Panasonic Europe support problems

[MrFluffy]

I know it sucks being on the short end of it, but welcome to the 21st Century. Customer Service is dreadful all over. Panasonic is probably one of the better companies out there. I'd encourage you to hang in there, keep posting here, and keep e-mailing and calling them.

For my day job I run technical support for a company. If any one of my staff treated a customer this way, they would be out of a job.

Just because its becoming the norm for big companies to treat customers badly does not mean we should take it. The only way it will change is for people to make a noise and hopefully threaten their revenue streams.

 

[pailes]

When I compared the footage to other MTS files posted here I was unable to see the same levels of noise in their footage.

I've watched quite a bunch of example clips around, but didn't actually see any footage which would match your light conditions at all.

All I can say is that the level of noise I see in my footage is pretty much the same. With gain and less light it's much worse than that sometimes, especially in dark areas. I thought it was totally normal.

They are the ones who gave a definitive statement as shown above.

I really wonder about that too. Maybe you just got unlucky and somebody with the wrong experience looked at the footage or didn't even bother to look at all.

But I can feel your pain. It would really p*ss me off too.

 

[MrFluffy]

I really wonder about that too. Maybe you just got unlucky and somebody with the wrong experience looked at the footage or didn't even bother to look at all.

I did consider this, and if they had emailed and said this I would have accepted it. I only raised it with them to see if I had a legitimate problem. My guess is that I did.

But I can feel your pain. It would really p*ss me off too.

Thanks. Thats appreciated.

 

[MrFluffy]

An update.

I sent them a caustic message this morning and I just received a very email back telling me they will ship me a loan unit on Monday. So I guess my camera is faulty.

Unfortunatly I'm on location all day monday so I wont be here to get it. When I do get it I'll shoot the same test and do a direct comparison, I'm sure that everyone here would like to know if its any better. However, I can only assume at this point that the camera is faulty or they would have simply sent it back.

 

[pailes]

An update.

I sent them a caustic message this morning and I just received a very email back telling me they will ship me a loan unit on Monday. So I guess my camera is faulty.

Unfortunatly I'm on location all day monday so I wont be here to get it. When I do get it I'll shoot the same test and do a direct comparison, I'm sure that everyone here would like to know if its any better. However, I can only assume at this point that the camera is faulty or they would have simply sent it back.

Thanks a lot. I would be really interested in the results. Good luck.

 

[Hidef1080]

Just because its becoming the norm for big companies to treat customers badly does not mean we should take it. The only way it will change is for people to make a noise and hopefully threaten their revenue streams.

AGREED!:thumbup:

 

[jeff9329]

An update.

I sent them a caustic message this morning and I just received a very email back telling me they will ship me a loan unit on Monday. So I guess my camera is faulty.

.

I wonder what you will get for a loaner?

A palmcorder?

 

[Everts]

maybe a varicam 2700 ,for the emotional stress . Yes I've been drooling on the panasonic website allday: ).


I feel for you Mr Fluffy, but I can tell you now its not gonna be any different .

 

[snowleopard]

The only way it will change is for people to make a noise and hopefully threaten their revenue streams.

I agree too. However, I don't see things headed that way anytime soon. Circuit City, who used to have pretty decent sales staff, just went under, while Best Buy, who mostly employs kids out of school, remains strong.

Not saying it's right, just saying it sucks all over.

 

[MrFluffy]

An update.


The loan unit arrived today. Only problem is that when I sent them my camera I included the battery and they sent me a camera without one.

Ho Hum........

Phoned the UK Marketing manager and told him. His exact reponse was "Oh **** .. they didnt". So hes sending me a new battery FOC to keep as a good will gesture.

So hopefully thursday I will be able to make some test shoots.

 

[CiPO]

Hi MrFluffy,

for what it counts I wish you good luck. It is frustrating to get through what you had to. It's good to read all kind of experience from this forum and it is also a way of not feeling ... completely alone
Keep posting !
THX
CIPO

 

[MrFluffy]

Hi MrFluffy,

for what it counts I wish you good luck. It is frustrating to get through what you had to. It's good to read all kind of experience from this forum and it is also a way of not feeling ... completely alone
Keep posting !
THX
CIPO

Thanks.

My free battery arrived this afternoon

 

[MrFluffy]

So Ive just had a chnace to shoot some footage with the loan camera and I would say that the noise levels are comparable to my camera, and if anything a little worse.

So it may be that there is nothing wrong with my camera at all and that the level of noise is normal for that camera. However, they are still looking at it! I would have thought that if the noise level were on more than one camera and was normal they would have just sent it back to me. Maybe there is something more going on.

They are still very tardy and answering my emails.

 

[Hidef1080]

So Ive just had a chnace to shoot some footage with the loan camera and I would say that the noise levels are comparable to my camera, and if anything a little worse.

So it may be that there is nothing wrong with my camera at all and that the level of noise is normal for that camera. However, they are still looking at it! I would have thought that if the noise level were on more than one camera and was normal they would have just sent it back to me. Maybe there is something more going on.

They are still very tardy and answering my emails.

Based on the test footage I downloaded from you I really think your camera was off. Way off.

To get two cameras back to back with the same noise issue seem highly unlikey however.
My images look cleaner than the samples you gave so it is odd.
Plus the Panny tech said that your camera seemed to have more noise than normal.

Whatever the case I hope it all works out for you no matter which camera you choose in the end because the cameras are only the tools that help to take us where we what to see.

Good luck to you Fluffy!
:beer:

 

[pailes]

Based on the test footage I downloaded from you I really think your camera was off. Way off.

Would you then please take a similiar shoot in similiar lighting conditions?

I don't think the last shot of that color pattern was way off. It seemed pretty normal to me.

My images look cleaner than the samples you gave so it is odd.

Images really don't count, especially not when they're in different size. What we need is raw footage, taken with the same settings and in similar light.
Otherwise a comparison doesn't make sense at all.

Plus the Panny tech said that your camera seemed to have more noise than normal.

How does anybody know how much "tech" the guy really was who said that. I've spoken to quite some support hotlines already. Honestly, they don't know sh*t sometimes.

 

[MrFluffy]

How does anybody know how much "tech" the guy really was who said that. I've spoken to quite some support hotlines already. Honestly, they don't know sh*t sometimes.

Agreed, but then why have they still got my camera two weeks after it was delivered to them. If the tech guy was talking sh*t they would have just sent it back telling me "no fault found". How long does it take to hook it to a monitor and say "looks fine to me".

 

[pailes]

Agreed, but then why have they still got my camera two weeks after it was delivered to them. If the tech guy was talking sh*t they would have just sent it back telling me "no fault found". How long does it take to hook it to a monitor and say "looks fine to me".

Maybe they were all busy fixing the wobble issue of dozens of other cameras

Have you considered shooting some footage in bright daylight?

 

[MrFluffy]

Have you considered shooting some footage in bright daylight?

The original footage was shot next to a window on a sunny day. It was at f3.2, I seem to remember, which was the widest aperture that just stopped the zebras showing. Of course, if I over expose the image I dont get much noise, but I dont get much picture either!

 

[Hidef1080]

http://www.vimeo.com/2931766


Scene File 1 set to zero.
DRS – Off
GAMMA – HD Normal
KNEE – Low
MATRIX – Normal 1
SKIN TONE DTL – Off


720p shot under crappy fluorescent lights.

I forgot to add this is AVCHD to WMV HD.

I don't think this has as much noise as Fluffy's video.

Also when I say "images" it means video.
For stills I'll say stills or photo.

 

[MrFluffy]

Thanks for posting the footage.
However, all noisy footage will look pretty good when reduced to that size and compressed because the noise is the high frequency signal that is removed.

Another update.
I just got off the phone from Panasonic UK and they think that the camera meets their noise standards. However, given the greif that they have caused me I can have a full refund if I wish.

Now given that they said that the noise levels were acceptable for that camera I decided to just check its specified s/n ratio. Guess what... there isnt one.

Panasonic dont specify a signal to noise ratio for this camera, thus anything they produce is acceptable and there is no need for them to apply much in the way of quality control.

So you bet I want a refund. And given the project I have in mind, im going to buy a more expensive camera, and it certainly wont be by Panasonic.

My thanks to everyone who has offered support in this thread.