FS7: Should i get Ronin for FS7, or Ronin-M for A7s?

M

Martin.G

Well-known member
So as the topic says, i cant decide wether to get the Ronin with XL arms for my "ferrari", or to get the Ronin-M and fly the little 8-bit camera.

Ive never operated a gimbal before, so i wonder what others think.

Weight is the issue i guess. Does the FS7 fit with speedbooster and Canon L glass on the XL arms?
 
Martin.G said:
So as the topic says, i cant decide wether to get the Ronin with XL arms for my "ferrari", or to get the Ronin-M and fly the little 8-bit camera.

Ive never operated a gimbal before, so i wonder what others think.

Weight is the issue i guess. Does the FS7 fit with speedbooster and Canon L glass on the XL arms?
Click to expand...

Truly Apples and Oranges.
I have both cameras as well and chose the later using a Nebula 4000 3 axis stabilizer with my A7s. Works wonderful for my application which is to make a difficult shoot where stabilization was necessary, i.e...POV or some sort of walking shot.
You are the best judge as to your application.
Getting a Ronin for your FS7 could be sweet but realize it takes time to set up and you have to strip the camera down from its ancillaries like off board recorders, etc. Now your "Ferrari" is pretty much in floating mode and if you plan to do a whole project that way then you are good to go. But going back and forth from full set up to Ronin will get very old very fast, which is why I opted to free float my A7s. I've got it matched pretty well to my FS7 and when I do use the little guy, we just do double system audio.
So for my money, that's the way to go. Use the Ferrari for the meat and potatoes and the A7s for the dessert.
 
Last edited:
I prefer the FS7 on the Ronin with Cinemilled Arms over A7s, but sometimes the A7S with the Pix-E5 (or whatever recorder of your choosing if you want 4k) is more time efficient. The time it takes to break down and build up the FS7 back to normal tripod support can be a headache, but the 10 bit internal recording is definitely preferred over externally recording via HDMI or 8 bit internal in my opinion.

Whatever tool suits your needs the best!

The Ronin with the FS7 definitely isn't light, but it's also not terribly heavy unless you plan on doing consecutive 5 minute takes over and over.
 
I recommend ronin m with a7s. I used the ronin with c100 and before that with fs700 yesterday and the day before my arms hurt now. Use fs7 for slider/ tripod shoots and a7s for gimbal.
 
I wrestled with this exact decision for about 6 weeks. IN the end I had to be honest about two things: efficiency and stamina. You can see where I am going. I opted for the Ronin M for the A7SII becuase as allenfacemire mentioned it takes time to strip down the FS7, mount and balance on the gimbal, then build back up again. With the A7S mounted pretty much permanently on the Ronin M switching is a matter of 10 seconds. Always perfectly balanced, always ready to go. The IQ trade off of course is where the rub lays. There is a difference, but I personally don't think it is significant enough to make someone complain. I also think on gimbal shots the motion calls more attention to itself than the 8bit codec ever would. With the lighter setup I can literally shoot for hours on end with the A7S/Ronin M. I shot two commercial shoots last weekend. Was shooting for 12 hours with a 30 min break for lunch. Back and forth from shoulder mount/tripod FS7 to A7SII/Ronin M. All day back and forth. It was super efficient, no waiting around and at the end of the day matching the slog2 A7SII with the FS7 slog3 isn't that tough. Hope this helps.
 
I used fs7 and a7rII on helix gimbal standard since one year. To me what define my choice between fs7 or a7rii is job budget and the need of af. For small budget in run and gun style i prefer a7rii with small hd502.
 
Jim Ritscher said:
One factor here is arm strength.
Click to expand...
J

Jim is right and I wonder how many people planning on buying gimbal systems take this into account: these things wear you out.

Just "flying" a Ronin M with an A7S for 20 minutes recently was starting to get to me, I cannot imagine what it would have been like with the added weight of a Ronin/FS7!

Not to mention, it takes a LONG TIME to balance a gimbal, so this is somethig you want to once and then leave it set up for the day.

I think the best situation for most (admitedly not all) shooters would be to have the FS7 as the A cam, and the A7S as the gimbal cam for specialty shots.
 
I had the Ronin for my FS7 and used that with an Atlas support. It was a very heavy rig and very cumbersome to set up. Also the size of the whole rig, I was using a remote follow focus and EF primes, stripped down camera and my Ronin had extension arms, made fast paced work difficult and is something you want to think about, Changing the FS7 back to normal operation takes quiet some time as well.
I sold the Ronin and changed to the Ronin M with the A7RII. It does work without a support, but you still need to carry a stand around with you which is something I don't like for my kind of run and gun work.
So now I also sold the M and got the Helix Jr Aluminium for the A7. I can fold it down with everything attached and ready to shoot and put it in a bag or just put it down on any flat surface. I am using it with a remote ff, a smallHD 502 and paralinx triton system, still much easier to work with than the ronin I think.

But the quality of the FS7 picture is so much nicer... If you have the time, stamina and enough crew to work with the Ronin and the FS7, this will give you the best picture. You will need at least an Atlas support in my opinion, better get an EasyRig with serene arm.
If you need to be quick, change cameras often and don't have someone to carry your Ronin stand and take the load of you every 10 minutes, I recommend the Helix Jr.
 
Frankly the question isn't should you get a Ronin/M/MX ?
The question is are you willing to invest in a whole new system and way of working in order to use it in a meaningful way ?
Like steadicams, it's not just a tool, it's practically an art in itself and you are going to have to invest a fair amount of time and energy in it.
And that probably means finding a support system that works for you as well...
 
Last edited:
Good and valid points from many here, thank you.

yoclay: Im not sure yet, but at that price point, i can afford to give it a try and see if i nail it or not. But so can everyone else. So many untalented film workers are over-using and abusing slow motion, timelapse, drones, and gimbals so much that all four techniques are giving me a sour taste in my mouth. So i have been contemplating getting one since the Movi was announced but never decided. Same with drones. Never can decide, and if a client really wants a drone, i can always hire someone whos good at it to do it. And thats what ive done so far. Works like a charm.

MartinF: Good point, but the Helix is twice the price than the Ronin M, so currently its out of my price range. Im not even sure if this is for me yet.

DC Brandon:
With the lighter setup I can literally shoot for hours on end with the A7S/Ronin M. I shot two commercial shoots last weekend. Was shooting for 12 hours with a 30 min break for lunch. Back and forth from shoulder mount/tripod FS7 to A7SII/Ronin M. All day back and forth. It was super efficient, no waiting around and at the end of the day matching the slog2 A7SII with the FS7 slog3 isn't that tough. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

This sounds exactly like i work now. But im moving to a bigger city where there might be good market for a trained steadycam with gimbal operator where the FS7 cuts the cookies. But that road is long, and unsure. Getting the -M for A7s right now is the safe path i guess.

With the FS5 i also guess its just a matter of time/couple of years before we see the first Canon 5D size camera with 10bit 4:2:2 so then the FS7 advantage will disappear.

I will think it over more. I already have a Glidecam HD4000 with X-10 vest but the FS7, even with smallest battery, light Sony FE 24-70 lens and light mic is still quite top heavy and hard to get smooth on the HD4000. Not to mention all that weight on just one arm. Even with the Glidecam Arm Brace i cant fly it for longer than a few minutes - at most.​

 
That turns the table, surely! The Helix Jr i found was 3000 USD. Magnesium, huh? Crazy price difference between magnesium and aluminum.
 
FS5, FS7 and A7 are different camera with different ways to handle footage.
I have come to the same question, but always wondering: If I'm doing the gimbal shot with a A7s, How can I justify in front of my client a 1 time more expensive camera for the other shot? (and end losing this argument)

So, if you are a FS7 lover as me, and confident how beautiful you can tweak the camera for your need; going for a Gimbal is a great idea.
I not a very strong body built kind of freelance cameraman and so, the weight was a very big concern after spending few shoot with a C300 + Ronin.
I have decided to sell it as a friend wanted to get mine and exchange it for a Ronin M
Great life choice!

helmet-shooting-shanghai-nanjing-xiamen-shenzhen-video-photographer.jpg


Now, I have something fitting 90% of the lenses I need for a gimbal shot (the 10-18 Sony, or single prime with OSS) and looking fine in front of the client.You will need few extra gear to make this working, but overall a amazing configuration, switchable from handheld, tripod to gimbal in less than 2 mn. And something you can operate yourself and carry easy in a bag.

visionrouge-autoshow-2017-shanghai-camera-team-local.jpg

follow the full setup on this page if you want more
http://www.visionrouge.net/web/2017/04/sony-fs7-on-dji-ronin-m/

It works without any counter balance (You need a large battery instead and get rid of the weight from the handle).
The Ronin handle IS the camera handle (saving space and you can remote trigger the camera, zoom or focus!)
Need to buy a specific plate on the ronin but price is very limited.

plate-fs7-mark-2-ronin-balance-m-to-rent.jpg

Total weight is actually completely acceptable for a average person (you don't do gimbal all day also)

Thanks for listening, feel free to ask for more!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top