One new spec...

This is really great news. 2 of these should handle almost any shooting day. Really really exciting. That's all I have to say. :)
 
Again this stuff can be determined by the user. Extra options on the shooting mode. The more choices the better. As dear gram grams said "It is better to have choices than....to not"
 
Though if current compression is virtually lossless even when displayed on a 30' screen I can clearly see favourable reasons to focus on the popular request for increased fps.
 
Jeez, I asked for this very thing a couple of days ago on a mall Santa's lap and all I got was a weird stare and a security debrief...

But see Santa, 120fps is really nice but 720p is kinda small, 1080p or 2k would knock my ornaments right off

Maybe I should just reroute all of my North Pole correspondence to Lake Forest!
 
I sure hope you have some type of RAID going on for data protection not just speed, I would hate to use a standard laptop style drive for recording highend projects for fear of data loss from hard disk shake etc..they are NOT made to be handheld.
 
obin said:
I sure hope you have some type of RAID going on for data protection not just speed, I would hate to use a standard laptop style drive for recording highend projects for fear of data loss from hard disk shake etc..they are NOT made to be handheld.
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Yes. No. I half agree. No one would argue that redundancy is not important, but there are times when filmmakers are willing to take a few extra risks to get the shot. I'm sure RED would never (not once) want their hardware blamed for a lost shot, so they might want to preempt this by offering further data protection. But what about making this a user option?

In theory I would try to play it safe wherever possible. But in practice, I'd also love the option to shoot longer record times or higher frame rates - in those rare situations.... :happy:

This is quite a gift - 320GB (in an affordable package), with the tease of lower compression ratios and/or higher frame rates. How best to exploit it? One way is to use the RAID for redundant recording. Here's my highly subjective list of ways to exploit a mini-RAID setup, from most important to least.

1.) HIGHER FPS (Why? Because it's a mega feature - perhaps the only remaining barrier between digital & film. For me 120fps @ 2K is more important than 60fps @ 4K)
2.) LONGER RECORD TIMES (if I had more money this would be very low on the list - I'd just buy more drives.)
3.) REDUNDANT RECORDING (I'd gamble a bit on my own projects, play it safe on client gigs)
4.) ABILITY TO SHOOT 4.5K ANAMORPHIC (data rates seem to suggest this is possible)
5.) LOWER REDCODE COMPRESSION RATIO (very low on my list - I love REDCODE so far. And compression rates seem to follow the law of diminishing returns)
6.) 96 TRACKS OF AUDIO (just made that up...)

In hindsight, this post sounds insanely selfish and greedy. But what the hell - this is a forum right? And a kid can dream...

Perhaps we should make this a poll! :happy:
 
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I would recomend a two tired approach. Use the Red Raid for most of your standard, tripod mounted recording, and use the Red Ram ALA P2 style for your handheld, a 64GB drive will give you 32 minutes of 4k Redcode assuming about 32MB per second. You can also dump that off to a Raid5 bucket or something else like a Mini G drive in the field if you need to.

Redram, redram!

Sorry, Kubrick moment.
 
The compact nature of this mini-raid (and indeed the whole camera system incl lightweight still lenses) is nothing short of a blessing.

My project requires (or desires!) significant use of a handheld steady sled. I made a dummy set-up as a primer estimating and pre-guessing weights and their distribution as new info becomes available.

Sounds sad but I have the time and it's useful to me and others to know what we'll be dealing with.

Just need to get a suitable wireless lens control and we're good to go.
 
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For $1000 you could include a 1GB Flash buffer. No risk of data loss to bump and tustles unless you plan on shooting a really extended scene in the back of a truck while driving over potholes.
 
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For $1000 you could include a 1GB Flash buffer. No risk of data loss to bump and tustles unless you plan on shooting a really extended scene in the back of a truck while driving over potholes.
__________________
- Gavin Greenwalt
im.thatoneguy[remove]@gmail.com
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Gavin that is the best idea of all. Pre-record in very important to many of us. However if we use the red flash drive we are restricted in storage and no back up for safety.

Red Drive with the option of mirrored or not drives configured PLUS 1Gb of flash buffer would be absolutely brilliant.

Michael
 
im.thatoneguy said:
For $1000 you could include a 1GB Flash buffer. No risk of data loss to bump and tustles unless you plan on shooting a really extended scene in the back of a truck while driving over potholes.
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This reminds me. I haven't heard anyone mention the idea of a pre-record buffer for RED. I know it's a feature most useful to ENG shooting, but it seems like it would be a selling point, and something not too difficult to implement.

[edit] Never mind, that's what you meant... [/edit]
 
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Data Safety

Data Safety

I think RedFlash is the obvious choice anytime the camera is being jostled therefore I am comfortable with a RedDrive mini-RAID for all other RedCode scenarios without mirrroring. In the short term I am less interested in lower compression options for the RedDrive/RedCode combo since I am unconvinced the quality improvement would justify the overhead and there is always the uncompressed option if you have a very demanding application. I join the chorus that would love to see the RAID architecture lead to higher frame rates.

I am a big proponent of making at least 2 clones on set before wiping the RedDrives. I would use commodity hard drives with the option of dumping to LTO3 when convenient. My theory is that while hard drives do fail, the odds of two hard drives failing that both have the exact same shots on them is very remote. It also makes tons of sense to check the footage in the field before striking a big set, or quitting a location, or releasing talent for the day, etc.

Blair S. Paulsen
RedOne #19
 
bumping your drive one time while recording at it's max datarate will cause data loss. I don't know about you guys but that is not what I need while under the pressure of a set.
 
Pressure. Oh the joy of having none. Just a few dudes with spare time and dedication. Cheapie low budget film world. Makes you never want to leave.
 
stokestack said:
Slow-mo is cool and useful, but I'd like to vote for a lower-compression option as well.

Up with quality.
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if I had to choose, I'd take lower compression for the onboard system. If I reeally want 4k/60p then i'd be fine tethering the system to a drive. At the very least I can use the 60p 2k. haha....very least......
 
boothba said:
3.) REDUNDANT RECORDING (I'd gamble a bit on my own projects, play it safe on client gigs)
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^^^I think this would probably be my highest priority with the hard drive recording. If I can record RAID 1 then I know my footage will be much safer. :0
 
Gang 4 drives and use raid 0-1 for speed and redundancy.
How much could this possibly weight? Controller would be the same.
Perhaps this could be an v2 drive config. at extra cost.

I would pay.
 
With 360GB... I don't imagine filling more than one drive per day. Which means backup in the comfort of your trailer/studio shouldn't be a worry.

If you add a redundant RAID such as RAID 5 (my personal favorite), you'll slow down the whole operation so significantly you would probably need 4 drives instead of 2. Also you'd need a $200+ controller interface.

Not worth the extra redundancy in my books. RAID 0 is fine by me.
 
Now what would be really cool is a "Red HOT backup". Dual data ports on the camera so if you have one red raid you just plug it in and it works. If you have two Red Raids, then you plug them both in (or stack them) and you have 3 options:

1) Expanded Storage - what is it six hours continuous?
2) Faster writes (combined 2 dual drive raids into a larger raid)
3) Mirrored writes (write to one, then on the down time mirror the footage over so you always have an on-set backup.)

Sounds cool, doesn't it?

Also, I'll say it before someone chimes in--don't do anything that would keep you from giving us the camera faster--don't slow down--giving us less faster is giving us more sooner--don't make it too complex--what you are creating is magic enough---yadah, yadah, yadah...

But it still sounds cool and quite useful, don't you think?
 
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