Recommendations for collapsible 4x4 frames?

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yophoto91

Active member
I drive a Civic. I still amaze myself half the time when I tetris the heck out of it successfully. That being said my lighting kit has been expanding and I need collapsible 4x4 frames. What do you guys recommend? Doesn't seem to be a ton of info out there. The Matthews Road Flag seems to be the most common result under my search, but I see Wescott, Chimera, and Avenger make their own version. One better than the other? I get the sense that the Wescotts may be a bit more proprietary in that it may be more cumbersome to mount things to. I have no idea if that's true though. Just want to be able to mount diffusion, gels, flags, but don't want to be locked into buying model-specific sheets. Thanks! -Mark
 
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After a lot of deliberation I ended up going with this : http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/90982-REG/Westcott_1891_Scrim_Jim_Small_Reflector.html

I also have a collapsable Photoflex 4x8 frame and selection of fabrics for it. For my own personal kit these work really well, and when I need more stuff I rent it.

Before then I was using PVC home built frames that were easily collapsable so if you're on a budget just buy some cheap PVC and some 90 degree elbows and make your own. It works with fabrics that have pockets on the corners to slip over the corners. To mount to c-stand you just use a mafer clamp or something similar to that.

At the end of the day it's just fabric mounted to a frame, so consider DIY if you want to save some dough.
 
I have a pair each of Chimera's 2x2', 4x4', & 6x6', frames in a travel kit. They've proven to be more robust then imagined, but the 4x4', & 6x6', are best supported by two stands.

Suggest looking at Advantage Grips' EZ-Travel 4x4' frames. These appear to fold down into a much smaller package then Matthews' version. They may even be compatible with Matthews', or American's, Slip-On/Rapid Recover rags, though I imagine Advantage could custom cut any fabric you desire. Been thinking of getting a pair with Floppy Flag covers.

http://www.advantagegrip.com/e-z travel.htm
 
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Thanks Dennis. I'll look into that Westcott. Yeah, I'm all about DIY for certain things. I have a couple of 4x4 wood frames I built recently. They work great and will be using them for personal film work. Just need something more lightweight & professional for commercial/travel gigs.

Thanks Bern. Is this the Chimera you are using? http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/218751-STUD/Chimera_5050_48x48_Reflector_Frame.html Glad they hold up well, kind of a bummer it may take 2 c-stands to safely support though. Hoping to find one light enough, but still sturdy that can work with a single c-stand. I'll take a look at the Advantage Travel frames. I wonder how they compare to the Matthews Road Flag.

EDIT: Just saw your added notes Bern. Cool, the Advantage frames look promising. The research continues...
 
I have several each of the Chimera 4x4 and 6x6 collapsible frames. Quick and convenient, BUT don't let them get blown over attached to stands while they're assembled or you will be taking them in or sending them off for repair, because a corner(at least one) is almost guaranteed to break if it hits the ground.

OP, are you wanting to fly it inside or outside with a single stand? The Chimeras are super light, but outside you need two stands just for control and safety. Remember, you're basically putting a sail up in the air and if you only have one point of contact and the wind blows(even a light breeze), at the very least, it's going to twist/move it.
 
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I still use the same Westscott Scrim Jim frames I bought when they first came out, like early 1990's. I have all kinds of fabrics, but very quickly I learned to find little-old-sewing-ladies to make them for me.

The scrim jim stuff is somewhat pricey (unless you find it used on eBay) but it's a good system and very versatile. Though sometimes you just clip the fabrics to a boom or something.
 
Thanks for the link Bern.

Run&Gun, yeah for outdoor use I would definitely use 2 stands. I just want to make sure for indoor use I can find a frame light enough where just one stand will get it done. The more I look into them though I'm getting the sense none of these models are terribly heavy where more than 1 c-stand would be required for a 4x4 for indoor use.

Thanks Michael.

Is there any advantage/disadvantage of the frames that have more of a thick metal 3D frame like the Scrim Jims and the Chimeras? Seems like it would just be simpler, cheaper, and just as effective to get the Matthews Road Flag or Advantage E-Z Travel which have the integrated pins. Would save me the cost of buying attachment metal grips/knuckles and such. Or am I missing something?

EDIT: Perhaps I answered my own question. Guessing it's just easier to mount any type of material to the frames that have a thicker 3D edge like the Scrim Jim whereas the Matthews/Advantage may require you to stick with slip on type materials?
 
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yophoto91 said:
Is there any advantage/disadvantage of the frames that have more of a thick metal 3D frame like the Scrim Jims and the Chimeras? Seems like it would just be simpler, cheaper, and just as effective to get the Matthews Road Flag or Advantage E-Z Travel which have the integrated pins. Would save me the cost of buying attachment metal grips/knuckles and such. Or am I missing something?

EDIT: Perhaps I answered my own question. Guessing it's just easier to mount any type of material to the frames that have a thicker 3D edge like the Scrim Jim whereas the Matthews/Advantage may require you to stick with slip on type materials?
Click to expand...

The Scrim Jim uses velcro to attach the fabrics, which - to me - is nicer at these sizes than loops of bungee cord or slip-on sleeves. It goes together quickly and adds to the structural stick-together-ness of the frame components. And the Scrim Jim setup lets you make several different sized frames from a handful of "sticks". When you need a quick green screen, it's very cool in that you can pull the fabric very tight and don't need a steamer.

Westscott sells purpose-made clamps that go into a regular grip head, I've never owned those though. A mafer or superclamp does just fine and are handy for all sorts of other needs - I assume most of us have piles of those and all the various pins.

My oldest scrim jim sticks - like 2 decades-ish - eventually needed some work as the velcro was coming loose here and there. I cleaned the old velcro off, got some new, drilled out the rivets and used epoxy to attach the new velcro and used a pop riveter through the same holes. Took an afternoon, but not bad for something I've used since before anyone thought we'd be shooting motion work with 'em. (I did tons of catalogue and editorial still shoots in the film days with the same stuff. And yeah, I still have my Mamiya 6x7 rig and shoot B&W film for my darkroom - I guess I'm dating myself!!!)
 
Thanks guys. I think I'll end up biting the bullet on the Westcott Scrim Jime Cine 4x4 kit. For $250 it seems like a decent package that can be upgraded in a sense if I need a 6x6 or 8x8 in the future. That and I dig their double velcro system...seems like it would be easier for me to rig my own diffusion gels and not have to worry about buying somewhat proprietary slip-on type fabrics.
 
Maybe a wildcard suggestion out of left field, but there's also the Alzo Easy Frame Diffuser Reflector, which I own. It's a couple of inches smaller than the Westcott (40 x 40), but super light, breaks down super fast and can be deployed very quickly. It's also a fraction of the cost of the Westcott. I've had someone also make some bobinets and some other rags for me for the Alzo. I also have the 42 x 72 Scrim Jim. I find the combo of these two to cover quite a bit.
 
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