Redcine...

I haven't seen this answered anywhere else (it might just be that I've missed it), but it seems a fairly obvious question to ask - does Redcine come free with the camera? And just to pick up on a point that's been made before, will it be possible for non red-owners to buy a copy to process their footage that they shoot on the cameras they rent from us?
 
There's no reason that a well-designed software interface can't provide both ease of use and lots of features. Besides, Red can always put out RedCine v2 if there is dissatisfaction in the user community with the first release. So don't sweat it on the features versus useability debate.
 
Alright, Filmmaker1977. Perhaps I am a bit to inflammatory in my post. for that, I apologise.

However, I ask you: Why not learn the technical issues involved? When an application is simplified, the technical lose. You end up using the settings and presets the developer likes. I would rather they spent their very limited time on features over interface.

It takes months to learn any of the good SF/X packages. Yet, many do it for their art. I just have faith: those who love their work will learn their tools.
 
Lowkus said:
There's no reason that a well-designed software interface can't provide both ease of use and lots of features. Besides, Red can always put out RedCine v2 if there is dissatisfaction in the user community with the first release. So don't sweat it on the features versus useability debate.
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I agree, there should be a sort of quick workflow "Wizard Mode" with certain frequently used presets. For the lesser technically inclined, or even if your in a quick hurry to rush over some footage in the back of a van.

Adobe Bridge's process of importing RAW files is great, but no doubt RED's software will envolve a seperate section dedicated to encoding/filesize etc. Thats where the 100001 settings come to play i think. Temprature adjustment, gamma etc are great to fiddle with in Adobe Bridge as opposed to post bridge so i hope to see a similar concept in Redcine.
 
GabrielR said:
Alright, Filmmaker1977. Perhaps I am a bit to inflammatory in my post. for that, I apologise.

However, I ask you: Why not learn the technical issues involved? When an application is simplified, the technical lose. You end up using the settings and presets the developer likes. I would rather they spent their very limited time on features over interface.

It takes months to learn any of the good SF/X packages. Yet, many do it for their art. I just have faith: those who love their work will learn their tools.
Click to expand...
You apologize on sec, and the next, drop another bombshell! With all due respect, your post speaks to your own level of understanding of the subject matter. My opinion... quit, let it go!
 
Stephen W said:
I haven't seen this answered anywhere else (it might just be that I've missed it), but it seems a fairly obvious question to ask - does Redcine come free with the camera? And just to pick up on a point that's been made before, will it be possible for non red-owners to buy a copy to process their footage that they shoot on the cameras they rent from us?
Click to expand...

- Answered on the bottom of page 1 of this thread.
And yes, I believe RedCine ship free with camera.
Good news all round!:) :) :)
 
acehole111 said:
I agree, there should be a sort of quick workflow "Wizard Mode" with certain frequently used presets. For the lesser technically inclined, or even if your in a quick hurry to rush over some footage in the back of a van.
Click to expand...

I second Wizard Mode! Especially if there is a tonne of footage to get processed for editing. If you plan to EDL back to Redcine for final output, you can get a lot more particular with your footage then.
 
hahaha, Mardi Gras. I apologize for tone, not for content. The question is quite serious and not intended to be insulting.
 
Jannard said:
Our goal, John, is to make it useable with no manual. It will be very powerful while very intuative. I'm not sure if all of you know how much we have bitten off. A 4k camera and a program to make it's use simple and powerful for almost every application. "A camera without a workflow will not sell" I was once told.

Jim
Click to expand...

Chill amigos. :)

I don't see where he said it's going to be harder to use than Avid, FCP or Shake. It can't be too complicated if you don't need a manual (although I hope they include one anyway for dumba$$'$ like me:beer:) I figure it will be like all the rest of RED teams philosophy - the more you work it (4K) the more you'll get out of it.

I gotta say some of the reactions to a few words from Jim are sorta' funny. We all want to make this the best workflow possible. I trust RED team will balance intuitive uses and pro operability. After all, that's what they're aiming for the camera, so why not the post ? Both will be a step up to the ballpark with the big stadium. I, for one, look forward to taking the field...

EDIT: have a Guinness. :beer:

RED # rebel with a clue
 
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Mardi_Gras said:
I honestly believe this is a valid argument. Look at it this way... when was the last time you got involved in the designing/creation of any NLE application (mass appeal or pro) like Jim and the Red team have agreed to do with us? That I guess, answers your question.
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Mardi,

first, it was a personal attack.. this isn't the place.. worst, it was an attack on my point through my personal technology knowledge.. i leave my personal interest on this but not my point..

however, on GabrielR's tone couldn't be my point..

each one on each side.. i left mine.. and i gave some examples and a viewpoint.. you can disagree.. not something else on things that you don't know.. i mean, not you (well, you follow me)

"Dumbing up the process for a pro application designed to handle a 4k workflow can be compared imho to a book on "Calculus for Dummies". You preety much have to have an inkling as to what the heck you're doin'... otherwise you shouldn't be messin' with it in the first place."

there are different backgrounds from allover the fields joining as future red buyers.. all of them are necessary.. no one.. not even one can be out.. only because what can be easy it cannot.. we need all for the benefit of the red success too.

we need all this people like that mate sculptor called Murphy (there are a lot of good movie makers there too) or those that PM me (you CAN'T IMAGINE how MANY (anonymous) people contact me just to say they're sharing the same worries and viewpoint) but without the same carefree guts for keep the point so high.. silent people, SILENT people.. some with fear to say over here "i don't understand nothing (NOT anything) on the technology subject and you're the best.. however, i'll buy A red one".. and you laugh, laugh.. even if some of us have money to buy it and some geeks for dream with..

GabrielR said:
Alright, Filmmaker1977. Perhaps I am a bit to inflammatory in my post. for that, I apologise.
Click to expand...
apologies accepted

"However, I ask you: Why not learn the technical issues involved? When an application is simplified, the technical lose. You end up using the settings and presets the developer likes. I would rather they spent their very limited time on features over interface."

FIRST, i and so many other users we'll need for a friendly interface ("as far as possible" and the words aren't mine..)

still, when the technical isn't simplified, the artistic perspective lose (sorry me but what i do for living is art not technology and that's where i earn my money that allow me to afford the red one.. and i can also speak for 3 other partners and for more 3 red one reservations = 4 red setups.. adding lenses.. zoom, 300mm.. accessories.. well, we have our future there..)

"It takes months to learn any of the good SF/X packages. Yet, many do it for their art. I just have faith: those who love their work will learn their tools."

my tools where i did all my background (aesthetics and filmmaking) and where i'm doing my daily job which don't allow me to go forward in other fields of the movie business.. i simply don't have time or background to that!

i mean: i stand 100% of my point
 
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filmmaker1977 said:
my tools where i did all my background (aesthetics and filmmaking) and where i'm doing my daily job which don't allow me to go forward in other fields of the movie business.. i simply don't have time or background to that!

i mean: i stand 100% of my point
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filmmaker1977, I'm an artist too. I share your desire to make your art as naturally and without technological barriers as possible. In fact, I will have to learn a new NLE platform, when RED arrives since my editing days were awhile ago. Will you be editing with AVID or FCP ? Or will you have someone operate the suite while you make the creative decisions ? Either way, I don't see how REDcine will not be able to be integrated smoothly into that workflow.

I would not even be considering 4K if it weren't for REDcine. Adding one extra software into an existing post workflow, seems a fair trade off in the grand scheme of things.

It's the artist who plays the Stradavarius, and not the other way around. I think RED team are well aware of that axiom. ;)


RED #'s rebel with a clue and a case of Guinness...
 
Hey Guys, chill!
This isn't rocket sceince. (Operating it, not programming it of cause)
I think you can feel pretty confident that you'll be able to master this thing.
Mr. Nattress has made some great "whitepapers" in the past, and I'm sure Jim will let him make some for this software as well. (Check out this one http://www.lafcpug.org/Tutorials/basic_chroma_sample.html)
And there is also Stuart English to help out there too.
Of cause there will be a step up from iPhoto type correction.
If anything goes wrong you can still just shoot and convert flat, then do your corrections in the nle like you do today.
 
D_and_G said:
filmmaker1977, I'm an artist too. I share your desire to make your art as naturally and without technological barriers as possible. In fact, I will have to learn a new NLE platform, when RED arrives since my editing days were awhile ago. Will you be editing with AVID or FCP ? Or will you have someone operate the suite while you make the creative decisions ? Either way, I don't see how REDcine will not be able to be integrated smoothly into that workflow.

I would not even be considering 4K if it weren't for REDcine. Adding one extra software into an existing post workflow, seems a fair trade off in the grand scheme of things.

It's the artist who plays the Stradavarius, and not the other way around. I think RED team are well aware of that axiom. ;)


RED #'s rebel with a clue and a case of Guinness...
Click to expand...
i'd say i already had understood.. following your taste on gals.. eheh

on topic, because i'm so attentive to them (i mean the actressssssss.. hey, i'm an artist not a porn movie maker.. :Drogar-Smoke(DBG):), i don't have how..

creative decisions while i operate alone.. i'm a lonely pro but i hate this concept.. because i'm working 18 hours by day (here's the reason why the gals are there too :cheesy:) and if i don't care complex rather simplified standards i know why..
 
hi andrew.. i'll pm you as soon as possible.. cheers to UK

edit
btw, it's not easy to be the soccer coach of the british team.. my future bet: Jose Mourinho
 
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Exposure Lattitude

Exposure Lattitude

Jim,

My name is Thor Wixom. I have been shooting action sports films (mountain biking and motor sports) for the past 12 years.

I currently have a reservation on camera #137.

My question may have been answered elsewhere, but here it is:

How wide is the exposure lattitude of the Mysterium Sensor? How does it compare to some of the popular film stocks such as the KODAK VISION2 50D 5201 / 7201, or the VISION2 500T 5229/7229?

I also ask this question based on the idea that with a C-MOS sensor such as the Mysterium, each pixel sensor is addressable individually for exposure, as opposed to a CCD where all pixels must be adjusted for exposure together, which can result in dark areas being under exposed and bright areas being over exposed, expecially in high contrast compositions. In theory, the exposure lattitude of a C-MOS sensor could exceed film if the right in-camera processing is applied.

Of course, the next step is the Redcine software. If the source image from the Red One already has a wider lattitude than a film negative, I can only imagine how amazing the end result will look once it is processed in Recine.

I would appreciate any insights you can offer on this.

Thanks,

-Thor Wixom

PS - I would love to shoot footage for the upcoming Red Demo Reel. I know Big D would be your first choice for mountain bike footage, but I shot with Sam Hubinett this year, and I think some drift footage would look great in the reel!
 
Hah.. Why is everyone freaking out? I think some are making a mountain out of a mole hill here..

Remember that Jim Jannard has always moulded his product to suit the hand of the user. And expect no less from the RED brand.
 
filmmaker1977 said:
i'd say i already had understood.. following your taste on gals.. eheh

on topic, because i'm so attentive to them (i mean the actressssssss.. hey, i'm an artist not a porn movie maker.. :Drogar-Smoke(DBG):), i don't have how..

creative decisions while i operate alone.. i'm a lonely pro but i hate this concept.. because i'm working 18 hours by day (here's the reason why the gals are there too :cheesy:) and if i don't care complex rather simplified standards i know why..
Click to expand...

FM77, Im with you...Some of the best work I see comes out of the non-techies. But somewhere along the line they got someone helping them. The idea of the RED is to cut down a team of 20 operating film, into 1; Counting the focus puller, technician, 10 people at the devloping lab, projectionist, film handler, scanner guy, and so on.. So a little bit of a learning curve wont hurt when you count the payoff.
 
ace.. your taste on gals is rocking too.. eheh

i'm just a writer/director (and i need for a cam because that's what i do for living and if the people are accepting i'm afraid there is my way) but not an engineer.. and i think when the things are complicated at the technology level, there is something (more important) to lose.. (sorry me tech people but that's my viewpoint)
 
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