New Cinema EOS camera announcement

maranfilms said:
I have to say, I'm a bit bored with the new camera announcement every other month. Especially the watered down models (Which I'm guessing is most) that have the capabilities of so much more. I know it's how they generate revenue, And get the most out of a model. But none the less old.

And not to mention the price gouging. I mean, look what Pani put out for under 5k (af100). Aside from the sensor size, what does the c300 have that the af100 doesn't (feature wise,)?
Granted the IQ is different. But come on, I don't see any reason the c300 should be any more than 5k when they both developed these from scratch. I know If I don't like it, don't buy it. yeah, I get that, but as long as people feed in to the hype, they will only continue to do it, and more each time than the last.

I would love to see the community band together, and hit um where it hurts, Give them no choice, but to lower the price, or they don't sell. Sony's a perfect example of this. They didn't sell the expected amount of f3's, so they repackaged, and threw in slog, at a huge discount. They had no choice but to lower the price or risk being stuck with a warehouse full of dated cameras, and a loss.
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Unless you have the internal sales figures to back that statement up, you are just guessing.
 
@Mcgeedigital, your absolutly right, I am guessing. But I can't see any other reason to piss off a bunch of people that spent 3,600 on slog, and drop the price that much unless they were not selling to expectations. I shouldn't speculate, but I did. sorry :)
 
My guess is that they will do exactly what they have said they would do. They will make a DSLR that has pretty much the same attributes as the 5D Mark III except it will provide 4K resolution instead of HD for video. It will be 8 bit 4.2.0 and occupy the $6000-$7500 range. The increased resolution will however give the image quality a boost and you will probably have clean hdmi. It will probably also be an APS-C sized sensor. These are the only specs they really can give it to be honest. It will also probably yield an excellent quality image, certainly better than their new 5DMIII, but won't ever have the grading latitude of a Scarlet.
 
Nuno Dias said:
Jay Birch said:
You answered your own question.
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+1

Funny how people tend to put image quality at the bottom of their priorities...
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I am sorry to feel the need to say it but once you two are apparently typing from my own country, I will write the reason why. Dinheiro (money wise).

Reason why the portuguese of today would blush the time of Henry, the Navigator (it is perhaps convenient to notice that his blood was half british). If not all, who has ruled the mindset over there. Lately ;) at least.

Apart that anyhow, on that IQ wise equation, I am surely full portuguese :-) And half brit by adoption : D
 
Currently at a Canon camera event in Paris. Have used the new 5d and the image is MUCH better. Notably the absence of rolling shutter. Much more solid piece of kit as well than 5D2.

In any case the Canon rep just confirmed to me that it is indeed the 4K camera which will be unveiled on the 15th of April.
 
yoclay said:
It will be 8 bit 4.2.0 and occupy the $6000-$7500 range.
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I hope not. I mean, 4K at 8-bit 4.2.0 sounds like a horrible combination. Unless there's some provision for RAW (at the sensor's bit depth), this would be a pointless achievement. I think people have been clamoring for better bit-depths and color encoding before greater resolution.
 
Tzedekh said:
I hope not. I mean, 4K at 8-bit 4.2.0 sounds like a horrible combination. Unless there's some provision for RAW (at the sensor's bit depth), this would be a pointless achievement. I think people have been clamoring for better bit-depths and color encoding before greater resolution.
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It can only be 4:2:2. To compete with RED is their goal. ARRI and Canon are the most serious Jim Jannard's products' competitors.
 
maranfilms said:
I have to say, I'm a bit bored with the new camera announcement every other month. Especially the watered down models (Which I'm guessing is most) that have the capabilities of so much more. I know it's how they generate revenue, And get the most out of a model. But none the less old.

And not to mention the price gouging. I mean, look what Pani put out for under 5k (af100). Aside from the sensor size, what does the c300 have that the af100 doesn't (feature wise,)?
Granted the IQ is different. But come on, I don't see any reason the c300 should be any more than 5k when they both developed these from scratch. I know If I don't like it, don't buy it. yeah, I get that, but as long as people feed in to the hype, they will only continue to do it, and more each time than the last.

I would love to see the community band together, and hit um where it hurts, Give them no choice, but to lower the price, or they don't sell. Sony's a perfect example of this. They didn't sell the expected amount of f3's, so they repackaged, and threw in slog, at a huge discount. They had no choice but to lower the price or risk being stuck with a warehouse full of dated cameras, and a loss.
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I agree but that will never happen
 
HHL said:
Shucks. I'm not sure, but I think I might be alllll "Canon"-ed out. A weee bit underwhelmed. Their incremental improvements are fine....but a little bit tiring.
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HHL for the win. I like Canon a lot, own their gear, etc. But given the long wait between Mark II/III bodies, the pricing on the C300 (in conjunction w/no lower priced S35 sensor model), the pricing of the Mark III as well as the no clean HDMI out, and my general feeling is, "Meh."

Not saying the new camera(s) are bad, just not hitting the sweet spot.
 
yoclay said:
My guess is that they will do exactly what they have said they would do. They will make a DSLR that has pretty much the same attributes as the 5D Mark III except it will provide 4K resolution instead of HD for video. It will be 8 bit 4.2.0 and occupy the $6000-$7500 range. The increased resolution will however give the image quality a boost and you will probably have clean hdmi. It will probably also be an APS-C sized sensor. These are the only specs they really can give it to be honest. It will also probably yield an excellent quality image, certainly better than their new 5DMIII, but won't ever have the grading latitude of a Scarlet.
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For discussions sake, let's say Canon does what Yoclay describes.

Any speculation about what recording format(s) such a camera would use? I suppose NLE software may need to be updated to be compatible with it, and a wait for updates depending on which NLE. Not knocking Canon, this is just the usual mouse passing through the snake.

I suppose the 4:2:0 (if it happens) will be the way Canon "limits" the camera, as they did with the no clean live HDMI out from the 5DM3.

The more I hear about both the 5DM3 and the cinema DSLR mystery cam, the more I like them. Both will be very useful in their own way. In my case, I might buy a 5DM3, and the (probably more expensive) cinema DSLR would likely be a rental item.
 
It is clear now that the 5DM2 was an inadvertent revolution that Canon seems utterly determined not to repeat. They behave like a company with no competition. After the dissapointing 1DX, C300, and 5D3 announcements I have little hope or excitement left in my reserves for whatever they announce next. Hype does not spring eternal. Three sputtering balloons, one after another, each one flatulently deflating on arrival, is enough to convince me that Canon's hype machine is full of hot air.
 
Peter J. DeCrescenzo said:
For discussions sake, let's say Canon does what Yoclay describes.

Any speculation about what recording format(s) such a camera would use? I suppose NLE software may need to be updated to be compatible with it, and a wait for updates depending on which NLE. Not knocking Canon, this is just the usual mouse passing through the snake.

I suppose the 4:2:0 (if it happens) will be the way Canon "limits" the camera, as they did with the no clean live HDMI out from the 5DM3.

The more I hear about both the 5DM3 and the cinema DSLR mystery cam, the more I like them. Both will be very useful in their own way. In my case, I might buy a 5DM3, and the (probably more expensive) cinema DSLR would likely be a rental item.
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I think it was already mentioned - my memory is not precise but it may have been during the announcement. My understanding is that the c series DSLR's would shoot 4k to jpeg. I don't know if this would be still jpeg with 2nd system audio or motion jpegs with audio.

edit: this would make sense as the technology already exists to shoot and record 24 x 4k jpegs per second to a card and we would get 8bit 4:4:4 RGB
 
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Furthermore the post workflow for canon still raw .cr2 files with adobe is pretty much bulletproof and we already know photoshop can take video now so its only a few steps away to have a canon dslr shoot and record 24x 4k .cr2 files per second and a future photoshop or premiere opens a clip of .cr2 raw in batch

4k raw would be 8 or 9 megapixel, thats less than half the size of the raw files that most canon dslr's record, 24 or 30 of these per second should be do-able
/speculating
 
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J so its only a few steps away to have a canon dslr shoot and record 24x 4k .cr2 files per second and a future photoshop or premiere opens a clip of .cr2 raw in batch[/QUOTE said:
yes. I see where this is going. It sort of reminds me of an early competitor to Photoshop that many of us Multimedia Wonks used in the early 90's - Debabelizer did exactly what you are describing. I wonder if Adobe is working on a technology convergence. Something the Old Macromedia would have called, Author in One Format & edit in Many?

I mean I'd love to avoid shooting stills altogether and just pull stills from 4K clips, shooting vids as primary. I'm guessing that the news agencies are pushing for this which would basically create a the integrated hybrid ENG ImageMonger.

This could also spell the end of the 'vertical' picture format ;)
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Its a good idea in theory but for stills its great to have a sharp image and faster shutter speeds than the natural looking 180 degree shutter angle amount of motion blur for motion

Edit: the red fashion guys use stills from motion as a way of quickly getting the right frame for that moment of expression. In this scenario – yes it works but I can't see it working for news or doc.
*by vertical you mean portrait (vertical) and landscape (horizontal) is the terminology
 
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