaBunny
Carbonite Member
John, it's cool bro. I hope I didn't appear patronizing! Like you and everyone else here I've been sucked into the DSLR filmmaking revolution too.
The pro's make it look easy because they're in a financial position to make it look easy. If I plugged a 50 dollar guitar with no name pickups into my $2000 guitar-rig it'd sound incredible and everyone would be like, "oh he's so talented..."
It's just trickery. The whole "it's not the equipment, it's the person behind the camera..." theory is hogwash when it comes to DSLR filmmaking. It's 100% hogwash because these things aren't video cameras.
Everyone is "talented" when they have a fancy rig of equipment behind them. Those idiots on Vimeo spending $$$'s on tracking systems and cranes just to film things in their garden are morons. In the long run, where are they going? What will they achieve? Nothing. They're just indulging an expensive hobby and being praised for it in the process by other hobbyists.
They'll never make a film, not ever, not one of those guys will make an entertaining film with a plot and actors. People will soon get bored of seeing tracking shots of flower pots and bedrooms and move on. Ultimately, they're all just supporting eachother in going nowhere.
So ignore the videos on youtube and Vimeo. Dont listen to the professionals either, they're elitists and gear snobs. You know the T2i can produce amazing video just be aware that you've gotta climb a small mountain to get there first.
I have a camcorder to capture "moments" with, I use my DSLR for creative/artistic things. I want to make films and tell stories, I dont want to be like those other people filming pointless things and sticking piano instrumental in there in an effort to appear like Steven Spielberg online.
I cannot even begin to stress this enough, DSLR filmmaking is incredibly expensive. Once you get your DSLR you WILL go through a major lens phase and that'll set you back even more money. If you're short on cash well, it'll be months before you can use your DSLR in video mode. Without the gear, it's pointless for video. The additional equipment really is a necessity.
However, there ARE cheaper alternatives out there. You dont need things from Zacuto because you're not a pro, you could get by with other stuff from ebay. You can even make your own gear and that's so much fun, it's so satisfying building something and using it creatively.
The sound on the DSLR's is just abysmal. Even with a Rode in there, it sounds poor to my ears. You can't monitor sound levels in the camera.
I record sound seperately. You'll have to do all of these things too. Just be aware of what you're getting yourself into, you'll become a fellow addict just like us lol the addiction is incurable.
The pro's make it look easy because they're in a financial position to make it look easy. If I plugged a 50 dollar guitar with no name pickups into my $2000 guitar-rig it'd sound incredible and everyone would be like, "oh he's so talented..."
It's just trickery. The whole "it's not the equipment, it's the person behind the camera..." theory is hogwash when it comes to DSLR filmmaking. It's 100% hogwash because these things aren't video cameras.
Everyone is "talented" when they have a fancy rig of equipment behind them. Those idiots on Vimeo spending $$$'s on tracking systems and cranes just to film things in their garden are morons. In the long run, where are they going? What will they achieve? Nothing. They're just indulging an expensive hobby and being praised for it in the process by other hobbyists.
They'll never make a film, not ever, not one of those guys will make an entertaining film with a plot and actors. People will soon get bored of seeing tracking shots of flower pots and bedrooms and move on. Ultimately, they're all just supporting eachother in going nowhere.
So ignore the videos on youtube and Vimeo. Dont listen to the professionals either, they're elitists and gear snobs. You know the T2i can produce amazing video just be aware that you've gotta climb a small mountain to get there first.
I have a camcorder to capture "moments" with, I use my DSLR for creative/artistic things. I want to make films and tell stories, I dont want to be like those other people filming pointless things and sticking piano instrumental in there in an effort to appear like Steven Spielberg online.
I cannot even begin to stress this enough, DSLR filmmaking is incredibly expensive. Once you get your DSLR you WILL go through a major lens phase and that'll set you back even more money. If you're short on cash well, it'll be months before you can use your DSLR in video mode. Without the gear, it's pointless for video. The additional equipment really is a necessity.
However, there ARE cheaper alternatives out there. You dont need things from Zacuto because you're not a pro, you could get by with other stuff from ebay. You can even make your own gear and that's so much fun, it's so satisfying building something and using it creatively.
The sound on the DSLR's is just abysmal. Even with a Rode in there, it sounds poor to my ears. You can't monitor sound levels in the camera.
I record sound seperately. You'll have to do all of these things too. Just be aware of what you're getting yourself into, you'll become a fellow addict just like us lol the addiction is incurable.
TraumaBunny
Carbonite Member
Let's talk about "quality", look at the movie Planet Terror by Robert Rodriguez. It looks "low-quality" and it looks "cheap" but did anyone care? no, audiences loved that movie. Regular people honestly dont care, they're very easily entertained.
I mean look at all those chuckleheads people subscribe to on youtube!
This insane demand for "high quality" footage is unnecessary. HD footage really isn't the be all and end all of filmmaking. The equipment behind the camera is. Once you get your DSLR you'll be trying to make it look like film anyway and that can be a pain in the ass at first too lol
I'm using DSLR's because I got sick of using DOF adaptors on my camcorders. Man, I'm kicking myself for ever doing that now I have a DSLR. I'm using the cheapest lenses imaginable, lenses many of the pro's here wouldn't even stop to consider and I'm getting the results I want.
I'm not a vampire so I dont have to film in "low light" all the time either lol that "low light" fad is another stupid trend too. "Ooh I'm filming in low light ooh", who cares??? There's a thing called daylight out there, use it too.
I'm SO glad I swapped my 7D for the T2i it's the smartest and most practical creative decision I've made this year.
If you try competing with the pro's on Vimeo you'll fail. Please, dont get sucked into that stupid clique, it's a trap and you'll never escape that place. Dude, if I gave Steve Vai a 50 dollar guitar and a 10 dollar amp then challenged him to a "guitar battle" with me playing through my current rig he'd lose. Every note I'd play would sound a million times better and I'd appear "more talented" than him.
It's trickery, it's just a big illusion. These days everyone is published, everyone is "professional", it's a scam. Dont fall for it. Buy cheap gear, learn it, live it, love it. At the end of the day it'll lose quality once it's compressed for the internet anyway so it doesn't matter.
We need to see more videos and hear more advice from indie filmmakers, not professionals releasing videos and "webisodes" under the false pretence of being indie themselves. Like Zacuto.
It'll be us, the guerilla filmmakers who take DSLR's to the next level, not the pro's and they know it too. They're just trying to beat us to it.
I mean look at all those chuckleheads people subscribe to on youtube!
This insane demand for "high quality" footage is unnecessary. HD footage really isn't the be all and end all of filmmaking. The equipment behind the camera is. Once you get your DSLR you'll be trying to make it look like film anyway and that can be a pain in the ass at first too lol
I'm using DSLR's because I got sick of using DOF adaptors on my camcorders. Man, I'm kicking myself for ever doing that now I have a DSLR. I'm using the cheapest lenses imaginable, lenses many of the pro's here wouldn't even stop to consider and I'm getting the results I want.
I'm not a vampire so I dont have to film in "low light" all the time either lol that "low light" fad is another stupid trend too. "Ooh I'm filming in low light ooh", who cares??? There's a thing called daylight out there, use it too.
I'm SO glad I swapped my 7D for the T2i it's the smartest and most practical creative decision I've made this year.
If you try competing with the pro's on Vimeo you'll fail. Please, dont get sucked into that stupid clique, it's a trap and you'll never escape that place. Dude, if I gave Steve Vai a 50 dollar guitar and a 10 dollar amp then challenged him to a "guitar battle" with me playing through my current rig he'd lose. Every note I'd play would sound a million times better and I'd appear "more talented" than him.
It's trickery, it's just a big illusion. These days everyone is published, everyone is "professional", it's a scam. Dont fall for it. Buy cheap gear, learn it, live it, love it. At the end of the day it'll lose quality once it's compressed for the internet anyway so it doesn't matter.
We need to see more videos and hear more advice from indie filmmakers, not professionals releasing videos and "webisodes" under the false pretence of being indie themselves. Like Zacuto.
It'll be us, the guerilla filmmakers who take DSLR's to the next level, not the pro's and they know it too. They're just trying to beat us to it.
TraumaBunny
Carbonite Member
If I took my electric guitar outside with no amp and tried busking with it no one would hear a single note. I'd just end up looking like a complete ass and I'm an award winning guitarist.
It's the same with DSLR filmmaking, your DSLR is like an electric guitar but without an amplifier it's completely useless. Like an electric guitar, your DSLR physically depends on additional equipment to work. It's 100% a rock'n'roll instrument.
I swear, If I hear anyone say "it's not the camera, it's the person behind it..." again I'll snap. It's the GEAR behind the DSLR which affords you the creative freedom to be "talented" that counts. Without the gear, it's useless.
Everyone is raving about the positives of DSLR filmmaking and hardly anyone is discussing the negatives .Why? In addressing the negatives we'll develop effective, cheaper and practical solutions to the many awkward and annoying problems involved in the process of using one for video.
Here's my story. I went from camcorders with DOF adaptors to DSLR's. I was used to using a camcorder for so long that it took me a while to familiarize myself with the 7D. It was a frustrating phase. I had to re-learn everything.
It became additionally frustrating when the financial reality of using a DSLR for filmmaking dawned on me. I was so caught up in the excitement of the revolution I was robbed of my common sense. I took my 7D out with it's stock lens and tried using it like a camcorder, I wasn't happy with the results.
The quality I produced was unusable. I was expecting to have the same quality as the Vimeo guys. I'm over-imaginative and in a childish, innocent, naive way I tried finding ways around those problems. I failed.
So then I forked out some extra $$$ for a rail-system, a follow focus, a video tripod and so on. I got some step up rings, I got a Fader ND. I got a Rodes mic etc,etc,etc. I felt like such a nerd walking around with that stuff on that little camera because assembled together it looks stupid. I felt like Inspector Gadget or something.
You have to carry SO MUCH stuff around with you to use this thing for video. It's very cumbersome and the gear requires constant maintenance too.
One of my bandmates was like, "dude, what's the point? you need all that stuff just to make that little camera work?" For the price of that stuff in addition to the 7D I could've purchased a professional video camera or a bunch of T2i's. It just didn't seem right.
So I sold the 7D and got exactly the same results with the T2i instead with enough money left over for some additional lenses and goodies. In my experience, the 7D overheated a hell of alot more than my T2i. My T2i hasn't overheated yet at all.
However, it's ONLY a fabulous video camera because I have the gear to make it a fabulous video camera. Without the gear, it's simply a useless toy.
Is it worth it? In my opinion, yes. If you're creative and artistic like me and the other guys here, it's worth it 100%. I hated using DOF adaptors, I had to fork out for flip-screens and a bunch of other stuff just to use them too.
It's the same with DSLR filmmaking, your DSLR is like an electric guitar but without an amplifier it's completely useless. Like an electric guitar, your DSLR physically depends on additional equipment to work. It's 100% a rock'n'roll instrument.
I swear, If I hear anyone say "it's not the camera, it's the person behind it..." again I'll snap. It's the GEAR behind the DSLR which affords you the creative freedom to be "talented" that counts. Without the gear, it's useless.
Everyone is raving about the positives of DSLR filmmaking and hardly anyone is discussing the negatives .Why? In addressing the negatives we'll develop effective, cheaper and practical solutions to the many awkward and annoying problems involved in the process of using one for video.
Here's my story. I went from camcorders with DOF adaptors to DSLR's. I was used to using a camcorder for so long that it took me a while to familiarize myself with the 7D. It was a frustrating phase. I had to re-learn everything.
It became additionally frustrating when the financial reality of using a DSLR for filmmaking dawned on me. I was so caught up in the excitement of the revolution I was robbed of my common sense. I took my 7D out with it's stock lens and tried using it like a camcorder, I wasn't happy with the results.
The quality I produced was unusable. I was expecting to have the same quality as the Vimeo guys. I'm over-imaginative and in a childish, innocent, naive way I tried finding ways around those problems. I failed.
So then I forked out some extra $$$ for a rail-system, a follow focus, a video tripod and so on. I got some step up rings, I got a Fader ND. I got a Rodes mic etc,etc,etc. I felt like such a nerd walking around with that stuff on that little camera because assembled together it looks stupid. I felt like Inspector Gadget or something.
You have to carry SO MUCH stuff around with you to use this thing for video. It's very cumbersome and the gear requires constant maintenance too.
One of my bandmates was like, "dude, what's the point? you need all that stuff just to make that little camera work?" For the price of that stuff in addition to the 7D I could've purchased a professional video camera or a bunch of T2i's. It just didn't seem right.
So I sold the 7D and got exactly the same results with the T2i instead with enough money left over for some additional lenses and goodies. In my experience, the 7D overheated a hell of alot more than my T2i. My T2i hasn't overheated yet at all.
However, it's ONLY a fabulous video camera because I have the gear to make it a fabulous video camera. Without the gear, it's simply a useless toy.
Is it worth it? In my opinion, yes. If you're creative and artistic like me and the other guys here, it's worth it 100%. I hated using DOF adaptors, I had to fork out for flip-screens and a bunch of other stuff just to use them too.
Jawa Ex Machina
Veteran
I disagree. I've never owned a video camera (or a SLR for that matter) before I bought my 7D with primes, but I've used camcorders from time to time obviously. Having a great camera with great lenses has been vital to me learning to shoot video and stills.
You can't learn how to utilize stuff like shallow DOF if you don't have a camera to practice it on.
Artscroll
Active member
Such WISE comments here. I completely agree, especially about the Vimeo thing. I have a T2i, used to have a DOF adapter and HV20. I am completely happy with the upgrade. I also own a Merlin, a homebuilt crane, and a glideshot dolly. I love the quality but I am in a creative slump. I certainly don't want to "shoot the garden" or the neighbor's mailbox. Need to hook up with some like minded people in the Tucson area.
I couldn't agree more with the comments about how cumbersome all of the equipment appears when married with the little DSLR in public. I have a ZOOM H2 on its way and I am excited about the sound upgrade.
I am completely happy with the T2i as my main cam choice despite the rolling shutter and moire problems.
Traumabunny, I play guitar too, have now for 25 years and your choice of words to describe your experiences and this whole hobby is perfect.
I couldn't agree more with the comments about how cumbersome all of the equipment appears when married with the little DSLR in public. I have a ZOOM H2 on its way and I am excited about the sound upgrade.
I am completely happy with the T2i as my main cam choice despite the rolling shutter and moire problems.
Traumabunny, I play guitar too, have now for 25 years and your choice of words to describe your experiences and this whole hobby is perfect.
TraumaBunny
Carbonite Member
Artscroll, I'd love to hear your music man if you have any up!
I think to a certain degree some people (mostly teens) are seeing those videos on Vimeo and competing with them in a boys own bullshit kinda way. Most of the DSLR videos I see on Vimeo are faux trailers for films that will never get made. It's like "yeah wow, you made a trailer with your girlfriend in it, now where's the movie?"
They never make the movie, not ever. They just carry on emulating everyone else. There's barely any originality there at all. If an original idea appears, it'll be copied and emulated to death anyway.
It's self indulgent nonsense produced for no other reason than to celebrate owning a DSLR camera and rub other peoples noses in it in a "my GI figure is better than your GI figure" kind of way. Then there's the Adobe After-Effects nerds who are just copying everything Andrew Kramer does then passing it off like it's their own idea. The whole thing is just one big talentless trend with companies like Zacuto cashing in on it.
One day, all of these guys will realise they're going absolutely no-where and quit. The rest of us will carry on making films and achieving things.
The moment Phillip Bloom began recommending lenses which are completely out of my price range like they were "bargains" I put him on ignore and just enjoyed his amazing work instead. I'm using slow lenses and I think they're great for what I want to achieve creatively.
To them the equipment I'm using isn't even worth touching but to me, it's awesome. I'm using cheap gear that get's the job done, I'm happy BUT it did take me a while to "grow away" from my desire for expensive lenses. I took a leap of faith and I'm so glad I did.
I went through a terrible "omg I need this... and I need that... I'll never afford that..." phase until I just thought to myself, "screw this" and settled for the cheaper alternatives which do exactly the same thing anyway. Who cares if they dont have a brand name on them, they work.
I have a lens collection, sure it sucks for photography but in video mode they looks great. I found a constant aperture zoom lens for 30 bucks, I love it. I built a tracking system out of a $50 rowing machine and it's epic. I'm a Grindhouse freak, I love dirty, beat up looking films from the 70's, I'll never ever need another camera to achieve what I want to do as an artist.
If everyone else want's to compete in the "HD arena" they'll get no-where. By this time next year, I doubt anyone will be talking about 7D's, 5D's or T2i's anymore. They'll be a new toy on the scene for them to obsess over.
In 5 years maybe they'll be a 3D filmmaking phase, who know's. "Ooh I have a Canon camera and it shoots 3D movies..."
If I'd have listened to the suits from Zacuto or any of the professionals online I wouldn't have done ANYTHING with my DSLR. I would've sat around waiting and waiting and waiting for the money to buy their gear until giving up completely. They're paid for promoting that equipment or rewarded with additional equipment for doing so, they're just glorified sales people in my opinion.
I love my T2i, I adore it. It's always in my hands, I'm always fiddling with it. It's become part of me now, just like my guitars are part of me too. It's one of the finest rock'n'roll instruments I've ever played.
I think to a certain degree some people (mostly teens) are seeing those videos on Vimeo and competing with them in a boys own bullshit kinda way. Most of the DSLR videos I see on Vimeo are faux trailers for films that will never get made. It's like "yeah wow, you made a trailer with your girlfriend in it, now where's the movie?"
They never make the movie, not ever. They just carry on emulating everyone else. There's barely any originality there at all. If an original idea appears, it'll be copied and emulated to death anyway.
It's self indulgent nonsense produced for no other reason than to celebrate owning a DSLR camera and rub other peoples noses in it in a "my GI figure is better than your GI figure" kind of way. Then there's the Adobe After-Effects nerds who are just copying everything Andrew Kramer does then passing it off like it's their own idea. The whole thing is just one big talentless trend with companies like Zacuto cashing in on it.
One day, all of these guys will realise they're going absolutely no-where and quit. The rest of us will carry on making films and achieving things.
The moment Phillip Bloom began recommending lenses which are completely out of my price range like they were "bargains" I put him on ignore and just enjoyed his amazing work instead. I'm using slow lenses and I think they're great for what I want to achieve creatively.
To them the equipment I'm using isn't even worth touching but to me, it's awesome. I'm using cheap gear that get's the job done, I'm happy BUT it did take me a while to "grow away" from my desire for expensive lenses. I took a leap of faith and I'm so glad I did.
I went through a terrible "omg I need this... and I need that... I'll never afford that..." phase until I just thought to myself, "screw this" and settled for the cheaper alternatives which do exactly the same thing anyway. Who cares if they dont have a brand name on them, they work.
I have a lens collection, sure it sucks for photography but in video mode they looks great. I found a constant aperture zoom lens for 30 bucks, I love it. I built a tracking system out of a $50 rowing machine and it's epic. I'm a Grindhouse freak, I love dirty, beat up looking films from the 70's, I'll never ever need another camera to achieve what I want to do as an artist.
If everyone else want's to compete in the "HD arena" they'll get no-where. By this time next year, I doubt anyone will be talking about 7D's, 5D's or T2i's anymore. They'll be a new toy on the scene for them to obsess over.
In 5 years maybe they'll be a 3D filmmaking phase, who know's. "Ooh I have a Canon camera and it shoots 3D movies..."
If I'd have listened to the suits from Zacuto or any of the professionals online I wouldn't have done ANYTHING with my DSLR. I would've sat around waiting and waiting and waiting for the money to buy their gear until giving up completely. They're paid for promoting that equipment or rewarded with additional equipment for doing so, they're just glorified sales people in my opinion.
I love my T2i, I adore it. It's always in my hands, I'm always fiddling with it. It's become part of me now, just like my guitars are part of me too. It's one of the finest rock'n'roll instruments I've ever played.
TraumaBunny
Carbonite Member
Man, I remember my first DOF adaptor and 50mm lens. I got that thing and felt like Robert Rodriguez until I discovered the limitations of filming with one lol after 2 hours of filming my little bubble had burst. I had a headache from looking at an upside image. I was trying to film everything with that lens, man, it's embarrassing in hindsight.
Back then I figured all I'd need to make a movie would be a DOF adapter and a 50mm lens because the advertisements made it seem that way lol depth-of-field is only good in small doses and once you get your DSLR you may realise this too.
In fact, you may grow a little sick of it. You can't get much from a 50mm lens in video mode. You'll need several other lenses to produce an interesting scene IMO. You wont bother learning with the stock lens that comes with your camera, you'll just twist it one way, then another and be like "ugh... why isn't it like my camcorder..." because you'll be in a mad rush to do something boss to show off.
You're forced to learn and once you learn, you're flying.
The reason why guys on Vimeo are filming things in their garden is because they're easy to focus on and have predictable movements. Once you start filming human beings everything changes, your approach to color grading, focusing, lenses and frame rates changes too.
You'll be asking people to remain still so you can keep them in focus or while you adjust settings or change your lens for a different shot, your friends and family members will only tolerate that for so long. I've lost band members over this lol
I really got suckered into all that corporate advertising online. I'm over-imaginative and super-creative, this often makes me naive because I'm a dreamer and live to express myself. The corporations are totally aware of this, they know what people like us are like and how to fiddle us out of money too.
Personally, the most annoying thing about DSLR filmmaking is editing the footage together in a computer. I find editing DSLR footage to be a strain because it's time consuming and often takes hours to render. It's frustrating as hell.
The footage you film will look amazing in your editing software, you'll be dribbling because the quality looks so good but then you'll render it, upload it and be like "oh..." then you'll make a series of excuses... "umm... hey guys thank's for checking out my video PLEASE watch it in HD (they wont) I swear it looks even better when it isn't compressed like this... (they wont care) "
If you have a follow-focus system you can squeeze more from your lenses but you'll always need more. You'll go through an embarrassing phase of asking people questions like "hey what lens did you use?" only to get a catty or belittling reply in return.
They'll recommend equipment you'll never afford for no other reason than to reassure you that they're professional and you're not. So just do what I do, screw those people and learn from your own mistakes.
Back then I figured all I'd need to make a movie would be a DOF adapter and a 50mm lens because the advertisements made it seem that way lol depth-of-field is only good in small doses and once you get your DSLR you may realise this too.
In fact, you may grow a little sick of it. You can't get much from a 50mm lens in video mode. You'll need several other lenses to produce an interesting scene IMO. You wont bother learning with the stock lens that comes with your camera, you'll just twist it one way, then another and be like "ugh... why isn't it like my camcorder..." because you'll be in a mad rush to do something boss to show off.
You're forced to learn and once you learn, you're flying.
The reason why guys on Vimeo are filming things in their garden is because they're easy to focus on and have predictable movements. Once you start filming human beings everything changes, your approach to color grading, focusing, lenses and frame rates changes too.
You'll be asking people to remain still so you can keep them in focus or while you adjust settings or change your lens for a different shot, your friends and family members will only tolerate that for so long. I've lost band members over this lol
I really got suckered into all that corporate advertising online. I'm over-imaginative and super-creative, this often makes me naive because I'm a dreamer and live to express myself. The corporations are totally aware of this, they know what people like us are like and how to fiddle us out of money too.
Personally, the most annoying thing about DSLR filmmaking is editing the footage together in a computer. I find editing DSLR footage to be a strain because it's time consuming and often takes hours to render. It's frustrating as hell.
The footage you film will look amazing in your editing software, you'll be dribbling because the quality looks so good but then you'll render it, upload it and be like "oh..." then you'll make a series of excuses... "umm... hey guys thank's for checking out my video PLEASE watch it in HD (they wont) I swear it looks even better when it isn't compressed like this... (they wont care) "
If you have a follow-focus system you can squeeze more from your lenses but you'll always need more. You'll go through an embarrassing phase of asking people questions like "hey what lens did you use?" only to get a catty or belittling reply in return.
They'll recommend equipment you'll never afford for no other reason than to reassure you that they're professional and you're not. So just do what I do, screw those people and learn from your own mistakes.
No I agree, I meant you will have to learn WITH your SLR like I did. I learned to photograph by trial and error and experamenting with my SLR. My point is you really do have to learn to become one though because if you don't your video's are going to look like hell.
Dude, Trauma, I swear you're spot on with everything. I have already had the same feeling about "needing everything" and I've already asked like 3 people on their vimeo videos what lens they used lmao, I've already kind of "given up" in getting the super expensive lenses, I found some old vintage lenses on ebay that are pretty cheap I'm going to order if I get a chance ( check that t2i vintage thread in t2i footage ) I mean, the quality of the footage they produced looked good to me, and check out this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fqn6mWuqwE0
This video supposedly used the kit lens, but it looks damn good to me, of course that guy has a support system filming I think, I looked at his youtube page and he has some giant stabilizer on his stomach lol
And I really hate the Andrew Kramer thing, I seen that alot I use to get mad at it but kind of just let it go, cause everyone is just posting his effects, putting his effects in their videos and everyone else is like "awesome, wow, amazing" just pissed me off literally so many people like don't even try to learn from the tutorial, I'm convinced half of them just download the project file and render it.
Also question about follow focus, it's just a wheel you add to easier turn the focus ring? couldn't you turn it with your hand?
I can't tell Trauma, did you buy all the expensive equipment cause you said you got suckered in, or did you settle for cheap stuff?
I plan on spending around 2000$ total on this stuff
900$ camera
250$ tripod
250$ Rode+zoomh1
30$ bag
70$ battery+sdhc card
100$ Lens 50MM F1.8, 300$ on 2 vintage lenses (or maybe I should just buy a 400$ one new lense)
I'll probably try to build my own steady cam, there's so many DIY tutorials out there
Then some filters probably.
I think I should be pretty set with all of that, hopefully I -wont- want more lenses. I mean I really can't tell the difference in most of the videos I see around the web, I know the fault of the kit lens with the aperture thing, but the quality of the video looks good as the 600$ lenses I looked up. Maybe I just can't tell on youtube or vimeo, I need to find some proper comparisons between cheap and expensive lenses..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fqn6mWuqwE0
This video supposedly used the kit lens, but it looks damn good to me, of course that guy has a support system filming I think, I looked at his youtube page and he has some giant stabilizer on his stomach lol
And I really hate the Andrew Kramer thing, I seen that alot I use to get mad at it but kind of just let it go, cause everyone is just posting his effects, putting his effects in their videos and everyone else is like "awesome, wow, amazing" just pissed me off literally so many people like don't even try to learn from the tutorial, I'm convinced half of them just download the project file and render it.
Also question about follow focus, it's just a wheel you add to easier turn the focus ring? couldn't you turn it with your hand?
I can't tell Trauma, did you buy all the expensive equipment cause you said you got suckered in, or did you settle for cheap stuff?
I plan on spending around 2000$ total on this stuff
900$ camera
250$ tripod
250$ Rode+zoomh1
30$ bag
70$ battery+sdhc card
100$ Lens 50MM F1.8, 300$ on 2 vintage lenses (or maybe I should just buy a 400$ one new lense)
I'll probably try to build my own steady cam, there's so many DIY tutorials out there
Then some filters probably.
I think I should be pretty set with all of that, hopefully I -wont- want more lenses. I mean I really can't tell the difference in most of the videos I see around the web, I know the fault of the kit lens with the aperture thing, but the quality of the video looks good as the 600$ lenses I looked up. Maybe I just can't tell on youtube or vimeo, I need to find some proper comparisons between cheap and expensive lenses..
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