Inception

[dust'n the callipygous]

One thing I like is this movie left room for interpretation VERY MUCH like Memento did.

I thought Memento was pretty clear cut. I don't really know what is left to interpret.

On another note, here's something by brother mentioned to me. With the whole inner-ear function, and gravity still having an effect on the dream below, why weren't they floating without gravity in the snow (and every dream level below that)? They starting floating when the van began to fall off the bridge, so the level below that (hotel) they would float as well. But since they were floating in the hotel level, the same lack of gravity would have to be present below, in the snow level, and so on.

 

[Everts]

Arthur bound them together so they were like " mass" and had a sense of Gravity...Christopher you owe me one

 

[Rick Burnett]

I thought he did that just to wrangle them together to get them in the elevator.

And I think there is still a lot to understand in Memento in terms of knowing for sure. I still hear people argue over what actually was happening the whole time.

At least though it's not as bad as trying to figure out what the hell David Lynch is telling you! I still don't know what that cowboy was talking about.

 

[azharrison]

I just saw INCEPTION the other day, I'm sorry if my opinions are redundant, I read much of this thread but not all 20+ pages...

I enjoyed the movie. It was worth the 10 bux I paid BUT... I thought that the characters were too shallow and the story too deep... the characters were forced to "explain" much of the physics of the dreamworld. Also, why were they completely unprepared to meet resistance in the dreamworld? Perhaps they should have tacked on an extra hour to this movie but I was left with numerous unanswered questions about the physics and motives of this world/dream state/whatever...

The dream within a dream within a dream within a dream within a dream.... or did I go a dream to deep... or to shallow?!? I lost track somewhere... And where was that Mal? She was in all dream states? And none of DiCaprio's cronies have EVER encountered her inside these highly calculated dream capers?

They recruited some rookie girl to be the architect so that DiCaprio's character wouldn't know the layout? Mal plops in anyway sooooo, that was no help... didn't anyone else on the mission see her coming? How did she SNEAK down to his basement thoughts?

Like others, I thought the Alpine snow chase scene was a Splinter Cell/Call of Duty ripoff and COMPLETELY unnecessary, unless it was only to tip the balance to ACTION rather than DRAMA in the Blockbusters rack.

I enjoyed the movie but the Hitchcock "fridge" review is... there were to many "but why did this happen...?" unexplained, unsatisfied moments.

Too many rules within rules and exceptions to the rules, etc... which IMO distracted from the main characters and the main story... At the end? I didn't care about DiCaprio's kids, or his struggle to see them one last time, his redemption, his being with Mal forever.... or the weak last meeting with the Asian guy... I didn't really even understand, or care about that part of the ending/beginning?

my $.02 = NULL

 

[Everts]

I went for a second time and enjoyed it just as much...
Besides it was either that , Salt , Prince of Persia or Knight and Day.
So we choose Inception.

There are two jump cuts in the movie .....one of them I believe was on purpose.
The one where Cob thanks the new architect ( forgot her name) for not asking him if he killled his wife or not !
Also love the fact that they never used titles anywhere to say what time it is or the location or level 1, dream 1....You have to go with the flow !

I said earlier that when Cob and his wife woke they were not attached to the machine but they were. Saw it better you can see the briefcase behind them .

It looks like this movie was 90% shot on medium to tele lens .Most shots look like 35-50mm.
There wides but very view.
This is such a great movie, camera work , acting, editing, directing,art direction were all in place..... Heck maybe even catering

Spoiler !!!!! aah you should have seen it by now

There is something different about the children at the end....especially the girl ! I won't say what .
The colors are the same but I believe the director just likes to keep our brains rolling !

 

[Simon Höfer]

i just saw inception the other day, i'm sorry if my opinions are redundant, i read much of this thread but not all 20+ pages...

I enjoyed the movie. It was worth the 10 bux i paid but... I thought that the characters were too shallow and the story too deep... The characters were forced to "explain" much of the physics of the dreamworld. Also, why were they completely unprepared to meet resistance in the dreamworld? Perhaps they should have tacked on an extra hour to this movie but i was left with numerous unanswered questions about the physics and motives of this world/dream state/whatever...

The dream within a dream within a dream within a dream within a dream.... Or did i go a dream to deep... Or to shallow?!? I lost track somewhere... And where was that mal? She was in all dream states? And none of dicaprio's cronies have ever encountered her inside these highly calculated dream capers?

They recruited some rookie girl to be the architect so that dicaprio's character wouldn't know the layout? Mal plops in anyway sooooo, that was no help... Didn't anyone else on the mission see her coming? How did she sneak down to his basement thoughts?

Like others, i thought the alpine snow chase scene was a splinter cell/call of duty ripoff and completely unnecessary, unless it was only to tip the balance to action rather than drama in the blockbusters rack.

I enjoyed the movie but the hitchcock "fridge" review is... There were to many "but why did this happen...?" unexplained, unsatisfied moments.

Too many rules within rules and exceptions to the rules, etc... Which imo distracted from the main characters and the main story... At the end? I didn't care about dicaprio's kids, or his struggle to see them one last time, his redemption, his being with mal forever.... Or the weak last meeting with the asian guy... I didn't really even understand, or care about that part of the ending/beginning?

My $.02 = null

^+1

 

[Jawa Ex Machina]

the new architect ( forgot her name)

Ariadne, after the Greek princess who helped Theseus through the maze with the Minotaur in Greek mythology.

How's that for ripping off The Matrix, giving the characters names from mythologies like that? :grin:

 

[Everts]

Ariadne, after the Greek princess who helped Theseus through the maze with the Minotaur in Greek mythology.

How's that for ripping off The Matrix, giving the characters names from mythologies like that? :grin:

tisk, tisk !

 

[Ian-T]

I enjoyed the movie. It was worth the 10 bux I paid BUT... I thought that the characters were too shallow and the story too deep... the characters were forced to "explain" much of the physics of the dreamworld. Also, why were they completely unprepared to meet resistance in the dreamworld? Perhaps they should have tacked on an extra hour to this movie but I was left with numerous unanswered questions about the physics and motives of this world/dream state/whatever...

I think the reason why some felt the characters were forced is because there was not much of a build up for us getting to know them. If they stretched the movie longer, like you said, or even made a continuation of it in a second move then we would have had a chance to see their characters develop and care more about what happens to them. A second movie might be overkill…so making it an hour longer would have probably helped (as long as it already was).

The dream within a dream within a dream within a dream within a dream.... or did I go a dream to deep... or to shallow?!? I lost track somewhere... And where was that Mal? She was in all dream states? And none of DiCaprio's cronies have EVER encountered her inside these highly calculated dream capers?

Hmm…I didn’t have any difficulty in knowing how many levels of unconsciousness they were in. That seemed pretty easy to me. But I thought about your question on why Mal never encounters the other folks. That’s because she is part of Leo’s guilty conscience and is trying to kill him so he could join her. She has no interest in the others.

They recruited some rookie girl to be the architect so that DiCaprio's character wouldn't know the layout? Mal plops in anyway sooooo, that was no help... didn't anyone else on the mission see her coming? How did she SNEAK down to his basement thoughts?

But Mal was very limited because of this. I’m not sure why they chose a rookie but one thing I do know is that she was supposed to be gifted at making intricate layouts. It would be quite difficult in conquering a master maze builder’s work and that is what I believe they were counting on when they recruited her.

Like others, I thought the Alpine snow chase scene was a Splinter Cell/Call of Duty ripoff and COMPLETELY unnecessary, unless it was only to tip the balance to ACTION rather than DRAMA in the Blockbusters rack.

I liked it. The movie was long…I needed something to wake me up…lol.

 

[dust'n the callipygous]

At least though it's not as bad as trying to figure out what the hell David Lynch is telling you! I still don't know what that cowboy was talking about.

Do you mean the cowboy from Mullholland Dr. or that short film? Both really weird, but in totally different ways. I don't get a lot of his stuff

 

[Digigenic]

At least though it's not as bad as trying to figure out what the hell David Lynch is telling you! I still don't know what that cowboy was talking about.

In Mulholland Drive, the cowboy provided the director with two paths that determined his fate. He allowed him to make that decision based on the premise of understanding that his attitude determined his fate. The cowboy also said that by fixing his attitude, he could stay (ride) with him into "the good life" - implying that he (the cowboy) determined his fate, which could be interpreted in different ways. Some say the cowboy was no different than the cowboys who control the territory is Vegas and ultimately call the shots on who stays and who goes. Others go so far as to say that given the consistency of good vs evil or "doing good vs doing bad" that the director was talking to the Devil and making his deal with the Devil in order to secure his career. Given that his clash with the Castigliane brothers (who really weren't pleasant at all) set him on this path, I'd say the meeting wasn't of pure origins.

Okay, now back on topic to Inception.

 

[NC17z]

SPOILERS

Usually a protagonist has multiple objectives driving the narrative -- one professional (to plant an idea in the mark's mind), one personal (to re-enter the united states and see his kids), and one that's private (to find closure with his dead wife). so, you're all right.

Zak, You are right that these are the outlined objectives of Cobb however,
NOTE: THIS IS ONLY MY OPINION or MY INTERPRETATION!

Everybody has missed the largest objective that Cobb has,

He can no longer DREAM! He can no longer CREATE!

His words in the very beginning of the movie when tying the rope to the chair before climbing out the window. Mol Says, "Do our children miss me"? He replies, only to himself, "I Can't Imagine".
This is the most important parameter in the whole frikin movie. He Can't Imagine!
Of course the children miss their mother, we are witnesses moments later when he's speaking with them on the phone.

By truly breaking down the Hero's Journey here, this is what he's seeking subconsciously, the ability to DREAM! again. Yes, I'm aware that once he lets go of Mol, the Guilt of planting the idea that leads to her death he with then be able to move on with his life however, ultimately he will be able, TO SEE THEIR FACES. (My new Favorite Obligatory Scene). Why is the very end the movie so fantastic, because HE could not get that top to Stay Spinning. It was always from the perspective of Mol. Not Cobb. He can now make it spin... and stay spinning.

Chris Nolan would not dumb this portion of the movie down to this level of "Letting Go of Mol"... IT goes deeper than that.

 

[Fahad]

^^dang it. now i have to watch it again!

 

[WildTrackDave]

But I thought about your question on why Mal never encounters the other folks. That’s because she is part of Leo’s guilty conscience and is trying to kill him so he could join her. She has no interest in the others.

She did encounter Arthur at Saito's party in the beginning. And obviously it wasn't the first time because Arthur said "What's she doing here? (not very surprised)" and "Yeah, well, remember, we're here to work." She also captured and shot him.

Unless you mean all the others on the team, in which case, I'd have to agree with you (except of course Ariadne).

NC17z: You make very good points. I never thought about it from that perspective. Very interesting!

 

[agcohn]

SPOILERS



Zak, You are right that these are the outlined objectives of Cobb however,
NOTE: THIS IS ONLY MY OPINION or MY INTERPRETATION!

Everybody has missed the largest objective that Cobb has,

He can no longer DREAM! He can no longer CREATE!

His words in the very beginning of the movie when tying the rope to the chair before climbing out the window. Mol Says, "Do our children miss me"? He replies, only to himself, "I Can't Imagine".
This is the most important parameter in the whole frikin movie. He Can't Imagine!
Of course the children miss their mother, we are witnesses moments later when he's speaking with them on the phone.

By truly breaking down the Hero's Journey here, this is what he's seeking subconsciously, the ability to DREAM! again. Yes, I'm aware that once he lets go of Mol, the Guilt of planting the idea that leads to her death he with then be able to move on with his life however, ultimately he will be able, TO SEE THEIR FACES. (My new Favorite Obligatory Scene). Why is the very end the movie so fantastic, because HE could not get that top to Stay Spinning. It was always from the perspective of Mol. Not Cobb. He can now make it spin... and stay spinning.

Chris Nolan would not dumb this portion of the movie down to this level of "Letting Go of Mol"... IT goes deeper than that.

That would have been an interesting concept, but I do not believe that that is an interpretation that Nolan intended for the film.

The film specifically states that the reason Cobb doesn't create the dream worlds anymore is that it is too dangerous. Then when Cobb and Ariadne head down an extra dream level after Fischer, they make a point of saying that they have to go into one of Cobb's dreams, because Ariadne doesn't have any more dream worlds she's created.

You say that Nolan wouldn't make it only about letting go of Mal, but I'm not sure what you've seen in his other films that makes you think he is a "deeper" filmmaker than that. His films are clever, but they really aren't that deep.


It's not like Kubrick with Full Metal Jacket, where some people believe that Private Pyle (Vincent D'Onofrio) wasn't a real soldier, and that all of the scenes in the bathroom (called "the Head" in the military) are actually taking place in Private Joker's head.

But that's Kubrick. He does stuff like that in most of his films.

Nolan really has never done anything like that to make me think that he would start doing it now.

 

[NC17z]

The film specifically states that the reason Cobb doesn't create the dream worlds anymore is that it is too dangerous. Then when Cobb and Ariadne head down an extra dream level after Fischer, they make a point of saying that they have to go into one of Cobb's dreams, because Ariadne doesn't have any more dream worlds she's created.

I have to disagree with you on this statement. "The film specifically states"... Where in the movie does it specificaly state? Dialoge, subtext, where?

I don't want this to come accross the wrong way however,
I don't know where in the movie anything was led to believe or stated that it was too dangerous for Cobb to create dreams? ( Some one please give me a specific senario, statement, subtext, dialoge).

The only thing that is specific about why Cobb dosen't create the dream worlds is when he is speaking with his Father played by Michael Cane.
"Why don't you build them your self", "I Can't, Mal won't let me"... We know all the reasons why she won't let him. She wants him to choose between what she believes hs precieved world is and her world, the dream world. He knows the danger, because, he knows the truth that her world is the dream world blah, blah, balh...

I should note that I've seen this movie, Three Times in an iMAX Theater in Manchester, CT...

I've taken a few steps back from my computer and thought about what I just wrote in regards to questions. I don't think that there were any statements, dialoge what have you that indicate that it would be dangerous if he created dreams however, I think it is implied enough... So I get why you would say that it would be dangerous for him to create dreams. However, please remember that he can no longer create, because in the begining of the movie as stated in my last post, Cobb makes the statement, the leads me to believe he does not have the abilty to imagine. If you don't have the ability to imagine how can you have the ability to create. How can you alow yourself to "Discover, True Inspiration". You can't, he can't... ugh....

 

[Ian-T]

Manchester got an IMAX....when? Moved from East Hartford years ago....dang!!

Anyways....I too had the understanding that it was too dangerous for Cobb to build the world himself. 'Mal wouldn't let him" because she would easily figure out his maze (which is why they needed a talented architect).....being that she is in his subconcience.

 

[Jawa Ex Machina]

I wish Scandinavia would get an IMAX.

 

[NC17z]

Manchester got an IMAX....when? Moved from East Hartford years ago....dang!!

Anyways....I too had the understanding that it was too dangerous for Cobb to build the world himself. 'Mal wouldn't let him" because she would easily figure out his maze (which is why they needed a talented architect).....being that she is in his subconsciouses.

Yes, Manchester, is one of Two in the whole State I believe that has a real iMAX Theater, we just lost the Showcase Cinemas Name though with in the last few weeks its now called RAVE Cinemas. We do get all you can eat popcorn and soda now...

Yes, I realize he can't because its to dangerous because Mal's in his subconscious and wont let him because she has her own agenda.

Am I the only one who understands what he meant by "I can't Imagine"?

I can't be the only one that realizes he can't dream anymore,... Remember the Chemist makes the statement, in the basement with the others that were sharing the dream, "You can no longer dream in the real world"...
My understanding, is that the more time you spend in the dream state the harder it is for you to dream on your own which would require you to have to share dreams and heavy sedation. Cobb spent a majority of time "Something like 50 Years" with Mal creating and they Finlay reached the shore of their subconscious. They (he) used up all of their imagination...

This may be that I want to believe that there is more to this than I realize... kind of like me bringing my own subconscious into the movie, which is what Nolan achieved. Its what all directors are trying to achieve. The beauty of it is, that I haven't felt this way since the Matrix and I'm so stoked that Nolan has got me so excited about my first love all over again...MOVIES, I've been so afraid of the future of film making since Avatar...
Thanks Christopher Nolan...

 

[Everts]

I have to disagree with you on this statement. "The film specifically states"... Where in the movie does it specificaly state? Dialoge, subtext, where?


"Why don't you build them your self", "I Can't, Mal won't let me"... .

Honestly I dont think I or anybody else missed that .This doesnt mean he is not capable of dreaming or creating it's just dangerous for him to create . He's putting the subjects and teammembers that share the dream in danger.
Mal, when she was alive & Cob are the very best and what they do ...and Cob even better because he is keeping a dead person alive in his dreams. So in away he rules *limbo and therefor what ever he believes will be his reality or dream fantasy.

The only thing that is specific is ,Arthur saying specifity is that the correct spelling !?


*Arthur said Cob and Mal were the only one to go there.

Christopher Nolan made a movie that keeps playing in are minds even when its done.