C500: I went ahead and did a C500 Fan Noise Quick Video Test - See Vimeo link & talk?

C-Mac

C-Mac

Well-known member
Hey Folks,

I know many of you are very curious, so I went ahead and did a quick video test of the fan noise with the C500.

Stats:
Canon C500 Camera with 70-200mm 2.8 IS V2 @ near 200mm
Sennheiser ME66 Shotgun Mic 12 inches from mouth (I could have had it closer with this frame but felt 12 inches would be a normal distance for us in a more standard framing.)
Subject (myself) is just over 8ft from camera body

You may want to listen to it with headphones. I feel it's pretty noticeable that way, but found it to be much less of an issue on my laptop on Vimeo. I think with a good sound editor and some music it would not be a huge deal at all, but it still sucks that it is this noisy. I feel like a Director sitting next to this camera for the first time, might be a bit surprised.

I am looking forward to attempting a non destructive camera modification like AbelCine provided Mat Porwoll.

See what you think.

https://vimeo.com/188426060

Best Regards,

Chris McGuinness
www.pulsecinema.com
DC, Maryland, Virginia Video Production
 
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Chris, I have been working with many cameras over the years, and this Canon C500 is by far the noisiest one of the bunch (I here from forums the Epic is pretty loud too) :( There are many sound issues going out on location: the fridge, air conditioning, people talking in other rooms, leaf blowers here in LA, the fan on the C500 would now be the main problem in the room for the sound recordist, it is such a shame to only now discover this problem with the c500. I bought a brand new one just two weeks ago! I was so happy to finally get this camera, I opened the box, attached the monitor, then the battery, switched the camera on and was prompted REMOVE THE SDI SIDE COVER ( the camera was set record 4K out of the box) I then removed the side cover, the camera began the whir, the camera was now in standby mode set to 4K, this fan noise confused the heck out of me, was it going to quiet down I said to myself? I fiddled around and hit the record button and presto, the camera went quiet! what a relief. Well now we know that noise will come back on in 7-11 minuets while recording in 2K or 4K, the fan will stay on for two minuets to cool the camera, then turn back off for four minuets, this goes in this cycle till you turn off the camera and for interviews this fan noise is not going to work. I found that Matt Porwoll Blog post about the "Problem Solved" which shows the fan system AbleCine built for him, this little devise will be the last deciding factor for me on whether the C500 stays or goes? The C500 ranks so high in regards it's picture, such a shame it has this noise (fan) problem.
 
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B.Berry said:
Chris, I have been working with many cameras over the years, and this Canon C500 is by far the noisiest one of the bunch (I here from forums the Epic is pretty loud too) :( There are many sound issues going out on location: the fridge, air conditioning, people talking in other rooms, leaf blowers here in LA, the fan on the C500 would now be the main problem in the room for the sound recordist, it is such a shame to only now discover this problem with the c500, I bought a brand new one just two weeks ago! I was so happy to finally get this camera, I opened the box, attached the monitor, then the battery, switched the camera on and was prompted REMOVE THE SDI SIDE COVER ( the camera was set record 4K out of the box) I then removed the side cover, the camera began the whir, the camera was now in standby mode set to 4K, this fan noise confused the heck out of me, was it going to quiet down, I said to myself? I fiddled around and hit the record button and presto, the camera went quiet! what a relief. Well now we know that noise will come back on in 7-11 minuets while recording in 2K or 4K, the fan will stay on for two minuets to cool the camera, then turn back off for four minuets, this goes in this cycle till you turn off the camera and for interviews this fan noise is not going to work. I found that Matt Powel Blog post about the "Problem Solved" which shows the fan system AbleCine built for him, this little devise will be the last deciding factor for me on whether the C500 stays or goes? The C500 ranks so high in regards it's picture, such a shame it has this noise (fan) problem.
Click to expand...

Hey B. Berry,

I have been following the other posts and got my C500 around 8 days ago. I too was shocked by how loud it was and have ordered fans and spoken with Matt Porwoll and mentioned this on one of the other posts. I did this test so people could hear what this sounds like in a real world type setting. I don't think it is the disaster I thought it was going to be and I also believe my sound people could remove this with room tone recorded. I would prefer it not be there and am waiting for my mini computer fans to arrive so that I can try out my own similar fabrication of Matt Porwoll's AbelCine's solution.

I posted in a new feed as I wanted to hear feedback from the greatest amount of people to see how they felt about the fan coming on in this video.

Thank you.

Best Regards,

Chris McGuinness
www.pulsecinema.com
DC, Maryland, Virginia Video Project
 
That's a great example of the fan noise! Thank's for doing this, now everyone can hear how this fan noise sounds.
 
I want to keep the C500, but just having bought this camera brand new I'm not feeling good about taking the C500 out to record any interviews, unless this external fan set up can work and keep the inside of the c500 cool, and at a constant temperature of less than 77* so that the internal fan system doesn't kick in.
 
Thanks so much for the very professional test Chris. On speaker it was hard to hear it. But with headphones, I could definitely hear it in the background or ambient sound.

I used to work as a sound editor and dialogue editor on a doc TV show, so I've dealt with much worse than this fan sound that is audible in the background. All the same, it does bother me as a former sound guy and I certainly wouldn't want to deal with it in my own footage or on my own projects.

You mentioned you were in a room with a wooden floor. In that case, I'm not surprised that it is audible on a boom setup. The mic is going to pickup sound reflecting off the walls, ceiling, and floor as you well know.

By any chance did you try a lapel mic? I think you would get a better result and improved isolation of the voice from that whirring sound in the background.

If you setup the C500 in regular carpeted room (with no wooden/concrete panels, floors, or walls) and at 8-10 feet from the subject, I'm pretty sure that with a lapel mic you would never hear it. Your boom setup would also perform better.
 
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Kinok, I was a sound recordist from 1985-1998 I can tell you that this C500 sound problem, is a problem! Now if you are conducting your own personal interviews and have the extra time in post to try and clean up the noise, I say go for it, but if you are showing up on location charging a nominal fee, and are using the C500 the client is going to be upset when he, or she, hears those fans kick in This is not a problem if you record in MXF, but I bought the C500 to use the 2K and 4K so unless this external fan rig can work and keep the C500 cool, and not go into this blazing fan mode, using the C500 for interviews won't work for me.
 
Sounds a lot like RED ONE, but from my experience RED ONE keeps the fan on when stand by and turns it off while recording.
 
I've only use a RED ONE on a music video, so did not notice, LOL... in theory that is what the Canon is doing... it just only goes silent for a max of 14 or so minutes more frequently 7 minutes and that is in a 70 degree room, so who knows if the room is 80 or 90 degrees.

Best Regards,

Chris McGuinness
www.pulsecinema.com
 
B.Berry, I absolutely agree it is a problem, especially if you cannot control the environment or the sound setup where you are filming.

As I mentioned before, I will be building a fan system to deal with it in cases where I need long takes or don't want the fan coming on every few minutes.

You started in 1985? That makes sense considering your Eclair reference (I have fond memories of shooting on that camera during the 1990s in film school). My own professional sound editing days were in the early 2000s, by which point everything was digital (ProTools). You guys worked in the old analog way, so I respect that. We learned analog sound editing as well in film school, but never had a chance to use it much by the time we got into the industry.
 
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B.Berry said:
I want to keep the C500, but just having bought this camera brand new I'm not feeling good about taking the C500 out to record any interviews, unless this external fan set up can work and keep the inside of the c500 cool, and at a constant temperature of less than 77* so that the internal fan system doesn't kick in.
Click to expand...

I am in the same boat... I don't know if you caught this on the other forum.... I wrote this:

I emailed Matt Porwoll and he was generous enough to get back to me and said this when question on long term experience with C500 modification:

"I unfortunately don't have any long-term feedback on the solution (and in fact haven't used a C500 since - my C300 MKII has done it for me). But I can tell you for the duration of the six week job in the heat of an Indian/Bangladeshi summer, the fan solved all our issues. We were able to conduct interior interviews in the heat without the sound of the modified fans interfering with sound at all."

I am very hopefully that this is a solution that will let me record for 1-1.5 hours at a time without noise...

I am usually not in very hot locations.

Best Regards,

Chris McGuinness
www.pulsecinema.com
 
I started working back in the day of the Ikegami HL 79E, linked to the Sony BVU 110, I dragged that 110 all over Israel, back in 1985! those were great memories :) we used Vega VHF wireless mics, and a Sennheiser 416 shotgun mic, all state of the art back then. Times are a changing.
 
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I sure hope this is the solution, or it's probably going to mean investing more and getting into the C300 MARK II.

"I unfortunately don't have any long-term feedback on the solution (and in fact haven't used a C500 since - my C300 MKII has done it for me). But I can tell you for the duration of the six week job in the heat of an Indian/Bangladeshi summer, the fan solved all our issues. We were able to conduct interior interviews in the heat without the sound of the modified fans interfering with sound at all."

It does sound promising.

India, and Bangladeshi, would be the ultimate test for the C500 and this external fan set up!

I also was told a certain production rigged four of these fan units to four C500 cameras, for a feature just two years ago.

http://mattporwoll.com/problems-solved/
 
DLD said:
On the positive side, Chris's sound check surely looked cinematic.
Click to expand...

Thank you DLD. This is an example of EOS Standard straight out of the box with zero CC. I've been using Canon since the 5Dmkii
revolution and really like the color science. I just shot a TV commercial with my 1Dc and the Director was very happy
with the look... think apple 1984 spot, only we had to do all our shoot in 1 day. �� I really want this C500 fan modification to work as I think there are some advantages to this camera over the c300 mk ii, which is a beautiful camera with clear advantages of its own. Waiting for my fans for the mod is driving me nuts, LOL.

Best Regards,

Chris McGuinness
 
They shot all seasons of Transparent ( at least season 1 and 2) on the C500 so they must of had a workaround on that, it would be great to speak with someone that worked with that production and see what they did to work around the sound issue? Those scenes were very intimate in smaller rooms, on location and in the studio. I sure hope the external fan modification works, like C-Mac I think the C500 does something extra in the picture department with it's older MOJO.
 
B.Berry said:
They shot all seasons of Transparent ( at least season 1 and 2) on the C500 so they must of had a workaround on that, it would be great to speak with someone that worked with that production and see what they did to work around the sound issue? Those scenes were very intimate in smaller rooms, on location and in the studio. I sure hope the external fan modification works, like C-Mac I think the C500 does something extra in the picture department with it's older MOJO.
Click to expand...

I will have to check out Transparent. I really do like the C500 and 1Dc MOJO - Canon MOJO is quite nice... I also believe, correct me if I am wrong, the slow motion of the C500 does not get cropped like the C300 MK II as you get into the HFRs (beyond 60p) not to mention the C500 can do 4k 60p - well for me 4k half raw 60-120 with "my 7Q+", assuming I can get the vacuum end of the unit to quite down, LOL.

Best Regards,

Chris McGuinness
 
I did a little digging around on Transparent, and found this great article, I'll post the full link bellow. It looks like they waited for the camera to cool down at least in the first season of this show.

http://www.studiodaily.com/2014/09/dp-jim-frohna-and-colorist-corinne-bogdanowicz-on-transparent/



What kind of challenges does shooting 4K pose? Does it make you extra-picky about lenses? And did it inspire a different approach to filtering?
As with any digital workflow, there are certain challenges, little gremlins that pop up to mess with you. We learned a lot in the first week of shooting — things like how often the camera needs to cool down before the fans kick in. Or the need to double-check the external recorder, which has no obvious indicator that it's running. Or how to best rig all the batteries, external recorder, etc for the kind of freeform, 360-degree handheld style of shooting that I do, often for 20-minute takes or longer. Perhaps one of the bigger challenges in the overall workflow was the size of the 4K files. It's an adjustment that has to be made in terms of hard-drive space as well as in post, working with the big files.
 
Red 1 didn't have a fan issue, relative to the Epic MX or Scarlet MX (everything is relative). As an owner of not one, but two C500's I can tell you that the solution is: C300 Mk2 for me.
 
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