If Nikon fails...

mattsand said:
maybe simply to avoid being taxed as a video camera, which has been suggested and doesn't sound unreasonable.
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No it doesn't...fully believable. You'd think there would be a software switch for those of us who don't face such out-of-touch taxing regulations. They could sneak the switch into EMEA under the radar. :thumbup:
 
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Yeah, what gets me is how Nikon is being all hush-hush.

They should have a two way conversation with their customers, otherwise they will lose them.
 
I agree, Artforme.

We live in a world where two-way communication is now the norm between business and the customer. Nikon needs to get with the times.

Canon's, "You spoke.. and we listened" is a sign that they might be breaking free from the old way of doing things. Nikon needs to respond. Literally.

Nikon will release a camera with full manual controls. We all know this. A hint as to 'when' would be nice.

d.
 
Well they lost me and I've been into nikons since the FM2. It won't be easy topping the MKII but I hope they do.
 
We're not representative of anything though, now are we squig? I bought my first new Nikon in 30 years only because of the Dmovie. Prior to that it was Sony and before that Ikegami. I hope Nikon has gr8 things planned and is even now developing video advances that will astound.

But I fear Nikon might think D90 Dmovie is all a still photographer would ever want. Unless they answer with something soon, they aren't going to be competitive...already, there's much more to it than manual control.

"Must be jello 'cause film and video don't shake like that."
 
That "you spoke and we listened" is just a sales gimmick if you ask me. These are big companies and they decided what they want to do in the end. I'm sure they listen to comments, but they will do what makes them the most money for the stockholders.

Plus I have heard the Japanese have different ways than we do and I have heard for years people complain about Nikon and communications. But they do make good cameras and sometimes we just have to wait on them or jump ship.





Davidonabus said:
I agree, Artforme.

We live in a world where two-way communication is now the norm between business and the customer. Nikon needs to get with the times.

Canon's, "You spoke.. and we listened" is a sign that they might be breaking free from the old way of doing things. Nikon needs to respond. Literally.

Nikon will release a camera with full manual controls. We all know this. A hint as to 'when' would be nice.

d.
Click to expand...
 
We may represent a small minority right now (those that treat the movie mode in the D90 as anything more than a gimmick or a "nice toy").. but the convergence of the photographer and the videographer is real. I'm sure nikon realizes it. The days of the camera only doing stills has come to an end. Just as the days of a video camera only doing motion has come to an end.

Look no further than the Red camera. It's generation one, but already that thing can produce incredible looking stills.. and most consider that to be a motion picture camera. It's happening!

d.
 
I would like to be able to have a still camera that can shoot good video without the side effects we see now. Nikon can make it happen, we just don't know when
 
artforme said:
Yeah, what gets me is how Nikon is being all hush-hush.

They should have a two way conversation with their customers, otherwise they will lose them.
Click to expand...

I think we video enthusiast are taking ourselves way too seriously. We are trying to transform a market that truly belongs to a Photography crowd. There is a war right now between the Manufacturers, and we are allowing ourselves to get caught up in it with our hard earned dollars. Nikon is playing it safe. Their strategy of backwards compatibility has worked and it continues to work. Right now, it seems a lot of the new players are throwing rocks at the market and hoping it sticks e.g Panasonic. Nikon doesn't need to do that since thats not how they operate. My guess is that they will leave the Video aspect as a minimal add-on and focus squarely on what they know how to do best. If you've purchased a Nikon D90, you should really use it for it's true purpose i.e. photography. Trust me. The D90 is one hell of a DSLR for photography. I can show you some of my pictures even though I'm not a professional photographer. I now love photography just as much as video! I tend not to even use my D90 for videos even though the video aspects were one of the most appealing things for my purchase.

What I'm saying is this...Nikon got the photography part of this camera so well that I wondered why I never ventured into photography earlier in my life. A DSLR is a DSLR; it's not a camcorder. A camcorder is a camcorder; it's not a DSLR. Nikon gets this. So leave Nikon alone. If you want a DSLR with great video and decent photography options, you should look at Canon. In regards to Panasonic GH1, poor panasonic, they bit the bulltet to please the crowd. Panasonic doesn't even realize their mistake. They consolidated their prosumer video market base into the DSLR photography market where the likes of Canon, Nikon and the new players like Sony and Pentax can chip away to their delight. However, they are lucky because if there is anything that I have learned from a Video DSLR...is that you still need the form factor of a camcorder in most professional situations in order not to loose the respect of your clients. A video DSLR can only get you so far. I tend to see my Nikon D90 as a more personal device than a professional one. As a result, I am happy with with, and I couldn't ask for more.
 
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Why didn't you buy a D80? As you admit, it was the video that motivated you to purchase the D90. I'm surprised you concluded that the marriage of video and DSLRs hasn't happened. I think it has and there's no going back...a quantum step...an epiphany...something like when we hung up our plumicons and went with chips.
 
mhood said:
Why didn't you buy a D80? As you admit, it was the video that motivated you to purchase the D90. I'm surprised you concluded that the marriage of video and DSLRs hasn't happened. I think it has and there's no going back...a quantum step...an epiphany...something like when we hung up our plumicons and went with chips.
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I'm not really looking at it from a customer point of view but rather from the manufacturers perspective. As a customer, I would go with the Canon 5d if I needed a hybrid camera. However, I am saying we shouldn't take ourselves too seriously when it comes to these hybrid cameras once you're able to see things differently. I believe Canon got it right; they have the right balance of video vs DLSR without offsetting their market for still photography. Nikon dabbled into video but they've shown little interest. Panasonic on the other hand; what were they thinking? I personally wished Panasonic had done the right thing by releasing a HVX with interchangeable lens with a bigger CCD chip, better compression rates and more fps. Thats all we indie filmmakers really needed to gets our hands really dirty instead of getting caught up in Video DSLR war. However, the whole video DSLR will all come to a boil like I have come to realize when I couldn't use my Nikon D90 in a professional environment besides stills. Will I buy another video DSLR just for the sake of shooting video? Hell no! Will I buy another DSLR just for the sake shooting stills? Yes. And if it comes with video, do I mind? Of course not! And If I really need video, what will I most likely use? I will use a dedicated camcorder. With all that said, what do I think about the D90? It is a perfect DSLR by Nikon. I couldn't ask for more.
 
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You are right Mhood. I won't be buying another DSLR for sure except for still photography. My excitement about the video DSLR hype has worn off me. I am really interested in a HVX type camera that has some of the video benefits on these new DSLRs like I have mentioned above. As it stands, the market is being torn into fragments. The interchangeable lens on video DSLR is really appealing to a mid level professional videographer like myself, but it doesn't cut it when you show up to an event carrying a DSLR. The other day I show up to a green screen shoot where we had relied on on HPX500 for the shoot. The owner of the HPX was late, and we were desperate because our allocated time at the greenscreen studio was running out. Well, I decided to whip out my D90 to save the day, but I was wrong. No bars and tone to calibrate the video / computer system they had available for match lighting even though I managed to connect the D90 to the system with a AV to Svideo cable. Moreover, no zebra bars, no easy gamma, color, contrast, brightness control E.T.C. After that day, I got over the video DSLR thing and just enjoyed my DSLR for what it is.
 
Spiro.

You make some decent points.

But.. You mentioned that we, video enthusiasts, are trying to change the market. I'm not a video enthusiast, or at least, I wasn't. My background is photography. I use a Nikon D2X for my photos and I'd love to upgrade to a Nikon D4 with full frame 1080p manual controlled video + stills.

My point is.. the market has changed. It's not just the video enthusiast market that wants Nikon to release something with more control/features. The photography market needs it as well. Why? Because our clients are now demanding it. With the web now multimedia rich, with once static posters now being replaced with giant HD screens, etc. we can no longer satisfy our customer with just the still image. They want the still image AND video.

Nikon, if it wants to keep it's market share, HAS to respond to the changing market place. And it certainly looks like they are/will.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7X8dsUGCUjQ

David
 
Yea Spiro, the thought of trying to drop a D90 into a studio is the stuff of nightmares and cold sweats for sure. I'm surprised your TD tried to shove a square peg into an anamorphic hole. ;-)
 
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Davidonabus said:
Spiro.

You make some decent points.

But.. You mentioned that we, video enthusiasts, are trying to change the market. I'm not a video enthusiast, or at least, I wasn't. My background is photography. I use a Nikon D2X for my photos and I'd love to upgrade to a Nikon D4 with full frame 1080p manual controlled video + stills.

My point is.. the market has changed. It's not just the video enthusiast market that wants Nikon to release something with more control/features. The photography market needs it as well. Why? Because our clients are now demanding it. With the web now multimedia rich, with once static posters now being replaced with giant HD screens, etc. we can no longer satisfy our customer with just the still image. They want the still image AND video.

Nikon, if it wants to keep it's market share, HAS to respond to the changing market place. And it certainly looks like they are/will.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7X8dsUGCUjQ

David
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Thanks for the insight David. That youtube video said a lot. Thats the first time I've seen something like that. Actually, I have been seeing these kind of ads in Airports and such, but I've haven't been paying too much attention to them. These ads seem to surprise me as soon as they move, but I always thought they were web based flash ads on lcds. I had no idea that the photo industry was responsible for them. I can now see why the manufacturers are responding. May be you photographers will push the envelop towards a prosumer type camcorder so that we may blur the lines between photography and video for good. I hope a HVX form factor isn't too big for photography. :laugh:
 
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