Sony Cinema Line & FX6

[Grug]

To his point about the top handle, I wonder if Sony will allow 3rd party attachments so that something like Wooden Caerm can provide XLR to the side and a more robust top handle? IDK. Probably not.

I think Vocas (or maybe Shape) have come up with a decent looking top plate, that sits around the top handle (and sits level with the internal edge of it) - which is handy because you'll be able to mount a 15mm rod clamp inside the top handle and run 15mm rods out over the lens to use a more conventional Arri-style EVF/Monitor mounting system.

If the handle's robust enough in and of itself, that might be enough to make it okay.

I can certainly see some people dismantling the top handle though, to rip out the cabling and XLRs, so that they can mount them somewhere else.

 

[andykwilkinson]

As a Sony FS5 owner the idea of putting both XLRs back onto the handle and not even having a 3.5mm audio input in on the body is the one design choice I'm really struggling with. Why take such a basic step backwards! I'm seriously considering the FX6 come the Spring if work continues to pick up once this dreaded plague has subsided (but have not totally ruled out the Canon C70 yet).

I use my FS5 frequently on a gymbal (Letus Helix Junior), often with a Sennheiser G3 receiver plugged into the FS5's one XLR) as you'd expect getting audio from a lav on the talent. Whilst it's easily doable, it would be a bit of a pain to match up audio recorded elsewhere to camera narrative - and sure, the onboard scratch mic will help a bit. But really Sony, who did you ask when designing your cameras and this one in particular? Please don't ask the people who said this would be a good idea ever again!!!

I too would be interested in some kind of small, reasonably light 3rd party plug in box that sits on the top of the FX6 (or has a short cable and a mounting point that allows you to position it where you want). The way out of this has got to be an add-on that uses that (proprietary) top connection socket for the handle (I assume its similar to the one on my FS5 - looks it from the videos I've seen). I wonder if Sony would release the connection pin data?

 

[Guest]

I can certainly see some people dismantling the top handle though, to rip out the cabling and XLRs, so that they can mount them somewhere else.

^^^^That's the pro move right there!

 

[Guest]

As a Sony FS5 owner the idea of putting both XLRs back onto the handle and not even having a 3.5mm audio input in on the body is the one design choice I'm really struggling with. Why take such a basic step backwards! I'm seriously considering the FX6 come the Spring if work continues to pick up once this dreaded plague has subsided (but have not totally ruled out the Canon C70 yet).

I use my FS5 frequently on a gymbal (Letus Helix Junior), often with a Sennheiser G3 receiver plugged into the FS5's one XLR) as you'd expect getting audio from a lav on the talent. Whilst it's easily doable, it would be a bit of a pain to match up audio recorded elsewhere to camera narrative - and sure, the onboard scratch mic will help a bit. But really Sony, who did you ask when designing your cameras and this one in particular? Please don't ask the people who said this would be a good idea ever again!!!

I too would be interested in some kind of small, reasonably light 3rd party plug in box that sits on the top of the FX6 (or has a short cable and a mounting point that allows you to position it where you want). The way out of this has got to be an add-on that uses that (proprietary) top connection socket for the handle (I assume its similar to the one on my FS5 - looks it from the videos I've seen). I wonder if Sony would release the connection pin data?

They should have put a phantom powered XLR on the Fx6 body, no doubt about that! Likely the biggest obvious mistep in that camera's design. Right after that it would be no EVF.

 

[Guest]

A questions for Fs5 and Canon C shooters, how much do you like those side handles? Is it really important? I find myself wondering if having a slight protrusion would be better. Would always be there, and would significantly slim up the camera's profile. A hand strap attached could come with it, or be an optional purchase.

I know a handling's can be useful, but I typically add them for specific work. But I love it if a camera just came with a sculpted body that works as is, even stripped down.

Thoughts on the side handle designs?

 

[ahalpert]

They should have put a phantom powered XLR on the Fx6 body, no doubt about that! Likely the biggest obvious mistep in that camera's design. Right after that it would be no EVF.

The problem is that people want to rig the FX6 like an A camera when it's really an action camera . Or hey, just pony up the cash for a proper sound recordist who will feed you timecode

Jk I agree these are shortcomings. Not as bad as no touch tracking IMO because at least they have workarounds

 

[Guest]

I agree these are shortcomings. Not as bad as no touch tracking IMO because at least they have workarounds

The work around is getting an A7s3.

I think people are calling the Fx6 the worlds best parts bin camera ever. Might need a MK2 version before they work out all the kinks. The no external mic option on the body is a 101 camera no-no. It is so strange, because I don't think it has ever been done before. Would expect it from Apple, but not from the best video camera manufacturer for the last 3 or 4 decades.


I am sure the AF tracking is important, but I am going to say the no audio input is the more universal issue. Not everyone is using native E mount lenses, or even AF lenses.

 

[ahalpert]

Sony cripple hammer? Classic cripple hammer move is to make a great camera and strip out a feature that will put off only the people who can afford an FX9.

Yes, it's more universal than the AF. But I definitely bought sony largely for the AF. If I didnt want the AF, I'd much sooner be on an S5, S1H, or the rumored EVA1 follow-up. Is there going to be a Varicam LT follow-up? Or a C200 which has a lot of juice and functionality, just a "soft" 4K look, no 10-bit and yesterday's AF

 

[Guest]

to make a great camera and strip out a feature that will put off only the people who can afford an FX9.

I don't know. I think the Fx9 is already different enough. I am assuming it was just easier and cheaper to manufacture without the audio connections on board. They might have though how cool it was that they offered XLR in the handle. Canon may have crippled the codecs on the C200, but they got almost everything else right on that camera. It set the stage for the success of the C500ii body design I think too.


Panasonic will come back with a vengeance in a couple years, if they nail down that organic sensor tech. But I don't see Panasonic doing much more in the CMOS space. Organic sensors will supposedly have more Dr and better sensitivity and colour than CMOS. plus it will be global shutter natively?

 

[andykwilkinson]

A questions for Fs5 and Canon C shooters, how much do you like those side handles? Is it really important? I find myself wondering if having a slight protrusion would be better. Would always be there, and would significantly slim up the camera's profile. A hand strap attached could come with it, or be an optional purchase.

I know a handling's can be useful, but I typically add them for specific work. But I love it if a camera just came with a sculpted body that works as is, even stripped down.

Thoughts on the side handle designs?

I (still) have a Canon C100 and the Sony FS5. The handle on the C100 is (for me anyway) really a great feature of the camera, it just feels so comfortable. I also like that it's adjustable in terms of position and (of course) removable. It's a bit more awkward than the FS5 side handle to adjust in position - but at least once it's fixed it's rock solid...the handle on my (and I think all) FS5 has a bit of play in it. However, the FS5 handle is really easy and very quick to adjust and has a few more controls on it - and they are more or less right where I'd want them. It does feel a bit cheap and plasticky, but hey, it's a Sony, what do you expect. I am really hoping that the FX6 handle does NOT have the play that the FS5 has - don't think I've seen anyone mention this in the review videos I've seen. It's a pretty noticeable "feature" on the FS5 so I'm hoping this means they have sorted it. I also believe the (awkward to plug/unplug) 2.5mm jack on the short lead on the FS5 handle has been replaced with a more sturdy 3.5mm jack and I think the FX6 may have (even) more controls on the handle - would need to check that last statement though.

 

[Guest]

I (still) have a Canon C100 and the Sony FS5. The handle on the C100 is (for me anyway) really a great feature of the camera, it just feels so comfortable. I also like that it's adjustable in terms of position and (of course) removable. It's a bit more awkward than the FS5 side handle to adjust in position - but at least once it's fixed it's rock solid...the handle on my (and I think all) FS5 has a bit of play in it. However, the FS5 handle is really easy and very quick to adjust and has a few more controls on it - and they are more or less right where I'd want them. It does feel a bit cheap and plasticky, but hey, it's a Sony, what do you expect. I am really hoping that the FX6 handle does NOT have the play that the FS5 has - don't think I've seen anyone mention this in the review videos I've seen. It's a pretty noticeable "feature" on the FS5 so I'm hoping this means they have sorted it. I also believe the (awkward to plug/unplug) 2.5mm jack on the short lead on the FS5 has been replaced with a more sturdy 3.5mm jack and I think the FX6 may have (even) more controls on the handle - would need to check that last statement though.

Thank you!

I always want compact and ergonomic, so I like sculpted boxes. can always add a handle to anything. But t is good to hear that people enjoy using the handles and it isn't some corporate design. I think I recall James Longely liking the handle on the C300mkii. angels are made of light https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbJEYzxLsJg

Wouldn't is be genius if they were able to utilize the handles 3.5mm jack as an audio in port? haha. I kid. but wouldn't it?

 

[DLD]

When FX-6 design was approved - and rumors of the camera were out a year ago - the cripple hammer a la FX-9's stack for external Raw recording was still in play. Then Canon's cripple hammer was on the verge of a class action law suit and had to be quickly disabled (to paraphrase Jim Jannard, the "disabled disability"), tossing everything out of norm.

Olympus's and Nikon's financial trouble also did not go unnoticed. On top of that, cartels have a natural trajectory toward breaking up.

But I think it'll be easier for Sony to make FX-9II since it had to have been planned from the start than to quickly release an update for FX-6.

 

[Guest]

...to paraphrase Jim Jannard, the "disabled disability".

Ha! What was he referring to?

In a way, I think Jim Jannard was like a lot of us on the forum, just that he had the business strategy and money to do it. He saw DSLR's and thought, why can video cameras do this? He as right.

 

[DLD]

Ha! What was he referring to? ...

"Obsolescence obsolete".

 

[drboffa]

A questions for Fs5 and Canon C shooters, how much do you like those side handles? Is it really important? I find myself wondering if having a slight protrusion would be better. Would always be there, and would significantly slim up the camera's profile. A hand strap attached could come with it, or be an optional purchase.

I know a handling's can be useful, but I typically add them for specific work. But I love it if a camera just came with a sculpted body that works as is, even stripped down.

Thoughts on the side handle designs?

I absolutely love the side handle on my Fs5. So much so that when I strip the camera down for gimbal work it seems vastly inferior and less intuitive. The side handle makes the camera feel like an extension of my hand (and, by extension, of my thoughts and intentions while shooting).

There is a fair bit of play but I'm guessing (hoping!) that's been fixed on the FX6.

 

[ReelFilmGeek]

To his point about the top handle, I wonder if Sony will allow 3rd party attachments so that something like Wooden Caerm can provide XLR to the side and a more robust top handle? IDK. Probably not.

I hope so as its my main complaint with the camera. I thought about just taking off the top handle, putting on a monitor instead and sound device mixpre3

 

[puredrifting]

"Obsolescence obsolete".

Worst, most BS tag line in camera history. I laughed at it back in the day.

 

[Guest]

I absolutely love the side handle on my Fs5. So much so that when I strip the camera down for gimbal work it seems vastly inferior and less intuitive. The side handle makes the camera feel like an extension of my hand (and, by extension, of my thoughts and intentions while shooting).

There is a fair bit of play but I'm guessing (hoping!) that's been fixed on the FX6.

That is great to hear!

So many different ways to shoot and operate.

 

[Guest]

Worst, most BS tag line in camera history. I laughed at it back in the day.

"Obsolescence obsolete".

Bahahaha!

Ok, now i gotcha. Yeah, they threw that out the window real quick! Despite possibly still using the slogan somewhere, they never practiced it in full effect.

Although, a Red Epic MX can still shoot the **** out of an Indie feature in the right hands. But yeah, what a load of BS that was. Their upgrade discount is kind of cool, but feels more like a cycle trap,,, the dangling carrot effect. Haha.

 

[Guest]

I hope so as its my main complaint with the camera. I thought about just taking off the top handle, putting on a monitor instead and sound device mixpre3

That is cool. The Mixpre3ii is amazing. Tiny and easy enough to use for a novice on small gigs and fun projects. The Zoom recorders had the hit record a second time to actually record, and red and red blinking meaning different things, and then other recorders of theirs just being one tap of record.... made me so unconfident renting a zoom or handing it off to anyone. But the Mixpre’s just hit the big ole REC button and it goes red and time code a running.... easy peasey lemon squeezy!