cuervo
Veteran
+100 agreed.
Odyssey7Q April 2014 Firmware Update
- Thread starter Mitch Gross
- Start date
Imagine the device is storing 24fps and discarding , let's say, 23 of those frames per second, giving you a timelapse of 1fps... This reduces any micro changes that seem to happen when the device is just grabbing that single frame and then stopping recording
I always thought the problem was more of a mirror/iris issue, but even mirrorless cameras with manual aperture lenses still have the flicker problem.
I'm no technical buff.... All I know is the Blackmagic timelapse feature is 100% flicker free and a dream to work with, so I hope whatever technique they use can be brought across to the 7Q
Dave Allen
Member
I have a hardware suggestion. Put a stainless steel helicoil thread insert into the back rear and side female threaded ports. The aluminum threads will not hold up well to repeated insertions of steel threaded posts.
Like the rest, we look forward to the time lapse feature.
Like the rest, we look forward to the time lapse feature.
Mitch Gross
Veteran
Timelapse is on our roadmap, but other features do come first. I wouldn't even be mentioning it right now other than someone asked. It is not in the immediate future.
I guess I get what you are saying, that it eliminates the flickering in exposure, which I tend to associate with people doing time lapses in one of the priority modes (aperture or shutter priority), which will do an overall light reading of the scene for every picture, so if a car comes in with a reflection on the headlight, the camera will darken up the whole shot based on the hot spot in the frame.
I typically shoot in full manual for time lapses. I've also found that long shutters reduce the flicker you are referring to, but also helps make camera moves/subjects smoother. I am usually annoyed by things like jittery trees/bushes in time lapses. Here is one I did with a long shutter:
http://d.pr/v/tG1l
boosh
Well-known member
+1 for 4k prores being the top priority
as do I.... Even with full manual, mirrorless, manual lens... You will get flicker when it is only firing occasionally... I don't know why this is, but every camera I have tested does this occasionally (bar the blackmagic).
I make a fair chunk of my money from timelapse, so know every little technique that is out there. Long shutter is nice, hence why I mentioned about being able to override the blackmagic technique for long exposure.
yes!
Clermond
Veteran
04-28-2014 12:48 AM
tick tock goes the clock.. soon a quarter has passed since the last update.
so what's the definition of "far more frequent" ?
tick tock goes the clock.. soon a quarter has passed since the last update.
so what's the definition of "far more frequent" ?
Engineers need deadlines, especially public facing deadlines. They will curse at you, yell at you, berate you that there is no way they can meet those demands. They will come up with all sorts of excuses and reasons, like never ending bug lists or new bugs that arise. Public deadlines are the bane of their existence.
But at the end of a day, all engineers meet public facing deadlines because they will otherwise never finish. Yes, caffeine and stress are inversely proportional to the countdown of the deadline, but this is their job and why they're paid the way they are. "New bugs" that arise should be accounted for by project leads. Unless your codebase was fubar'ed to spaghetti in the rush to release, there really is no reason to prevent monthly releases, bugs and all.
At this point, since it is largely a software problem, somewhere in CD's pipeline there is a bottleneck that can be alleviated. Though, I suspect it may lead to a hard decision concerning employment. The Hard Things about Hard Things is a great read for this. It's either your engineering lead, your PM or your engineers themselves. Someone is making up excuses and not executing properly. Reduce feature sets for release. Limit P1/P2 bug fixes for release. At this point, it would probably be better to have a solid PM who can set fixed dates for releases and strip features 2 weeks out to hit those releases. There is absolutely no reason for delays to last this long unless it's due to some form of incompetence somewhere in the chain. Sorry to state it that way, but I've worked in software long enough to recognize the root of the problem.
Or maybe it's as simple as bringing back the public facing deadlines. More stress for everyone at CD (unfortunately), but more results.
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I freelance for various production companies in LA that do motion graphics, often mixed with live action. The live action portion is easy, it's the post that's a killer. We are NEVER, NEVER allowed to miss a deadline. For example, several years back I worked on the NBC re-brand. We were required to work 100+ hours a week for about 3 weeks out just to meet the deadline, and this is pretty common in TV; which I'm actually very against.
Fortunately, most production companies have figured out to make the deadline without completely killing people.
My point is, deadlines are NECESSARY, even if it mean that CD's engineers have to put in 100 hours a week to make it. This no deadlines policy that CD currently has is counter productive because the team has no time requirement. I have a feeling it's more the production that requires tweaking, because when a production is run correctly, deadlines should be meet in a reasonably manner.
Sorry to say this because I know Convergent is a family style business, but some restructuring is seriously needed because the "April Firmware Thread (which was only a bug fix)" is becoming a running joke. Seems to me the passion is missing in many of the engineers. Look at the Magic Lantern team. They are just a group of young 20 something's who are so passionate about what they do, they code 24 hours a day for FREE, and code circles around Convergent. The ML team has moved mountains and done the un-thinkable, CD needs some of what they got.
rheinturmblau
Well-known member
The O7Q is doing a pretty good job with 4K to HD ProRes.
It could be such a wonderful device, if it would meet more of its promised features.
- Are we in the middle of the "few days sorting out"-phase?
- Or in the middle of the "beta test" phase?
- Or in the "horrendous-go back to start"-phase?
Questions, questions, questions...
And to be honest: The next firmware release will not make my day, anyway. It's just to measure out countability. Still more time to go for 4k compressed recording (announced April 2013), to be expected for September or October hopefully.
I do not think, that we have missing passion in the development team. It seems to be missing project management and guidance, if a Sales person like Mitch has to remind the team to deliver stable, intermediate FW releases to the customers.
It could be such a wonderful device, if it would meet more of its promised features.
Two weeks later - no news are bad news:
- Are we in the middle of the "few days sorting out"-phase?
- Or in the middle of the "beta test" phase?
- Or in the "horrendous-go back to start"-phase?
Questions, questions, questions...
And to be honest: The next firmware release will not make my day, anyway. It's just to measure out countability. Still more time to go for 4k compressed recording (announced April 2013), to be expected for September or October hopefully.
I do not think, that we have missing passion in the development team. It seems to be missing project management and guidance, if a Sales person like Mitch has to remind the team to deliver stable, intermediate FW releases to the customers.
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Castaway Films
Member
I would vote for 4K ProRes...
S.Blanchardon
Well-known member
On my list : first 4K RAW 120fps, second 4K ProRes.
cuervo
Veteran
So, you're suggestion, gene, is that engineers forsake their lives, their families and their health...and for what? For the sake of a few indies' needs, like yours? I spent 35 years in a business with this ethic. I'm here to say this work ethic is really fuXXed up. No way, no how. I bow to CD for their absolute refusal to sacrifice and burnout their employees for the sake of the almighty deadline. IF CD did anything unethical, it was to advertise features before they were actually implemented. I hold them accountable for that deception. But, for protecting their employees health...kudos. There are those who will say it's ok, once in a while. The problem is, there's no such thing as "once ina while". It becomes a lifestyle, one crisis following the next. Just a bad practice to even do once.
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Er, yes. Either the engineers have been way over optimistic (as suggested by Mitch already) with what they can deliver within a certain time frame or CD wildly speculated regarding time frame/feature delivery. I suspect the later. But hey, it doesn't really matter, as neither of those scenarios are my fault and yet I'm the one having to deal with their incompetence. Oh and guess what, when I'm on deadline and things go wrong, I have to pull all nighters and forsake my personal life at the detriment of my family. No one crys me a f*cking river.
cuervo
Veteran
well, my suggestion to you is that you not hold your breath. If everone told those producers to go stick it up their arse, they wouldn't place unreasonable expectations and deadlines out there. But, there will always be that one spoiler who will work 24x7 that ruins the pot. Well, good luck to you.
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rheinturmblau
Well-known member
There is a responsibility for the leadership team to deliver products and services the way, they have been promised in their market place. And they also shall organize their resources in a way, that these promises can be fulfilled in time.
4K recording is the "quad" in Odyssee7Q. So there is pressure to deliver, as competition catches up.
I know a lot of software vendors, that are capable to service their clients timely, without burning employees. It seems to be a matter of efficient project management and total quality management. If Beta tests are hurdles of uncertaincy, there should be something improved stages before. If targets are not met, you need to add capacity or take other measures. You can throw in some extra hours, if you need to catch up two weeks. But we are talking about a delay of several months now. That cannot be fixed by some overtime hours or weekends.
I am worried, that things get worse instead of being delivered, soon. Take a look on the next promises in the pipeline:
http://www.convergent-design.com/Products/Athena.aspx
4K ProRes, DNxHD, DPX, DCI playback and recording equally versatile. Four camera field recording. Web streaming. First units to be shipped Q4.2014. Oh boy! CD cannot bring in all capacities into solving the missing O7Q-features. The next adventure is waiting, too.
4K recording is the "quad" in Odyssee7Q. So there is pressure to deliver, as competition catches up.
I know a lot of software vendors, that are capable to service their clients timely, without burning employees. It seems to be a matter of efficient project management and total quality management. If Beta tests are hurdles of uncertaincy, there should be something improved stages before. If targets are not met, you need to add capacity or take other measures. You can throw in some extra hours, if you need to catch up two weeks. But we are talking about a delay of several months now. That cannot be fixed by some overtime hours or weekends.
I am worried, that things get worse instead of being delivered, soon. Take a look on the next promises in the pipeline:
http://www.convergent-design.com/Products/Athena.aspx
4K ProRes, DNxHD, DPX, DCI playback and recording equally versatile. Four camera field recording. Web streaming. First units to be shipped Q4.2014. Oh boy! CD cannot bring in all capacities into solving the missing O7Q-features. The next adventure is waiting, too.
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sunnyjimfilms
Well-known member
If you told a producer to 'stick it up their arse' as you put it, the chances of you maintaining a meaningful career in this industry would be non existent. This is how it works - sometimes you've gotta work night and day to hit a deadline. That's what differentiates our role from regular 9-5 jobs.