F3: Maximum F3

[Sttratos]

Yeah I have been seeing Arri Alexa Classics on eBay for as little as US$8K-ish!

Seems there was nothing new from Arri at IBC, maybe NAB 2018 is when the next iteration will happen? And then we'll see prices drop off a cliff.

Or maybe they will do it IBC 2018 or NAB 2019 or who knows when.

Because the fact is nobody is really complaining the Alexa doesn't have a 4K chip. Well nobody who really matters. Deakins and his peers seem to be fine with it and even prefer it because of that. Hollywood is fine with it. Besides Netwhocares everybody is just fine with the cameras the way they are. Even Amazon. And Netwhocares has also shown that if you have a big enough name, you can use any camera you want when they were OK with Scorcese using the Alexa for a Neflix backed production.

This is why Arri doesn't seem in a hurry. The only ones complaining are people who don't have the cameras. The SXT and Minis are always out when you call rental houses. Hollywood is still massively using the Alexas. It 's still the industry standard and shows no signs of change. Why would Arri hurry?:thumbsup:

 

[JCummings]

I love seeing the F3 being used, it's a shame mine just sits and collects dust. Really is a great camera and I've debated on selling mine but for the price they are going for now it doesn't make sense.

I also dust mine off for occasional 2nd camera duty. I suspect many still keep their F3 precisely for that same reason...they're too good to just give away.

 

[starcentral]

I regretted selling my F3 for a long time... if I knew then what I know now... but also I need the money to go into the next camera so for me I had to part with it.

But stepping into almost a decade after the F3 was launched however I do like to think of my new FS5 as a very decent F3 successor - smaller, e-mount, newer color space, auto focus, auto ND, 10-bit 422 HD, 4K, HDR, HFR, RAW access... it's made me feel a lot better dealing with the loss of my F3.

For the guys who still own F3's, is there any reason if you can get a couple thousand dollars for it you wouldn't be tempted to get an FS5 ?

 

[yoclay]

For the guys who still own F3's, is there any reason if you can get a couple thousand dollars for it you wouldn't be tempted to get an FS5 ?

I don't like the compression in the FS5. It makes the image feel soft to me. Softer than even the F3. I haven't shot RAW on it, but that would require an external recorder, so not the different when you begin to rig it, but this would be the only situation where the FS5 would be worth it to me...and of course I like the variable ND that is built in. Otherwise, I have always preferred the original SLOG to SLOG2/3. End of the day, a used F3 is one third of the cost of the FS5, so more interesting to me. Which is why I may be buying a third one soon. I would rather have the coverage with 3 F3's rather than a single Alexa for fiction work for instance.

Otherwise, I am very impressed with the RAW output of the C200 and I like the DPAF, so that camera would be where I would upgrade to if I was considering FS5 territory. The only thing that troubles me is that lack of interchangeable mounts to be able to use my PL glass on it when needed.

 

[Guest]

Really? So you look at footage from the 8 years old Alexa or 9 years old F35 compared to the Canons, Varicam, F55 and F65 and see progress being made? What it makes me do when I look at footage from the 8 years old Alexa or 9 years old F35 is to ask why the heck they still look better than all the cameras today. It makes me ask why haven't we really progressed.

When you talked about the new cameras being so flexible with either size or low light you were making sense. When you switched to the footage you too me to the twilight zone and wtf land.

Eh, way to twist my meaning.
I meant cameras by and large are improved, despite any nostalgia I may have for cameras I enjoyed from the past.

 

[OnSet]

For the guys who still own F3's, is there any reason if you can get a couple thousand dollars for it you wouldn't be tempted to get an FS5 ?

A couple of thousand dollars is not a good enough incentive to be without my F3. Most of my clients want 1080p. They want to take the footage (WYSIWIG) and edit it with minimal or no color correction in post. For interviews and tripod-based shooting they often request the F3 as opposed to an FS7 - when both cameras are on a shoot they seem to prefer the F3 look. This week I DP'd a shoot with 3 FS7's, the F3 and a couple of A7s2/A7R2 cameras. All 1080p. F3 does a wonderful job with its oversampling and looks great. As long as my clients want 1080p I'll be keeping the F3. It's an old friend.

Plus, any camera I bring as a primary (not including the A7's in this - since they are normally not used except as specialty cams on my shoots) absolutely needs to have ECS capability. I use ECS on a regular basis to eliminate flicker from large projection LED displays and other off-frequency light sources - which would keep me from using an FS5 at this point (and of course prevents using an A7s as well...)

 

[Alpha Beta Omega]

I always felt my F3 looked truly great and it was easy to operate. It was a bit stuck in a half poor body but fast to nail exposure and focus in real use.

 

[Sttratos]

I regretted selling my F3 for a long time... if I knew then what I know now... but also I need the money to go into the next camera so for me I had to part with it.

But stepping into almost a decade after the F3 was launched however I do like to think of my new FS5 as a very decent F3 successor - smaller, e-mount, newer color space, auto focus, auto ND, 10-bit 422 HD, 4K, HDR, HFR, RAW access... it's made me feel a lot better dealing with the loss of my F3.

For the guys who still own F3's, is there any reason if you can get a couple thousand dollars for it you wouldn't be tempted to get an FS5 ?

One of the first things I remember thinking when I got my FS7 and comparing it to my F3 was thinking the FS7 didn't really look any better than the F3. To me it felt like a F3 with more features. Not really like a superior camera or superior image. So I would say the same will apply to a FS5. Knowing what I know today and after have gone through a FS7 and sold it, if all I wanted was 4K I would not exchange a F3 for a FS5. I would keep the F3 and buy a used FS700 with a 7Q and save the money. Not worth selling F3s for what they sell for today. I would only go for a FS5 if I specifically needed something that only it could do. Image alone is not a reason to sell a F3 for a FS5 or even a FS7 IMO. This is based on experience of having owned a FS7 and F3 together and shooting them along side.

 

[IronFilm]

A couple of thousand dollars is not a good enough incentive to be without my F3. Most of my clients want 1080p. They want to take the footage (WYSIWIG) and edit it with minimal or no color correction in post. For interviews and tripod-based shooting they often request the F3 as opposed to an FS7 - when both cameras are on a shoot they seem to prefer the F3 look. This week I DP'd a shoot with 3 FS7's, the F3 and a couple of A7s2/A7R2 cameras. All 1080p. F3 does a wonderful job with its oversampling and looks great. As long as my clients want 1080p I'll be keeping the F3. It's an old friend.

Plus, any camera I bring as a primary (not including the A7's in this - since they are normally not used except as specialty cams on my shoots) absolutely needs to have ECS capability. I use ECS on a regular basis to eliminate flicker from large projection LED displays and other off-frequency light sources - which would keep me from using an FS5 at this point (and of course prevents using an A7s as well...)

What is ECS?

 

[arturrito]

guys, I never will sell my F3, just stunning images, clean 10 bits 444 output, a pleasure to grade, cinematic color science and that skins tone!!

webserie 100% F3 444 shooting on Pix recorder, feel free to enjoy it!

https://vimeo.com/losconversos

https://vimeo.com/235855524

 

[B.Berry]

IronFilm

ECS on the F3, is clear scan. Used for shooting computer screens or any type of unusual refresh rate of a TV or monitor. Very useful!

 

[Donny 123]

Not sure the fs7..f5 its now called "continuous ".. very handy for computer roll bar..

 

[OnSet]

Shutter speed can be precisely 'dialed in' on the FS7, but to the best of my knowledge not in the FS5.

Besides eliminating scan lines in monitors, ECS is also extremely useful when dealing with certain LED light sources, particularly when they are dimmed - as often happens in theatrical stage productions. Was shooting a Broadway show this week (with 3 F3's) and needed to use ECS to eliminate the flicker from a specific effects light cue. Basically once we adjusted one camera and found the specific shutter speed to use, we were able to set the other two to the same shutter to eliminate the issue.

 

[Harry Lime]

For the guys who still own F3's, is there any reason if you can get a couple thousand dollars for it you wouldn't be tempted to get an FS5 ?

I have some fairly heavy glass and don't trust it on the standard e-mount with a PL adapter. The F3 FZ mount is super strong.

I really wish Sony made a FS5 II with the new stronger lockable e-mount of the FS 7II, but I would be shocked if Sony actually did that. But I really like the size of the FS5. If it shot RAW internally it would be even better. Having to add something like an Odyssey kind of negates the tiny size advantage.