FS5: RAW CDNG Odyssey Image

S

SamEdwards

Well-known member
Hey Folks,
A lot of people were wondering about the quality of CDNG files from the FS5. I wanted to share an single frame test image I took with the FS5. You can open it in Photoshop or Resolve. I suggest playing with the RAW controls just to see how incredible the quality is. Take the exposure slider and pull it way up to around +1.5. Yes there's a bit of noise, but I think I could have overexposed by a couple of stops and not lost much in the highlights. The Odyssey 7Q+ ships with LUT's that help you overexpose.
Notice that Photoshop opens the image at 16 bit.
The lens is the Sony FE 4/16-35.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/jhu8ngin9ib6l1j/CLIP0000139_0000368.dng?dl=0
Enjoy!
 
Thanks for this! It looks really good and I totally recognize LA :)

SamEd, do you have an opinion on the rolling shutter performance of the FS5? I haven't seen any measurements or tests of this aspect.

Thanks again for posting this!
 
Thanks for the picture. It looks great! I have a question - can the Odyssey record 4k RAW at 60 frames per second with the FS5? I'm told in theory it can, but could you actually test it?
 
I tested 60fps and even 120fps buffered and they both work great. The quality of the DNG files is better than many still cams. I even did an extended test of 240fps at 1080p and it was able to go until the SSD was full. Very impressive.
 
BTW the supplied image was recorded before the new firmware for the Odyssey Q7+ with FS5 support was released. So the image is tagged as coming from the fs700. I think the IQ is the same with the new firmware. It may be a touch better when s-log3 is supported in the next release.
 
Did you have to use two SSD's to record the 4k 60p? Could you possibly post a DNG recorded at 2k or 1080? Thanks.
 
Thank you for this example. Yes it is amazing what is possible with this type of footage.

What Settings do you recommend for Resolve?
 
wschmid said:
Thank you for this example. Yes it is amazing what is possible with this type of footage.

What Settings do you recommend for Resolve?
Click to expand...

I'm not sitting at resolve now, but I followed a video I saw online. In 'interpret footage' or some such, Use BLACKMAGIC as the camera type and color space. It should look really good right away. Then you can play with the exposure and white balance to make it look like you nailed the camera settings. Then grade as needed. HTH.
 
What I see here is that the footage seems to be underexposed dramatically. Yes it is possible to adjust the luminance and the White Point in a great way, but that seems to be possible without Setting the camara type and the Color space?
 
wschmid said:
What I see here is that the footage seems to be underexposed dramatically. Yes it is possible to adjust the luminance and the White Point in a great way, but that seems to be possible without Setting the camara type and the Color space?
Click to expand...

Yes, looking at the RAW data in RawDigger it seems quite underexposed (like 2 stops), there's nothing even close to clipping. It's also the usual Sony 11bit padded with a zero on the end, so it doesn't seem to be 12 bit linear. This is not unusual, they all seem to do it. The camera is reported as an FS700 but that's probably the odyssey putting the wrong metadata in.

Apart from that it's a good image. Feels the same as the FS700 although this is just a single frame.

The things to look for are compression artefacts in find detail and high contrast edges and also subtle noise in flat surfaces. Both of these areas the compressed RAW output of the FS700 suffered. Sony could have made improvements to their RAW compression algorithms.

Also it will be interesting to see if the FS5 bakes in white balance. Shoot a scene and just change the white balance settings in camera. When we see the two RAWs side by side if the RAW image is the same we know that the white balance is NOT baked in, if they differ then it is. The FS700 does not have it baked in but the FS7 does. Curious to see where the FS5 is

I suspect, like the FS700, adding an Odyssey to the FS5 will change the quality of the image a huge amount. Once you get into and are able to process RAW properly it's like night and day.

cheers
Paul
 
Hey Paul,
I like your blog and really appreciate the work you've shared. I'd love to get one of your Nuke scripts to see how you do your measurements.
I don't believe the white balance is baked with the FS5/Odyssey RAW combo. I'll try to do a more controlled test soon to verify.
Best Wishes,
Sam
 
Nobody said that this example is near to clipping, and it can be developed with the recommended log tools and contrast between 0 and 100 IRE in a great way. I think it should be recorded as 12bit and I wonder why it should be 11bit??
 
If you are recording in CinemaDNG, 4K above 30p and 2K about 120p require two SSDs in order to keep up with the data rate. Otherwise only one SSD is required. In RAW->ProRes modes only one SSD is ever required.

Files are labelled as FS700 because Sony didn't change the data point in the camera metadata!
 
I suspect that 11bits is about as many as Sony can push down a single SDI pipe. The quality is amazing. For years we did huge hollywood VFX shows in 10 bit log DPX. 11 is more!
 
On the subject of baked-in Color info on the FS5 in RAW CDNG to O7Q+:
I shot two clips indoors in S-Log2, one with the color mode set to s-Gammut/5600k, the other at s-Gammut/3200k. I opened a frame of each in photoshop and in the RAW development tab I set both of them to 3200k and set the hue to 0. there are some differences between the two frames, but overall the image is nearly the same. The temperature slider has a big effect on the image. It allows you to dial in the color balance of your images quite a bit. Overall I would call this 'not baked in', as I've read the FS700 does. Although I was hoping they'd be identical.
I see this as very good news and a great reason to use CDNG instead of ProRes. I'm going to need some bigger SSD's.
I'll try to break out Nuke soon to do more repeatable tests. I wish Autodesk would add CDNG support to Flame, as I find it to be quicker for these kinds of tests.

On the subject of exposure:
It's really interesting that the frame I supplied is how the camera meters using 'push auto' for the iris with the exposure compensation set to +1. If Paul and others are saying it's 2 stops under exposed, then proper exposure should be a whopping 3 stops above the ISO 3200 that sony rates the camera or ISO 400.
Or maybe the in-camera metering is just useless and more controlled tests are needed. Time to whip out a proper grey card and maybe an old school incident light meter.

Cheers,
SE
 
Why not try using the various excellent exposure meters in the Odyssey7Q+? Waveform, Histogram, False Color, Spot Meter, Zebras -- you have plenty of options and they are dead accurate.
 
What kind of LUTs can be used in the Q7+ for the Sony raw? Is it slog2/3?

Because I agree with Mitch: why not use the waveform Monitor for the raw recording?
 
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