C200: Noise reduction & raw

F

fhammond

Well-known member
Ok, short question: does the noise reduction setting have any effect if you're shooting raw?

I've been using the Canon Log 3 picture preset with raw. I think all that's doing is applying Canon Log 3 and Neutral color matrix. I think I could also then apply a custom picture file which could include a noise reduction setting. However, I'm not sure if noise reduction applies to raw. I'm going to test it myself but I'd appreciate knowing if someone else already has an answer.

Thanks.
 
I did some testing and the answer seems to be no: noise reduction has no effect when shooting raw. That said, there's less noise when using Canon Log 2 vs. Canon Log 3 but I don't think that's directly related to the noise reduction feature on the camera. Not entirely sure 'though...
 
fhammond said:
Ok, short question: does the noise reduction setting have any effect if you're shooting raw?

I've been using the Canon Log 3 picture preset with raw. I think all that's doing is applying Canon Log 3 and Neutral color matrix. I think I could also then apply a custom picture file which could include a noise reduction setting. However, I'm not sure if noise reduction applies to raw. I'm going to test it myself but I'd appreciate knowing if someone else already has an answer.

Thanks.
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I'm still waiting on my camera, but if this is like any of the other raw shooting cameras I've used (both stills and video), NR does not apply. Neither does color space or sharpness or any of the other settings you apply when you develop the raw image.
 
As I understand it Canon's dSLRs apply NR before Raw recording that's dependent on the ISO, but is not user selectable. Not sure if the same applies to the Cinema line, but imagine it is, & why the cameras perform fairly well at high ISOs.
 
I'm getting some pretty noisy 12-Bit raw footage even in daylight. Anyone have any tips for exposing for C-Log 2 correctly? Using Neat video on every clip is really time consuming...
 
I suppose noise reduction is just a part of the standard raw workflow now? Expect to denoise at the end of most projects shot in raw?
 
Black balance and check your exposures. My C200 is cleaner at 3200 ISO in raw than a RED Scarlet-x on the same shoot at ISO 800.
 
You should black balance the camera every time you turn it on to shoot if cold, that's what I do with the C300ii. It's especially necessary if shooting C-Log2.
 
IanTheM said:
A good practice when shooting on RED as well.
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I find black shading on the RED to be kind of mysterious. I had a Weapon 6K a few weeks ago and to black shade for all frame rates, I had to leave the camera on for 30 minutes to acquire operating temperature, then it took slightly over an hour to black shade. Kind of ridiculous. It has a quick mode for black shade but warns that it won't be optimal for all frame rates and raster sizes. If you want to do black shading properly on the RED, it takes over an hour.
 
You don't really have to do it frequently as before. Just put a cap on lens and push flut and iso to maximum. And move thru different speed. You'll see how good is current calibration and how well eventually adapts to different speed (need a few seconds). Neither you have to wait 30 min to acquire operating temperature. You can lower temporarily to a minimum fan speed and switch back to target temp mode after reaching desired operating temp
 
Alvise Tedesco said:
You don't really have to do it frequently as before. Just put a cap on lens and push flut and iso to maximum. And move thru different speed. You'll see how good is current calibration and how well eventually adapts to different speed (need a few seconds). Neither you have to wait 30 min to acquire operating temperature. You can lower temporarily to a minimum fan speed and switch back to target temp mode after reaching desired operating temp
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All may be true, but I just did what the engineer from RED Hollywood told me to do.
 
Now that I've got a few more projects under my belt I wanted to revisit this topic.....

I recently did my first all raw project from start to finish and found myself wanting to use noise reduction in post on a lot of shots (mostly shot at 800 ISO or higher). Then this week shot a project for a client 4K to the SD cards in Wide DR (mostly shot at 800 ISO) and didn't feel the need to use noise reduction at all in post. I need to do some more intentional tests, but it seems like the ticket for cleaner footage is to use lower ISO (lower than 800) when in controlled or lower light situations to cut down on the noise in-camera. So for exteriors and/or situations where you need the most dynamic range in the highlights shoot at 800 ISO and just plan on using noise reduction in post?

I have Magic Bullet Denoiser III and it does an ok job, but things start to look plastic-y to me pretty quickly. Any ideas on how to approach noise when shooting raw?
 
chris f said:
Now that I've got a few more projects under my belt I wanted to revisit this topic.....

I recently did my first all raw project from start to finish and found myself wanting to use noise reduction in post on a lot of shots (mostly shot at 800 ISO or higher). Then this week shot a project for a client 4K to the SD cards in Wide DR (mostly shot at 800 ISO) and didn't feel the need to use noise reduction at all in post. I need to do some more intentional tests, but it seems like the ticket for cleaner footage is to use lower ISO (lower than 800) when in controlled or lower light situations to cut down on the noise in-camera. So for exteriors and/or situations where you need the most dynamic range in the highlights shoot at 800 ISO and just plan on using noise reduction in post?

I have Magic Bullet Denoiser III and it does an ok job, but things start to look plastic-y to me pretty quickly. Any ideas on how to approach noise when shooting raw?
Click to expand...

I haven't done a controlled test, but I found the C300 II appears less noisy in the shadows at ISO 400 vs. 800. C200 might be similar. The tradeoff is less DR, which in most cases probably won't matter when shooting low light.

I think Neat Video has the best NR on the market for NLEs (and latest version has GPU + CPU processing, so it's reasonably fast for what it does). Dark Energy might be better (and faster), however it's not integrated into any NLEs. You can tune Neat Video to leave in some of the high frequency noise, which will help eliminate the plastic look. Another method to help reduce post NR soft/plastic-ness is to add pleasing noise grain. Neat Video also provides post NR sharpening tuning.

You might consider shooting MP4 for low-light situations to take advantage of in-camera NR. You may find that shooting RAW followed by post NR loses detail / looks plastic and that the MP4 is actually good enough, along with the fact that you don't need to spend time dealing with NR in post (which can take a lot of extra time, especially rendering).
 
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