no one will buy this camera at 9k

Once the BBC "chooses" an official cam, whether it's the Canon or the Panny ( I can't imagine they will run with Sony..) that will drive sales of a few thousand right there....if Canon sells 10k of these babies in a 3 year run that's 90 million gross...
 
i'm sticking to my guns. 9k is way too much in view of its rivals. canon will drop the price. if they don't i will personally reimburse every dvxuser who buys the canon the difference in price between the hvx and the canon. that's a promise.
 
let's not forget that the Panasonic will likely require many to spend money on new computers and storage. That will put the overall expense higher than the Canon.

Comparing the extra cost to the JVC is justified by the 1080 resolution compared to the 720 of the JVC, and I'm sure the canon stock lens will be much better than the JVC stock lens.
 
Jubal28 said:
:huh:

I'd be quite surprised to find that the people who bought the DVX for its progressive capabilities are in the minority of purchasers.
Click to expand...

It is true (defenately over here. You can buy the DVX now for around $2500. How many people with a $2500 cam blow up to film? or do filmlike projects? Next to none. DVX is the cam used for newsgathering and weddings. That's all interlaced - just as the cliensts want...
 
jrv3034 said:
I'm sure it's only a matter of time before someone comes up with a DTE box that attaches to the bottom or side of the HVX and allows for true hard-disk swapping.
Click to expand...

What? making it even heavier and bulkier then it already is? :shocked:
 
Zig_Zigman said:
Once the BBC "chooses" an official cam, whether it's the Canon or the Panny ( I can't imagine they will run with Sony..) that will drive sales of a few thousand right there....if Canon sells 10k of these babies in a 3 year run that's 90 million gross...
Click to expand...

Didn't they test with the JVC already? And as a 'successor' to the DV700 it might be an obvious choice? Besides, wasn't it agreed to commit to 720p in the EU?
 
brianluce said:
i'm sticking to my guns. 9k is way too much in view of its rivals.
Click to expand...


Which rivals?

JVC only shoots 720 and comes with what is apparently a pretty crappy lens (or so people say). So, I don't think it's unreasonable to charge $2-3000 more for 1080 footage, a good lens, and an HDSDI output.

The HVX is roughly the same price.... let's not pretend that it's only 6K.
On the cheaper end you could buy the firestore drive for 2K (bringing your total to 8K).
Or, you could buy the P2 card package from Panasonic for a total of 10K.

Either way, the cost of the HVX is hovering right around 9K (give or take a thousand).

Personally I'd rather shoot DVCProHD than HDV, but there are actually people who prefer HDV apparently. Plus, the Canon will have removable lens options, and the uncompressed HDSDI output. So, in the end I could see it evening out pricewise.

Point is, the Canon may seem a bit overpriced....but I don't see them dropping it much at all. Given the competition it seems to be just about the right price for this market.
 
canon is better for event coverage, with the nice ability to shoot whatever this 24f stuff is...

that's why a professional would be interested in this type of system (if they needed HD in the first place)

as for shooting a feature, i'd go with the HVX.

that brings me to my question (maybe barry or someone could answer this). Would the Canon be better for gaming event coverage (commonly known as LAN parties) then the HVX because of run times. the reason is ask is; will the 4:2:0 destroy any ability to shoot good low-light.

i might come into some decent event coverage work in the next year, while i'm also shooting a feature. i'm wondering if i should lean towards getting this or the HVX. i want the HVX because i just think, as a creative person it gives me a lot more versatility to create things i'd care about (frame rate matters more to me then lenses). on the other hand, producing features doesn't make me money.

i guess i could just rent an HDH1... then i'd need an HDV deck.. ugh.

oh well. any information on the 4:2:0 for lowlight would be great...
 
Jubal28 said:
:huh:

I'd be quite surprised to find that the people who bought the DVX for its progressive capabilities are in the minority of purchasers.
Click to expand...

I agree David. In fact; I find roboysyd's statement to be rather absurd.
 
I don't think that 4:2:0 would necessarily "destroy" any ability to shoot in low-light conditions; the entirety of the PAL DV world is 4:2:0.

If low-light performance is your main criteria, I'd be more concerned about the tiny pixels of the 1440x1080 chips hampering the low light capability. The Z1 is already two stops slower than the PD170, and that's with 960x1080 chips. If the XL H1 is truly using 1440x1080, it'll likely be at least another stop slower still. A little testing will verify; we should be able to answer these questions in November/December.
 
Do you have an XL camera now? I have the XL2 and while I love the camera it uses light like Kate Moss uses cocaine. I would not consider it a "low light" camera.
 
OK but keep in mind that the XL2 produces images free of noise, probably because it doesn't use "pre" gain at 0db.

The DVX is a couple of f/stops faster, but it produces noise at 0 db.
 
This camera is not in the same league as the Panasonic. It is for an entirely different crowd so its price compared to Panasonic means little.
 
Walter_Graff said:
This camera is not in the same league as the Panasonic. It is for an entirely different crowd so its price compared to Panasonic means little.
Click to expand...

Just out of curiousity Walter, what groups do you see each of these cameras being targeted at?
 
The JVC is a lost cause as already too many folks are having too many troubles. I had a post about JVC and how they would not deliver some time ago- the lowest end home user. The HVX is next up. I don't see P2 making it but if it did, then maybe videographers who do weddings, news, etc and some DVX users who look at it as a next step and who might be able to afford it. I don't think you could use it for legal stuff because of the nature of P2. And the Canon is for independent filmmakers and lower budget television and live events as it has the connections pros need for TV and it's internal controls (gamma, matrix, etc) are really designed for true filmmakers.
 
Makes sense. I'd never considered the ramifications of P2 recording in legal work, interesting notion.

Not sure I agree about the HVX being used by wedding videographers given the short recording times. Generally event videographers are going to want at least an hour of continuous shooting time, without having to wait to dump footage to continue shooting.

In fact, the more I think about it... I'm not exactly sure who the HVX is aimed at.
But I suppose whatever that group is, I'm in it...because I'm definitely interested so far.

Have you seen the footage from the HVX and/or the Canon?
I only ask because I've always found your feedback to be pretty insightful
 
"Not sure I agree about the HVX being used by wedding videographers given the short recording times. Generally event videographers are going to want at least an hour of continuous shooting time, without having to wait to dump footage to continue shooting."

I thought that as I was typing but didn't bother to stop. You are correct. And while folks seem to think P2 prices are going to drop dramatically, they will be in for a surprise. not only that but larger P2s are a pipe dream right now. It's called making an idea and hoping someone comes through with a solution for you. Let alone the additional $4k you need to make a system to use it properly.

"In fact, the more I think about it... I'm not exactly sure who the HVX is aimed at.
But I suppose whatever that group is, I'm in it...because I'm definitely interested so far."

I think Panasonic is counting on a lot of faith and I think they will not hit pay dirt with this camera. They were lucky with the DVX but good gamblers know when to quit. It has been a struggle for them to get saturation professionally with P2 and consumers can't afford the price tag. Nice idea, just to far ahead of its time and without direction, support, or saturation.

One thing I like about Canon is they don't lie. They list the HD1 under consumer products instead of using nifty marketing terms like pro etc. Canon started the whole indie revolution very quietly and they have never seemed to me to need to play games. The announcement of the HD1 was not huge but the chatter on the web is big. It's an exciting step up from the XL2 which is my favorite camera in its price range.

"Have you seen the footage from the HVX and/or the Canon?"

They showed some in NY recently at a Canon expo. Those that saw it said it was awesome. I will test the camera out when I can get one. It's now been pushed back to December but I am thinking even later. Here is a thread about how it looks:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=51340

I have not seen the HVX footage but then again I am not interested in this camera so don't care to. Eventually I will play with it and do some tests because I always do.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top