C100: Slider recommendations

Eric Coughlin said:
I have the Rhino motorized setup with the Arc. I have three tracks for it; 2 ft (carbon fiber and steel) and 4 ft track (steel). I like it.

Stability with the steel one is good; more so depends on the stability of your tripod setup. I don't use the carbon fiber setup as much, but I think it'd be fine, particularity with a C100.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Md3oL5vjAJc



I also have a Cinevate Duzi (v.1 or v.2) and a Edelkrone slider (for traveling). I used to have a Kessler Stealth but sold it. The Cinevate Duzi is light weight (apparently the newer version is much heavier), so it stays in my big camera bag all the time. The Rhino sliders are in separate bags, so I only bring them on bigger shoots since they are smoother (with the flywheel) or when I need the motorized option. The Edelkrone I use if I'm flying somewhere since it can easily fit in my carry-on.
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Hi Eric, I'm looking to buy a slider that is relatively light weight but I don't mind something a little heavier if it's solid/reliable. I'm starting to do corporate home builder/display type work where we have two days to shoot in multiple locations so preferably something that sets up relatively fast or can be (fairly) easily moved on a tripod. Looking to pay around US$1200 max. Do you think the Duzi is a good option?
 
curlyhairedjew said:
Hi, thanks for the response. Would love some photos if it isn't too much hassle, just so I could get the logistics sorted of how it mounts onto the tripod and then how the camera attaches on top. I don't know pounds too well as an aussie, but do you think it would support the C100/Ninja 2/502/sigma 50-100mm (around 3lb)? Also what length/accessories did you purchase/find useful with the Duzi? Thanks again.
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Oh yes, pound is the same as lbs in fact! And yes, the Duzi is designed to take up to 100lb of weight. No problem having accessories on top for the duzi, might be more of a problem with the head you'll be using.

As for the pictures, here's the idea, to attach the slider "flat" on the tripod legs, so it's more stable than using the 75mm bowl, which has proven to slip with enough weight.
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And using a 3/8 bolt with 2x nuts, you attach it under the slider, so you can mount the slider like you would normally do with a 75mm bowl, on the tripod legs. The only difference is that the slider sits flat on the legs.
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Carroll B said:
Does any have recommendations for a slider? I am looking at the edelkrone, does anyone use it?
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I actually recently switched from a Cinevate slider to Edelkrone. Cinveate is fine but Edelkrone's slider (I got the Slider Plus Pro, 21" version) is much more compact for the amount of camera travel. I needed a slider I would never have an excuse to leave behind and the Edelkrone's small footprint fit the bill. Another advantage is that its unique design allows you to push in or pull out without the slider being in the shot. With my old Cinevate, I always had to to a tilt down or up to avoid the slider in the frame.

Another bonus, the Edelkrone Slider Plus Pro is way better for wading through crowds or tight spaces while attached to a tripod (again, due to its unique, compact design).

Lastly, I never had much luck with Cinevate's technical support. They were always kind of terse and kept sending me parts (that I would pay for, not covered by warranty) in a thin paper envelope from Canada. By the time it got to me in California, the envelope had torn, and the part was lost. The tried 3 times before I finally got it and it took weeks (it was a small, but important, knob).

Edelkrone's technical support (so far) has been amazing. Their Protection Plan is INSANELY good. It extends the warranty from 1 year to lifetime (!!), gives you a 3-month money back guarantee, "Free Replacement of the Accidentally Damaged Products by Users Mistake" (again, !!!), and finally "Free Replacement of the Lost Screws and Adjustment Knobs" (!!!!!!!).

The only think I'd love for Edelkrone to figure out is some sort of inertial wheel to make smooth slides a tad easier. That being said, the Slider Plus Pro works wonders with my C300 Mark II and doesn't bend the way my Cinevate used to.
 
Like Eric, I too have the Rhino EVO Motion with the Arc head. I love it, very easy to use as a second camera man on interviews. I use both my 80D on it and my C100. I like the 42" version with the motion control and the 24" version for run and gun. Simple to learn, good design, I am very happy with the Rhino. Rhino gave me a $500.00 trade in on my POS Konova, that paid for the Arc and a 24" case. It makes a little bit of noise but not enough to be heard in the interviews. Highly recommended.
 
I just picked up the Rhino EVO Carbon Fiber slider (24"), and absolutely love it. With the flywheel, it makes it hard NOT to have smooth moves. I've got my FS7II on it, and it glides like buttah. Highly recommend Rhino.
 
Stephen Mick said:
I just picked up the Rhino EVO Carbon Fiber slider (24"), and absolutely love it. With the flywheel, it makes it hard NOT to have smooth moves. I've got my FS7II on it, and it glides like buttah. Highly recommend Rhino.
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puredrifting said:
Like Eric, I too have the Rhino EVO Motion with the Arc head. I love it, very easy to use as a second camera man on interviews. I use both my 80D on it and my C100. I like the 42" version with the motion control and the 24" version for run and gun. Simple to learn, good design, I am very happy with the Rhino. Rhino gave me a $500.00 trade in on my POS Konova, that paid for the Arc and a 24" case. It makes a little bit of noise but not enough to be heard in the interviews. Highly recommended.
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This.

I had a Duzi, which was very nice, but I bit on the $500 Rhino trade-in deal as well. Traded in the Duzi and haven't looked back. Use it in 24" carbon and 42" as well. Arc, Motion, Flywheel are awesome. Really like the ability to reconfigure different lengths. Go heavy, go light. Very flexible. Also liked dealing with the company as well. Totally recommended.

Only regret is that I haven't used it much lately, but that is because of the style I've been photographing of late than anything to do with the Rhino.
 
This is all really great feedback, thanks guys!! It might just come down to cost in the end but it sounds like the Rhino is a great piece of kit.
 
curlyhairedjew said:
Hi Eric, I'm looking to buy a slider that is relatively light weight but I don't mind something a little heavier if it's solid/reliable. I'm starting to do corporate home builder/display type work where we have two days to shoot in multiple locations so preferably something that sets up relatively fast or can be (fairly) easily moved on a tripod. Looking to pay around US$1200 max. Do you think the Duzi is a good option?
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I like (not love) the Cinevate Duzi v.1 or 2 I have because it is light weight and pretty simple; most of the time it gets the job done while not being awesome. The new one with the integrated flywheel looks pretty nice, but adds a good amount of weight. So it depends on how important weight is to you. Since I store my Cinevate in my 65-70 lb camera bag, anything I can do to keep down the weight is a good thing since I want to be able to lift and carry the bag around without breaking my back. Back when the 6-7 lb Kessler Stealth was my A-slider, I sometimes took it out of the bag to conserve weight, but now-a-days the Duzi is in the bag all the time even when I know I'm not doing any slider shots for a given shoot, which saves me time from packing and unpacking for each shoot.

The integrated flywheel would make setup quicker, since you can easily store the slider with the flywheel attached unlike with the Rhino. But with the Rhino you can always choose not to use the flywheel if you want to save some weight and space.

My Cinevate Duzi gets bumps in the area it slides across over time. The ball sliders bear down into the railing, grinding it down. It's made of carbon fiber; not super durable. Cinevate has a solution to this; you can twist the rails so a new fresh section of the railing is now where the ball bearings slide across (can't do that with the Rhino). Good as new. However, while the online video made it look like a simple five minute job, it took a lot of physical force for me to twist it; I had to get someone to help me and use brute force to twist it, and overall it probably took 30-60 minutes to get it done. Quite a pain. Eventually your railing will run out of blemish free spots if you keep twisting it to newness, though it would probably take awhile for it to be completely tarnished.

So, while the Rhino can't twist to a new fresh spot on the railing, the Rhino does have easily accessible new rails for sale for about $125. Switching out railing on the Rhino is a much simpler process. You might be able to buy new railings for the Duzi, but I'm not sure; I do think installation would be more of a pain in any case.

The Rhino also has the advantage of having steel rails available. I assume steel railing is less prone to developing bumps and is more durable in general.

The ball bearings on the Duzi have come loose; I can tighten them, but it never seems to be quite right and they still loosen on their own. Fortunately this doesn't seem to affect the smoothness of the slide much, but having the camera wobble around when moving the whole setup is a bit unnerving, even though it's never become detached and doesn't seem like it will. Still, I'd be hesitant to put a super heavy camera on with that wobble, even though the slider is rated for a high payload.

My Kessler Stealth's ball bearings made the carriage loose as well, and I could never figure out the precise way to tighten it to make them right again. The Stealth also got bumps in the railing, and the railing on that setup is not replaceable, so I sold it "As is" on Ebay. The Rhino carriage is nice and tight, works well, but I haven't used it nearly as much since I got it more recently and often use the Duzi instead, so we'll see how well that aspect stands up to the test of time.

I'd say the biggest advantage of the Rhino is the ability to add on a streamlined motorized setup. I think the Rhino motorized setup is the best out there now for sliders in terms of simplicity and low size/weight. It'd be cool if Rhino came out with a pan and tilt head that could be integrated with their controller.

Overall I'd say get a Rhino.
 
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I agree with everything Eric says, my experience, so far, has been the same with the Rhino. The company has great and very responsive customer service too. They actually answer e-mails reasonably quickly and answer the phone.
 
Ok this is great advice thankyou. I just want to make sure that I buy all of the necessary parts to attach this to my tripod, could somebody link me what I would need to buy to attach this to my tripod pictured above? It's a manfrotto 504hd bowl head with manfrotto 535 legs.
 
curlyhairedjew said:
Ok this is great advice thankyou. I just want to make sure that I buy all of the necessary parts to attach this to my tripod, could somebody link me what I would need to buy to attach this to my tripod pictured above? It's a manfrotto 504hd bowl head with manfrotto 535 legs.
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If you decide to get the Rhino, buy the 24" slider only. The 42" needs two tripods or light stands, one on each end. You can always buy the 24" with just the flywheel as a manual slider and then add the 42" and or EVO Motion and Arc later. If you have any old cheap slider laying around, once you buy, you can send it to Rhino and they will credit you with $500.00 you could use to add Motion and or Arc, read the fine print, not sure how much of a package you need to buy for the $500.00 rebate? I bought this package, https://rhinocameragear.com/collections/motorized-slider-bundle sent them my piece of crap Konova and used the extra $500.00 to pay for Arc, 24" case and flywheel. So I got EVERYTHING you can get for about $1,500.00, a killer deal. As far as your tripod, you don't need anything special, mount the slider directly to the 3/8" flat base on your tripod and add your head to the slider plate. Ready to go. I have the 24" carbon rails, they seem fine but you could go for the 24" steel rails for a few bucks extra. You must get the flywheel, it's what makes the Rhino so incredibly smooth when used manually.
 
That's great, thanks Puredrifting. My only issue here is when you say "mount the slider directly to the 3/8" flat base on your tripod" because when you take off the head there isn't anything to mount it to, it's a 75mm bowl. This is the tripod here: https://www.videoguys.com.au/Shop/p/20884/manfrotto-504hd-head-w-535-2-stage-carbon-fiber-tripod-system-504hd-535k.html.

I think that I would have to mount it with one of these https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/553993-REG/Manfrotto_520BALL_520BALL_75mm_Half_Ball.html and then buy this adapter to attach my head to the slider itself? Just seems like bit of an effort? https://www.videoguys.com.au/Shop/p/25521/manfrotto-325n-video-head-adapter-bowl-325n.html
 
curlyhairedjew said:
That's great, thanks Puredrifting. My only issue here is when you say "mount the slider directly to the 3/8" flat base on your tripod" because when you take off the head there isn't anything to mount it to, it's a 75mm bowl. This is the tripod here: https://www.videoguys.com.au/Shop/p/20884/manfrotto-504hd-head-w-535-2-stage-carbon-fiber-tripod-system-504hd-535k.html.

I think that I would have to mount it with one of these https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/553993-REG/Manfrotto_520BALL_520BALL_75mm_Half_Ball.html and then buy this adapter to attach my head to the slider itself? Just seems like bit of an effort? https://www.videoguys.com.au/Shop/p/25521/manfrotto-325n-video-head-adapter-bowl-325n.html
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You could do that or you could just buy a different tripod for the slider? Here is my take. When I am on a shoot, for instance, at a subjects house, shooting a day in the life, I am not going to use the slider for every shot. There is a lot of value in having, for instance, a Manfrotto tripod plate on your camera and having the your slider set up on a flat base tripod with a lower dollar head attached to it that can accept your Manfrotto tripod plate and then having your better quality tripod and head standing by for interviews or locks offs or shots where you want movement but perhaps just panning and tilting and not slider moves? My main tripod is a good one, a Sachtler DV-6 SB with a 75mm bowl. My Miller carbon fiber Solo DV legs have the 75mm bowl to accept the Sachtler head. But I use a much cheaper Manfrotto MdVE flat base legs and a cheap Manfrotto 500 head for the slider and they work great. You have to realize you don't need a premium head on a slider because all you will be doing is sliding and perhaps a slight tilt or very mild pan. If money is tight, buy something used to support the slider. As stated, I hate ONLY having a tripod mounted slider on a shoot, they are more a pain to carry around and I am only using the slider for certain shots, not for everything. And when you are not shooting slider moves, it's obnoxious to have to carry around your camera and tripod with the slider attached.

Just my .02 If you have a PA or camera assistant, you can be grabbing tripod shots while the assistant is setting up the slider. You quickly remove your camera from the main tripod, leave it there, walk over to where the slider has been set up and grab your shot with it. In the meantime, your assistant can be moving your tripod to wherever the next tripod shot or interview set up is. It's such a more efficient way to work. I also do a decent amount of slider moves without a tripod, setting it up on a counter, table, the floor, depending on the shot I want.
 
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