Stress and panic over audio

C

chumba

New member
I'm sorry this is my first post, but I'm not really sure what to do as I'm so out of my element and I'm having some internal panic over a topic that I'm not educated on.

Not to go into gritty detail, but a close friend of mine was diagnosed this week with aggressive cancer and she was given about 6 weeks to live. When she found out, she came to me and asked me before it gets bad if I would help her film videos, in a documentary style, so she could tell everyone she's leaving behind how much she cares about them and how much they mean to her and have that memory be before it goes downhill.

However, I'm not a hardware/camera guy. I'm an after effects guy who does photography on the side.

I have a D300s which I've played with the video before and gotten wonderful results, but in all my experiences the audio is horrible from the camera. So, I started researching about inexpensive external audio options and all the headache with getting audio working with the D300 between special audio cables, external recorders, XLR converters, external audio recorders.

Essentially it comes down to the audio.

I am in a total panic as she has no money (nor would I ask her for any), and I have little time to become well-educated on the latest and most cost effective solution. I would be willing to invest some money in an audio solution but I want it to be worthy of essentially her last message she will ever tell these people (without breaking my wallet).

Can anyone give me a crash course and shopping list that will work with my D300s to help her out, or point me to the right person/place to find the appropriate research? I really don't want to screw this up and I have precious time wasting :(.

Thank you all so very, very much for your time, knowledge, and patience.
 
Based on the information you've provided, especially your budget, and my best suggestion would be something like a tascam DR-05 and an inexpensive wired lav that can run off of plug-in power, something like the Audio Technica ATR3350. Total outlay will be about $150. You'll still have to sync in post but for something like you're doing you can use the scratch audio from the camera, and a simple hand clap and call. No, you won't get production quality sound, but you'll get something much, much better than what you're getting straight from the camera mic.

The only other suggestion I would offer is to plead your case to a production sound person in your area. If you're in the Atlanta area I'll do it.
 
My guess is there are plenty of pros right here that can help if they knew where you are at, or you can try a listing for assistance on Craigslist in your area?
 
Thank you all so much for your help. I truly can't tell you how much it means. As much as I'd love to put out feelers to ask for a sound person, I know there's no way she'd let anyone else be involved. It's still all really raw for her right now, and it would be one more thing for her to worry over.

In some ways, it's so surreal and I can't even believe I'm being asked to do this, but at the same time the last thing I want to do is screw it up or not do it justice.

gpforet > Thanks for your suggestion. I appreciate your sensitivity to the cost factor.

If I wanted to hide the mic so it's not visible in the video's, is this easy with a clip-on mic? Could I get a shotgun mic with the same external audio recorder and put it above her?
 
I'd bet a local sound guy would still be able to help out with gear loans / pointers.

A mic just out of frame above her probably work well, but gpforet's lav/recorder solution is more cost effective. A basic shotgun is at least $200 and they're not really suitable indoors and you'd need a pricier recorder.

A simple $25 mic from Giant Squid or AT and a Zoom H1 or Tascam DR-05 will certainly get the job done. Just remember to monitor the audio while you're recording.

There's a sticky on hiding lavs that should be helpful.

Any questions / help you need, just ask, there are people from all over the world on this board happy to help out.
 
Chumba,

By help folks are not nec. asking to be there. For instance someone could come over and help you get set up and go over hows and whys and what to watch out for. It's a LOT better in person. But with out knowing where you are geographically your missing out on that. For me anyway I don't want to be at the shoot. It would be awkward, but I could probably help you a lot in figuring out what would work for you and doing some quick training. But that only works if your close enough.
 
i think something like a zoom H1 would work just fine with its own mics. if you are in a quiet room you can keep it out of frame and pick up pretty well. not IDEAL but better than the cam mic and cheap and unobtrusive.
 
There's a great stickie at the top that describes ways to hide a lav.

chumba said:
Thank you all so much for your help. I truly can't tell you how much it means. As much as I'd love to put out feelers to ask for a sound person, I know there's no way she'd let anyone else be involved. It's still all really raw for her right now, and it would be one more thing for her to worry over.

In some ways, it's so surreal and I can't even believe I'm being asked to do this, but at the same time the last thing I want to do is screw it up or not do it justice.

gpforet > Thanks for your suggestion. I appreciate your sensitivity to the cost factor.

If I wanted to hide the mic so it's not visible in the video's, is this easy with a clip-on mic? Could I get a shotgun mic with the same external audio recorder and put it above her?
Click to expand...
 
All good advice here, and awesome to see people offering to help. But, seeing as you're limited on time, budget, and know-how, I think the best thing for you to do would be to get a simple on-camera shotgun microphone. Just keep it simple. Recording onto an external audio recorder will give you better results, but it requires that you know how to adjust the settings on the recorder, and know how to properly use it to get good sound when shooting, and then it requires that you sync the sound in post (which will slow down your process).

I've borrowed a Nikon D300s many times to test audio equipment with for my blog. I think a great option for you would be to get a Sennheiser MKE 400, and also get the MZW400 wind protection kit, just in case she wants to shoot outdoors. Extra wind protection is 100% necessary for outdoor use.

The big trick in audio is keeping the microphone as close as possible to the person speaking to the camera. If you keep that basic principle in mind as you create these videos, you'll get good usable sound with the D300s and a mic like the MKE 400. If you want to do super wide shots where the subject isn't directly in front of the camera, just don't have her speak to the camera in these shots. Keep the mic close when ever there is dialog. If she's moving around and speaking to people, just get the camera/mic close to her when she speaks.

You can get a 10 foot extension cable for the mic. This would allow you to mount the microphone closer to the subject. You can gaff tape the mic to a light stand or some other object. Just don't get a cable longer than 10 feet. The kind of cable you need would be a female stereo 3.5mm to a male stereo 3.5mm. Radio Shack or other kinds of electronics stores should have them.

You can hear what the MKE 400 sounds like going into the D300s on my Great On-Camera Mic Shootout video:
http://www.sam-mallery.com/archives/566

Make sure to run tests when you get the mic, so you understand its limitations, and you know how to work it. Be sure to watch your footage as you work, to make sure the connection between the mic and the camera is intact. You don't want any surprises after a shoot. Check your gear as you work to make sure it remains operational.

Good luck. God's speed.
 
I think one of the easiest things you could do to help you get good sound is make sure you find a very quiet place to record this.

Not just away from actual noise but also a room that "sounds" quiet. No marble floors, empty rooms..etc.

Find a room with carpet, possibly some curtains on the walls and a decent amount of objects in the room like couches and such.

That being said, while not ideal I would have to agree with Sam that you might just be best with the camera mic.
Using external mics, and adjusting levels when you dont have a lot of experience is just adding to the possibility of a mistake somewhere and messing up
what is most important here. CONTENT.

Obviously no one watching this is going to say to themselves "this doesn't sound like a movie".
Just put the camera close to her (not across the room) and let her do her thing.

I think a lav mic is just asking for trouble (especially hiding it) if she starts to get emotional which I think is a given.

Good luck with this.
 
One of the inexpensive lavalier mics from Audio-Technica may serve your purpose very well. Here are two of them that I happen to know a little bit about:

1) ATR3350, which costs about $20 and comes with 6.5 meter cable. Here is a video review:

http://www.amazon.com/review/ROLB6Z...nodeID=11091801&tag=&linkCode=#wasThisHelpful


2) ATR 288W, which is more or less a wireless version of the wired version and costs about $130. Here is a video review:

http://www.amazon.com/review/RVO7KI...R&nodeID=172282&tag=&linkCode=#wasThisHelpful


The video will tell if they are good enough for your purpose. I believe they are, but anyway watch the video and see for yourself.


I have ATR3350. Its audio quality can't compete with the more expensive mics that I have. But for the purpose of making a clean recording of someone's talking in a casual/everyday style, it can easily do an excellent job. For that purpose, it just needs to be clipped/hanged/placed/mounted to somewhere very close to the sound source - within a few inches. It can easily be made to sound better or much better than a typical on-board mic, which can't be moved to anywhere closer to the speaker than can the video/dSLR camera or the recorder like Zoom H4.

As for the recorder, I don't think you need an expensive pro-grade one. The camera itself you'll be using may already be good enough. And any digital recorder should be too.

I think the trick that matters most for your purpose is to get your mic close enough. Mounting an expensive shotgun mic on camera is not likely going to yield as good a result as a well placed most inexpensive lav like ATR3350.
 
I want to thank you all for your wonderful advice.

To be safe, I went ahead and got the inexpensive ATR3350 and a Tascam DR-03. Thanks to all of you, I was able to keep my budget under $100 and I'll have a back-up source of audio in case the camera doesn't do the trick (I'll record with both to be sure). We're going to get together tonight and tomorrow so we can pick a place for her to do it and I can do some testing before she sits down. My anxiety about this whole last-minute project is greatly diminished, again thanks to all of you. I don't know if I would have been able to figure as much out as I have in such a short time without all your extremely helpful advice.

As a side note, I noticed the lav mics are mono, but the tascam has a line-in/mic plug. Do I need to worry about a mono mic going into the recorder? Also, another crazy question, is it possible to hook up two mono mics and have each mic go to a discrete channel?

Thanks again everyone, truly!
 
chumba said:
As a side note, I noticed the lav mics are mono, but the tascam has a line-in/mic plug. Do I need to worry about a mono mic going into the recorder?
Click to expand...

This isn't something to worry about. The only thing you'll notice is that the audio from the mic will only record to one side of the stereo spectrum, so, in other words, when you play back a recorded file and listen on headphones, you should only hear the audio on one side of the headphones. This isn't an issue. You're recording with a mono mic, so you're making a mono recording. In your post production software you can pan the audio in the middle so that you can hear it on both sides (if you were to watch the video on headphones).

chumba said:
Also, another crazy question, is it possible to hook up two mono mics and have each mic go to a discrete channel?
Click to expand...

This is not advisable, especially if you're just using a cheap Y-cable splitter. The microphone input on your recorder has a set impedance tolerance. Plugging one consumer microphone into it is no problem. However, if you plug two microphones in, the impedance will be thrown off balance, and it's likely that the audio quality would suffer.

chumba said:
Thanks again everyone, truly!
Click to expand...

Glad we could help. Remember to do some tests before you begin. The DR03 comes with a 2GB micro SD card. Make sure you have enough memory for the duration of your shoot.
 
zaarc said:
i think something like a zoom H1 would work just fine with its own mics. if you are in a quiet room you can keep it out of frame and pick up pretty well. not IDEAL but better than the cam mic and cheap and unobtrusive.
Click to expand...

+1, couldn't agree more. YUou can find them at bestbuy for under one hundred bucks, 89.00 to be exact. But yeah, this is perfect for quick decent audio. Plus you can teach her to use it in minutes, this way if she needs to record audio when your not around, it should be fairly easy. good advice:)
 
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