Steadicam vs Artemis

C

c3kings

Well-known member
Dear All,

I am thinking investing a stablizing system, either Steadicam or Artemis, at this moment.

My setup is a HVX200 with M2 adapter and a Zeiss lens, so it is about 6-7 kg.

Steadicam is the inventor of this kind of stablizing system, but many years ago, I bough a Steadicam Jr, and it was very disappointing. It broke many times, and I sent it back to repair twice. You know, it was just plastic toy. So, for this time, if I really go for Steadicam, I won't go for Mrelin, but something like Flyer, but I am not sure if Flyer can take 6 -7 kg. Any experenice of it?

For Artemis, I like its company, Sachtler, a lot and trust it. But, well, now I am talking about a stablizing system, and I am not sure if I can rely on it as much as its tripod system. Anyone has used Artemis?

Thanks for any kind of inputs, maybe even another brand suggestions?

King
 
The Flyer is capable of carrying right around 9 kg, and would be a much better system I think than the Artemis, in terms of product reliability and support. Steadicam is the industry standard in camera stabilizing rigs, and I would take one of their rigs over any other if I had a choice.
 
Andrew Brinkhaus said:
The Flyer is capable of carrying right around 9 kg, and would be a much better system I think than the Artemis, in terms of product reliability and support. Steadicam is the industry standard in camera stabilizing rigs, and I would take one of their rigs over any other if I had a choice.
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thanks, andrew.
and it is somehow cheaper, too. I thinki it is just because of the horrible experience of Steadicam Jr and the satisfaction that I have had from Sachtler tripod system.
thanks again.
King
 
In the past 5 or so years, the Tiffen company has really done some excellent things with the Steadicam products. I would agree the JR was nothing special, however the current Merlin, Pilot and Flyer are all amazing pieces of equipment. All due respect to Artemis, the Steadicam products just take everything to a different level. And yes, the Flyer will support 7kg.

I'll disclaim that I have no affiliation with any of the aforementioned companies. I speak from experience.
 
The Tiffen Steadicam is an industry standard for a reason.

If you are going to use a 35mm adapter with it, set aside enough money for a Preston wireless follow focus.
 
thanks, Afton Grant and Matt G. I tend to buying steadicam, actually. but any Artemis' fans here?
Thank you very much.
King
 
Go with the new Flyer LE. It can hold up to 19lbs (9 kg) and it has improve adjustability, bigger grip, lots of cool new things.

It was officially announced this year at NAB 2008.

I'm flying a RED below on the new LE.
2419704374_fe6955660b_o.jpg
 
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mcgeedigital said:
The Tiffen Steadicam is an industry standard for a reason.

If you are going to use a 35mm adapter with it, set aside enough money for a Preston wireless follow focus.
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Hey Matt. Yes, Preston does make a top-of-the-line wireless focus system - but I think it might be a bit overkill for what King is looking for. Essentially, you've just recommended he set aside an ADDITIONAL $35,000 for a focus kit that does far more than what a simple Flyer user would ever need.

The prosumer sized cameras out now still have relatively generous depths of field, making pulling focus while operating not as critical as it may be with 35mm for instance. A wireless FF is certainly a good thing to have, however. I've seen a number of "smaller" kits released in the past couple years in the $1000 range. I can't speak for any of their performance though. The most simple and reliable kit that is truly recognized by the professionals is the Bartech. A hand unit and motor kit will run about $4500.
 
Varizoom has relabeled a wireless follow focus MADE by Bartech... Personally, I would rather have Bartech's name on my gear, but offers a viable solution. It's probably the same cost-it's the same unit I believe. One motor only, so either focus or zoom---I'm probably wrong there, but the motor is fantastic.
I bought a stabilizer system about 4 years ago from the same people who make Cammate Jibs. (Cammate Steady Shot) Although a good learning platform, and in my opinion, better than a Glidecam V-8 or V-16 ----(When I bought it)------ ( I could muscle up a SDX900 on it).
I throughly enjoyed testing out the Artemis at NAB. I very much enjoyed speaking to their engineer and his assistant for quite some time. I thought the Artemis Cine' was one fine rig indeed. Practising with it, with the RED camera and a wide angle prime was a treat as well.
The fit and finish, craftsmanship, ease of balance, practically a tool- less operation made a big fan out of me. If I wasn't using my money for more grip and electric gear, and just finishing putting shelves in my grip trailer, I would certainly enjoy owning the Artemis. I believe there was an equipment review of several "Steadicam " type devices last year in a video magazine. (can't remember which one or which month -sorry) but the author thought that the Artemis was the winner is almost every category. My 2 cents
 
filmat11 said:
Varizoom has relabeled a wireless follow focus MADE by Bartech... Personally, I would rather have Bartech's name on my gear, but offers a viable solution. It's probably the same cost-it's the same unit I believe. One motor only, so either focus or zoom---I'm probably wrong there, but the motor is fantastic.
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The Varizoom and Bartech are identical in almost every way, including price, so one is not really any more of a solution over the other. They'd both do the job very well. They are NOT zoom controllers, however. Focus/iris only. Bartech does make a zoom controller, but be sure to note the motor and controller for zoom is much different than that of focus/iris.


filmat11 said:
I believe there was an equipment review of several "Steadicam " type devices last year in a video magazine. (can't remember which one or which month -sorry) but the author thought that the Artemis was the winner is almost every category. My 2 cents
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I'd be very interested to read this article. In my opinion, the merits of any system cannot be decided in any short-term tests. Steadicam, PRO, XCS, etc are the brands they are because they have years and years of reliable performance in the field under all conditions, and they're all backed up by excellent personal customer service.
 
AftonGrant said:
The Varizoom and Bartech are identical in almost every way, including price, so one is not really any more of a solution over the other. They'd both do the job very well. They are NOT zoom controllers, however. Focus/iris only. Bartech does make a zoom controller, but be sure to note the motor and controller for zoom is much different than that of focus/iris.





I'd be very interested to read this article. In my opinion, the merits of any system cannot be decided in any short-term tests. Steadicam, PRO, XCS, etc are the brands they are because they have years and years of reliable performance in the field under all conditions, and they're all backed up by excellent personal customer service.
Click to expand...


"""Your absolutly right, and thank you for clarifing----No doubt the unit which we both refer to is a very good one indeed.""" As far as focus and zoom, I stand corrected, but did see the unit demo'd as the focus unit...Very tight unit, very, very nice.
Have seen and used them before, just not at that price point...
the CMotion units are way cool $$$$ Ouch.









""Yeah, I kept that issue of the magazine for several months... The cover had several mentions of articles on the inside(like most of them do) and a photo (digitally enhanced) showing the author / operator using one of the rigs he has reviewing. The author, apparently, also teaches Marshall arts.. If that helps..I bring it up, as he mentions it in the article, including a photo of him in front of two people practising karate or something similar... Does this jog anyone else's memory ??? """
 
thank you for all of you, and I do need to set aside some money for a remote focusing system.
Oh yes, I would like to read the article mentioned by filmat11 too if possible.
King
 
Artemis is a very well built rig but has a MAJOR design mistake. The drop or the gimble placement is a tools free operation that requires the operator to use both hands, leaving the camera unattended. If you have a heavy camera with a 35mm adapter on a artemis, it might fly right off the rig.

Even the most elite operators have made mistakes like forgetting to tighten down the sled (myself included) but saved the day because you NEVER EVER NEVER EVER EVER NEVER NEVER take one hand of the rig. Every workshop or instructer you work with will pound that into your brain.

The artemis forces you to do just that.

PS: I second all the statements that steadicam is the way to go but also add that sachtlers units are the best built next to steadicam.They are light years ahead of glidecam and all other brands. Just their overall designs including their high end units are inferior to steadicam.

PSS: Afton, thanks for steadishots!!!! it is a great resource to have.
 
emretufekci said:
Artemis is a very well built rig but has a MAJOR design mistake. The drop or the gimble placement is a tools free operation that requires the operator to use both hands, leaving the camera unattended. If you have a heavy camera with a 35mm adapter on a artemis, it might fly right off the rig.


Interesting... Can you explain this further... ? Are you suggesting that Sachler forgot to add a tripod plate tensioner/ quick release knob ???
I'm not arguing or anything, I just need clarification . Thanks..

Ps, does this description also refer to the Cine version...
Click to expand...
 
AftonGrant said:
Hey Matt. Yes, Preston does make a top-of-the-line wireless focus system - but I think it might be a bit overkill for what King is looking for. Essentially, you've just recommended he set aside an ADDITIONAL $35,000 for a focus kit that does far more than what a simple Flyer user would ever need.

The prosumer sized cameras out now still have relatively generous depths of field, making pulling focus while operating not as critical as it may be with 35mm for instance. A wireless FF is certainly a good thing to have, however. I've seen a number of "smaller" kits released in the past couple years in the $1000 range. I can't speak for any of their performance though. The most simple and reliable kit that is truly recognized by the professionals is the Bartech. A hand unit and motor kit will run about $4500.
Click to expand...

I know.


I SHOULD have said, "make sure you set aside enough $$$ for RENTING a good radio FF".

My bad.
 
On the center of the post where the gimble is mounted (where you adjust the drop) steadicam flyer has the only tool needed operation, that way you can get the torque you need with out taking your hand off the camera (on larger rigs this is also no tools with a single tension clip) . On the artemis this is a twist off action where you have to hold the post in the middle while turning the knobs opposite directions. This will require you to take your hand of the camera.

The camera plate is built pretty solid and holds pretty firmly on the sachtler. But as the camera weight increases with 35mm adapters, lenses, matteboxes,filters and FF units the possibilty of slipage or forgetting to tighten down the lock is very possible.

That is a very serious safety concern, in my opinion. The cine version does not have this problem but almost every single setting on it requires a tool and that slows down production.

Dont get me wrong, I am not against sachtler. I think they have one of the best engineered units out there after steadicam. It's just that steadicam is years ahead of anybody as far as functionality and ease of use.
 
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filmat11 said:
emretufekci said:
Artemis is a very well built rig but has a MAJOR design mistake. The drop or the gimble placement is a tools free operation that requires the operator to use both hands, leaving the camera unattended. If you have a heavy camera with a 35mm adapter on a artemis, it might fly right off the rig.
Click to expand...

Interesting... Can you explain this further... ? Are you suggesting that Sachler forgot to add a tripod plate tensioner/ quick release knob ???
I'm not arguing or anything, I just need clarification . Thanks..

Ps, does this description also refer to the Cine version...
Click to expand...

I think he's referring to the gimbal adjustment design. It appears as though the gimbal grip is tightened/loosened by grabbing it with two hands and twisting it with a "wringing out a rag" motion. I'll agree it's a little awkward.

Most rigs these days do have a tools-free gimbal adjustment. Accidents are avoided by tilting the rig sideways before loosening the gimbal. As long as the post is horizontal, even if the gimbal is completely open, the post shouldn't slide and the rig won't fall. Just make sure you tighten it before tilting back to vertical.

Sachtler makes some excellent gear (those crazy Germans!). I'd put their rigs in the top five brands worldwide and wouldn't be displeased at all if that was all I had to use. Domestic customer service is a big factor, however. That's one thing that keeps Steadicam, PRO, and XCS so big here in the US.
 
Hi,

I have a flyer and its great. I regularly fly adapter rigs, SGpros with HVX200, Z1, redrock M2, P+S etc. I have also flown an F900 on my Flyer, an Arriflex SR3 and recently a RedOne, it can take a lot more than it looks like it can...
 
hoarp001 said:
Hi,

I have a flyer and its great. I regularly fly adapter rigs, SGpros with HVX200, Z1, redrock M2, P+S etc. I have also flown an F900 on my Flyer, an Arriflex SR3 and recently a RedOne, it can take a lot more than it looks like it can...
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hoarp001, It sounds very potential to me, as more capacity is always a plus. In fact, I have an old artemis, which can take only 2kg, which is less than the weight of HVX200. That's actaully one of the reasons making me to get a more serious stabalizer.
Thanks.
King
 
filmat11 said:
. I believe there was an equipment review of several "Steadicam " type devices last year in a video magazine. (can't remember which one or which month -sorry) but the author thought that the Artemis was the winner is almost every category. My 2 cents
Click to expand...

As Afton stated it is very hard to decide on a short term test on a rig. You also have to consider (I have not seen the article or know the author) who is writing the article. A working, full time, Elite operator with major production experience under his belt or a experienced cameraman who has some knowledge+experience with enrty level rigs.

I personnally find the smaller rigs much harder to fly then my full size rig. I do not have the advantages,tools and the mass that a large rig flys. Taking that into considration I found the flyer+flyer LE to be easier to balance and fly. I though flying the artemis was like trying to balance a ping pong ball on a wet noodle.
 
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